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View Diary: Democratic Senator To MORE IT Workers: No More Pay For Your Overtime Work (262 comments)

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    •  Clinton, concerning the media, (16+ / 0-)

      was especially conservative.

      An Eleanor, not Franklin, Roosevelt Democrat.

      by Nulwee on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 09:17:53 PM PST

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      •  Well, conservative is one way to describe... (0+ / 0-)

        ...the criminal act of taking shitloads of cash in exchange for supporting, writing, or just voting for particular pieces of legislation.

        Seriously, never attribute to ideology what can be better explained as corruption.

    •  From the European point of view (20+ / 0-)

      Everyone in American politics is "conservative", i.e. right wing.

      FOSI: Full Of Shit Information - Both my sister and I are trivia freaks...

      by Spoc42 on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 06:40:05 AM PST

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    •  How can we find the existing text? (11+ / 0-)

      I cannot tell what language is being changed here.   Is there a place we can read the existing law?    I've been in IT jobs most of my life, and I was a legally exempt employee from the first day.   The company said we were all exempt because of the nature of our jobs.   We all had tech degrees and we were all salaried.    

      I worked really hard and had to get up in the middle of the night often to feed the mainframes.   We got "comp time" but we were expected to use only about half of it.

      That being said, it was in most ways a wonderful job.  Nobody watched over our desks.  We took walks together in the middle of the day.   We came in at 10 AM and nobody even noticed.  Everybody was smart, engaged and motivated.   People who were not performing very well usually got laid off.   It was sad to see this happen, but the company always had made a strong effort to encourage training.   You could do masters level course work and be paid for it.  

      Religion gives men the strength to do what should not be done.

      by bobtmn on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 07:18:13 AM PST

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      •  Good luck. (7+ / 0-)

        We need a different kind of text program to deal with the scattershot revisions, something to merge the different versions so as to produce 1) what the language was, and 2) what the language becomes, with the differences highlighted.  I dealt with such applications during my (many) years working on mainframes, but I'm not aware of such an app for today's world.

        BTW, your story is very familiar.  When I saw the headline, I thought, big deal.  But then I saw that it's written to apply to hourly employees and "salaried" people getting shitty pay.  I was "exempt" and paid quite well.

        I don't doubt that the first thing that will happen is that people will be coerced into working a much longer work week, thus reducing their effective hourly wage.  This bill sucks.

        I am become Man, the destroyer of worlds

        by tle on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 07:39:00 AM PST

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      •  It's not the nature of your job (9+ / 0-)

        it's the fact that you're salaried.

        I don't get paid overtime either, nor do I get comp time. But my schedule is flexible, I get vacation and sick leave. I can pretty much control my hours.

        Restaurants used to put every shift manager on some meager salary, and then schedule them 50-60 hr weeks. I think they've cracked down on that somewhat.

        Salaried workers are supposed to have some control over their hours - so if they need to work extra hours on a project, they can take off some other day. They're also supposed to be more upper level workers.  

        •  I worked in a state agency (0+ / 0-)

          where the work week began on Friday - So, the state would work us overtime as they needed - then force us to take "Flex-time" to adjust so that there would never be overtime.  The work involved child abuse investigations, foster care and juvenile justice.  We often had to respond on cases while on beepers.  State troopers were also on this "Flex" system.  Floridians knew that there were fewer state troopers on the interstates on Thursdays when they would need to "adjust" their hours.  Looking back, the system was really not employee-friendly.

        •  as someone who was also IT years ago... (0+ / 0-)

          it is very easy for us to be "distracted" and lose track of time and work extremely long hours.  i got lost in the software or program or problem and frequently didn't notice until 1am or later.

          also, though, as you pointed out, i was salaried and had good benefits and could have gone home but didn't because i was engrossed in the problem at hand.  i loved what i was doing - to be reduced to an hourly wage would have meant being told to go home when the project was half done, disrupting the mental process it took to unravel that particular problem.

          i am not so sure i object to this - as long as the salaries are commensurate with the job.

          this diary sounds like an overreaction by someone not in the industry.  maybe i'm wrong - after all, it was the mid eighties i was working IT - so things do change in time.

          will reserve judgement, but right now, i don't see this as a great injustice.

          Is GlowNZ back yet?

          by edrie on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 01:45:40 PM PST

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          •  Have you ever worked helpdesk? (0+ / 0-)

            That's a very UNfun place to be in IT and it is usually hourly with OT. This bill would make those folks want to kill themselves even more (they have a high suicide rate, I kid you not.)

            •  i can believe it - we didn't have "help desks" in (0+ / 0-)

              my day - we had clients call us to come out and "fix" the problem.  i worked for wang labs as a software consultant (and was also the system admin for the syosset office for over a year).  it was just ibm, dec and wang at the time - each company ran architect dependent software... and charged a HUGE fortune for yearly equipment and software maintenance.  wang ended as did dec when the pc was introduced and it was cheaper for companies to throw out a pc and buy a new one rather than paying the exorbitant maintenance contracts.

              back in my day, the companies were at the mercy of the computer companies.  now, with the pc, it's changed... with open source software, non-architech dependent software, apps, etc., the proliferation of hand helds - it's a totally different world out there.

              i can only imagine the abuse the help desk folk take - especially when there is a very frustrated customer and a hard to find problem....  i always try to caveat at the very beginning of the conversation that i am NOT upset with them, but i am frustrated at the lack of a solution to the problem.  most get it - a few still take any complaint about non-working software, billings, etc. as personal affronts.

              that's too bad... it puts a whole nuther dynamic into the equation.

              Is GlowNZ back yet?

              by edrie on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 11:15:18 PM PST

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      •  The existing text is under the 1st horizontal line (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        cville townie, kurt

        There is a link to the Fair Labor Standards Act so you can read if at the source. But the affected section is 213, which is reprinted in the original post, that indicates employees whose positions are legally defined as "an employee in a professional capacity" are exempt from overtime pay.

        What that means is that if your current IT job pays you for your overtime hours and you make at least $27.63 per hour or $23,600 per year, your employer could stop paying you for your overtime hours by law if this passes.

        •  So here it is: (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          James Kresnik


          (17) any employee who is a computer systems analyst, computer programmer, software engineer, or other similarly skilled worker, whose primary duty is—
          (A) the application of systems analysis techniques and procedures, including consulting with users, to determine hardware, software, or system functional specifications;
          (B) the design, development, documentation, analysis, creation, testing, or modification of computer systems or programs, including prototypes, based on and related to user or system design specifications;
          (C) the design, documentation, testing, creation, or modification of computer programs related to machine operating systems; or
          (D) a combination of duties described in subparagraphs (A), (B), and (C) the performance of which requires the same level of skills, and
          who, in the case of an employee who is compensated on an hourly basis, is compensated at a rate of not less than $27.63 an hour.


          (17) any employee working in a computer or information technology occupation (including, but not limited to, work related to computers, information systems, components, networks, software, hardware, databases, security, internet, intranet, or websites) as an analyst, programmer, engineer, designer, developer, administrator, or other similarly skilled worker, whose primary duty is--
          ‘(A) the application of systems, network or database analysis techniques and procedures, including consulting with users, to determine or modify hardware, software, network, database, or system functional specifications;
          ‘(B) the design, development, documentation, analysis, creation, testing, securing, configuration, integration, debugging, modification of computer or information technology, or enabling continuity of systems and applications;
          ‘(C) directing the work of individuals performing duties described in subparagraph (A) or (B), including training such individuals or leading teams performing such duties; or
          ‘(D) a combination of duties described in subparagraphs (A), (B), and (C), the performance of which requires the same level of skill;
          who is compensated at an hourly rate of not less than $27.63 an hour or who is paid on a salary basis at a salary level as set forth by the Department of Labor in part 541 of title 29, Code of Federal Regulations. An employee described in this paragraph shall be considered an employee in a professional capacity pursuant to paragraph (1).’.

          Religion gives men the strength to do what should not be done.

          by bobtmn on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 12:21:54 PM PST

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        •  What's cute is that the $23600/yr (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          or $455 per week translates to an hourly wage of $11.35 at 40 hours/wk. Not $27.63 (which would be an annual salary of nearly $60k). $11.35. I bet a large number of people fall between those marks. Even at an average of 30 hours/wk, anyone earning over $15/hr would be exempt, though I would expect many people working part time to be on a wage basis instead of salary.

          Somehow I'm really scratching my head at the wage value in the legislation, because the salary cutoff is so much lower it's not funny.

    •  Imagine our dismay in NJ when last summer, the (5+ / 0-)

      Democratic President of the State Senate (and an official in the Ironworkers Union, for good measure) collaborated with Governor Chris Christie on removing public employees health benefits from collective bargaining and ending the Cost of Living increases on former public workers pensions.   He then enlisted the help of Essex County Democrats in a slimy deal to get this through the Assembly (with the help of all the Republicans) just so the son of a former Democratic powerbroker in Essex County could get his own public TV station (the former NJ Network).  That was when public employees in NJ realized that they could no longer put their trust in the Democratic Party in NJ as the corrupt South Jersey and Essex County machines would sell them out to feather their own nests.  It is not necessarily conservatism, but also corruption and pursuit of personal financial gain that motivates Democrats in NJ.

      And it feels like I'm livin'in the wasteland of the free ~ Iris DeMent, 1996

      by MrJersey on Mon Dec 12, 2011 at 10:19:21 AM PST

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