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View Diary: Well DUH, Morons (156 comments)

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  •  wait...WHAT??? I heard the same thing... (3+ / 0-)
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    zhimbo, maybeeso in michigan, Val

    and as a musician (and someone who as always loved math)

    I got none of this out of the story.  What I got out of it was that most math teachers use the same rote tools to teach fractions, and that music seemed to be more effective in this one case study.  NO, it's not novel--we musicians know full well that rhythm is all about fractions.  But it doesn't show up in the curriculum.

    Nowhere in the report did I see that as a tool to supplant music classes with this--I saw it as simply a way to encourage new ways of processing fractions.  

    And I'm not sure where you see a 'corporate scheme' to run music out of the system...

    Look--the fact that the arts are on the chopping block is a huge problem in itself---but I didn't see ANY of what you're claiming in  that report.  

    •  Read the Examiner article. It states that this (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Black Max, mapamp, uciguy30, Loge

      is to be sold as a package to non music teachers.

      "No music teacher is needed"

      "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." --M. L. King "You can't fix stupid" --Ron White -6.00, -5.18

      by zenbassoon on Sun Apr 08, 2012 at 09:26:31 AM PDT

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      •  you're reading too much into it. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        elfling, Val

        obviously if you're going to be teaching MUSIC you need a music teacher.  But if notation actually helps kids process fractions more effectively, then so what if some professor happens to develop a package?  And to be honest--a math teacher isn't going to invite a music teacher into the classroom for the fraction unit.  

        If your claim that they're doing  this in order to phase out music instruction is accurate, well that's a different story--but I see absolutely nothing about that (aside from the  obvious concerns about arts slashing due to budget cuts)

        Obviously, it would be ideal if the  music curriculum were designed at least partially in sync with this sort of thing so that students know what 'notes' actually are before incorporating them into math class--that would be ideal.

        But you're attributing sinister motives here--and I really don't see them.

        One reason may be that I teach or a for-profit afterschool program in Sci/Tech (Lego Robotics)--the kids love it.  Yes, it's a company--but it's supplementing--not s upplanting--science programs already in the school.

        I mean--having a San Francisco State prof develop a curriculum is hardly like having IBM write the curriculum for you.  I do agree that the line 'no music teacher is necessary' is a bit ridiculous--but the idea is still that this is something effective that math teachers can use.

        •  When the schools buy this package and fire the (7+ / 0-)

          music teachers, you can come back and say how wrong you were.

          I've seen this happen before. Maybe the diarist is reading a good bit between the lines, but he/she is right to sound the alarm. This is where this goes time and time again.

          Occupy Wall Street. Occupy Main Street. Occupy everything. Force a tsunami of change on the nation.

          by Black Max on Sun Apr 08, 2012 at 10:02:04 AM PDT

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          •  that's a miserable outlook. (0+ / 0-)

            Sad that because of the politics of the day people immediately assume the worst out of what actually MIGHT be intended as a creative learning package.

            I mean--if I were an academic and developed a tool for geometry that included stencils and that old toy, Spirograph, and found that it helped students to understand and actually enjoy geometry, I'd hate to think I'd be reprimanded by people here for being a corporate stooge running all art classes out of schools.

            That's exactly what you're doing.

            The negativity here is appalling sometimes.  There's no 'alarm' to be sounded here.

          •  I don't think they'll fire the music teachers (0+ / 0-)

            because of this.

            Indeed, if they are successful, they might hire more music because of this.

            That is, if they have any money to do so. Which they don't.

            Music teachers aren't getting fired because administrators don't value them. They're getting fired because administrators have to choose in their budget between teaching music and teaching 4th grade.

            Fry, don't be a hero! It's not covered by our health plan!

            by elfling on Sun Apr 08, 2012 at 02:25:18 PM PDT

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            •  They have the money. They lie about the money. (1+ / 0-)
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              Sad and hateful, but true.

              Occupy Wall Street. Occupy Main Street. Occupy everything. Force a tsunami of change on the nation.

              by Black Max on Sun Apr 08, 2012 at 04:28:09 PM PDT

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              •  It's not true (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:

                At least, not in our district. I am painfully familiar with it.

                District budgets are public documents. You are entitled to attend board meetings where they are discussed and you're entitled to a copy of it. It's true that in very large districts the money is harder to follow.

                It may be the case that in your district they lie. And that the auditor lies. But every district is different; they are not universal. Many districts have even kept music, usually because the community has added fundraising to keep it.

                In our district, we have the additional problem of being small and rural, so that even when we had money for music, it was not enough for a full time credentialed position. We address this by hiring staff members who are interested in music and using it in lessons and we've creatively addressed it by building an afterschool program which can hire a local professional to come in once a week to teach music at no cost to the kids.

                Budgets have been cut and cut and cut, and the state wants to cut more again next year.

                Fry, don't be a hero! It's not covered by our health plan!

                by elfling on Sun Apr 08, 2012 at 10:03:53 PM PDT

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