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View Diary: Wall Street hires violent union busting Pinkerton's to save them from OWS. History repeats itself (256 comments)

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  •  No more drum circles and peace signs (7+ / 17-)

    Oh really? Pinkerton?
    Well OWS, now we know what has to be done.
    This is a PRIVATE security firm, they're NOT POLICE OFFICERS, so much as I abhor violence, the fact is, if your Grandpa is still alive and if he was a union man, chances are he has some Pinkerton stories that will curdle your BLOOD COLD.

    If your Great Grandpa was still alive and a union man I guarantee you he probably got his head busted by a Pinkerton man.

    And I guarantee you one more thing. Both your Grandpa and your Great Grandpa would tell you, "don't let em get away with it again, hit em before they hit you and hit em fuckin HARD."

    Yep, you heard me right, don't come to an OWS event patrolled by Pinkerton unless you are prepared to do some serious ass kicking yourself. This is NO LONGER a place for DRUM CIRCLES and PEACE SIGNS.

    Pinkerton has already established throughout history that they enjoy hurting people seriously, even KILLING them.

    They're NOT police officers, they're just overgrown bar bouncers. Fight dirty, fight hard, use the element of surprise and don't stop hitting till they start running and when they run, chase them down and FUCK THEIR SHIT UP SERIOUSLY.

    Because if you don't, I guarantee you they'll fuck up your shit in ways you will never forget for the rest of your lives.

    This shit just got real.

    •  That might have worked (26+ / 0-)

      back in the day, but the Department of Homeland Security provides military-grade weapons and funding to the states. They pass it on to police. Yes, it's real.

      So if it's violence rules, The People lose.

      Period.

      "Let each unique song be sung and the spell of differentiation be broken" - Winter Rabbit

      by cotterperson on Thu May 03, 2012 at 06:44:02 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Mil grade weaponry isn't hard to have. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        IndieGuy, No one gets out alive

        Jeez, military grade ammo is MUCH smaller than what grandpa would use in the old hunting rifle back in the fifties.

        The standard 1911 pistol in 45acp caliber is military grade. DHS just ordered 450 million rounds of the smaller 40s&w caliber, so that is also by definition military grade. Pick up a used pistol that shoots military grade ammo for under five hundred bucks.

        As far as gear, the old saying goes that you fear a farmer with his trusty scythe just as much as you fear a soldier with his trained sword - and you maybe bet on the farmer because he's put that scythe to serious use while the soldier's training is half holding back. You know, training with a wooden sword or with pads tied over the blade, while the farmer daily swings his scythe with no training wheels.

        Where the militarized police and the military itself has the edge, is in the information/intelligence arena, and the permission to escalate from zero violence to bodies on the ground in the blink of an eye. That permission, granted to The Badge by the majority of the population, is what is truly powerful. The rest of it is just gadgets. Lethal, painful, but still just gadgets.

        •  They would be so stupid to be violent (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          OleHippieChick

          It would push many, many Americans over the edge with the 1%. Remember Kent State?? Kids still learn about it. The wealthy and powerful are suffering from some very serious hubris if they think violence is effective nowadays. It is not. They would anger more people than they would scare.

          Never forget that Americans all come from people who had the guts to up and leave another country and make their way across an ocean to a whole new world. That is what makes us different from other peoples, in good and bad ways. A good way is that we do NOT like to be pushed around. If there were violence, I can imagine strikes, work-outs, lots of pushback. I pray these 1%ers are not stupid enough to think Americans would smile on this.

          My dog is a member of Dogs Against Romney: He rides inside.

          by adigal on Fri May 04, 2012 at 08:55:28 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Even more recent than 1776 (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Pale Jenova, OleHippieChick

            I have been getting more and more familiar with the largest labor uprising ever in this country, large enough that the president actually deployed the military inside our borders to put it down.

            Matewan, where the robber barons had the balls to openly assassinate a union leader on the steps of a courthouse, in the middle of the day, and got away with it.

            A very telling bit about the general mood of the oppressed - they had spent years trying to effect change through the vote and through the courts, and the power of the robber barons' gold defeated the people at every turn. So, eventually a few thousand pissed off men picked up their guns - some of which were full auto machine guns brought home from their time in the army, and went to step four:
            Use boxes in this order:
            1 Soap
            2 Ballot
            3 Jury
            4 Bullet
            The unions spent all their cash reserves on bringing in volunteers from across several states, and buying arms and ammo for the striking miners who had been forced to see their families starved, beaten and killed for the "sin" of joining a union. All told, more than ten thousand armed men fought against private 'detective' companies for the right to unionize.

            That was 1920-1921. The coal wars / mine wars / battle of blair mountain.

          •  I agree with much of what you're saying (0+ / 0-)

            but I'd point out that not all Americans came here from another country. There are still a lot of people who's families were here before Columbus sailed the ocean blue.

            There revolution will not be televised. But it will be blogged, a lot. Probably more so than is necessary.

            by AoT on Fri May 04, 2012 at 07:17:36 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Re: They would be so stupid to be violent (0+ / 0-)

            Agreed but they will be.

            The important thing is, OWS cannot be seen as warriors or soldiers, because the truth is, they're working people, and that's what America needs to see when Pinkerton moves in on them.

      •  DHS needs to be dismantled. (4+ / 0-)

        Monopolies are bad because, in the long run, they are ineffective.  They insist on routine behavior because routine is the only thing they can deal with. The variable throws them off kilter. Nature is variable, as are the majority of humans.  So, monopolies only serve a very small percentage. Human creatures of habit are a subset and there's not enough of them to go around.

        People to Wall Street: "LET OUR MONEY GO"

        by hannah on Fri May 04, 2012 at 04:33:20 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Uprated for HR abuse n/t (4+ / 0-)

        Where are all the jobs, Boehner?

        by Dirtandiron on Fri May 04, 2012 at 05:41:24 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Historically what was said (0+ / 0-)

        is true. School, at least in my day did not teach about the union movement in history. Most of what I learned came from those who experienced it first hand. There was a great deal of death and damage most of that was caused by armed thugs employed by large companies. There are many who do not know how truly awful it was and how deadly the fight for labor unions got. They need to know.

        People who defended themselves or who fought back went to jail for years often only to get out and do it all again. Some met with the death penalty.

        We have already seen that they are capable of violence and I think to a certain extent we must proceed with our eyes open about how bad it can truly get. History can give us some clues about what we need to be prepared for.

        Knowledge is power and there are many ways to fight them without ever resorting to violence.

        It is the heart that makes a man rich. He is rich according to what he is not what he has -Henry Ward Beecher

        by PSWaterspirit on Fri May 04, 2012 at 08:35:38 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  No (19+ / 0-)

      Gandhi freed a country through non-violent resistance against the rifles and truncheons of the most powerful empire on the planet.  Surely we can free this country with non-violent resistance against the pepper spray of wallstreet rentacops.

    •  And as a private citizen they are (6+ / 0-)

      sue-able.  

      David Koch is fucking Longshanks, and Occupy is the real Braveheart.

      by PsychoSavannah on Thu May 03, 2012 at 08:23:39 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Yes, Pinkerton actions ARE... (0+ / 0-)

        ...most definitely legally actionable, so I also hope that there will be plenty of lawyers who will see this as an opportunity to leverage class action lawsuits against them.

    •  read up on the Battle of Homestead (10+ / 0-)

      If you read the link in the diary above, you'll see that strikers did exactly what you suggest at the Battle of Homestead.  And they won the battle, the Pinkertons surrendered, and got beaten up pretty good as well.  And as a result, the workers lost the strike.  

      Because once we turn violent, they win.

      No need to change the rules of engagement here for a peaceful protest.  The private police should be treated with the same respect OWS protesters have generally been treating the public police.  

      Keep in mind though, peaceful protesters today do have one modern weapon they can arm themselves with, which those strikers back in 1892 didn't have access to; cheap pocket sized video cameras (often those on smartphones).    

      No one knows who fired the first shots at Homestead.  That needn't be the case today.  So yes, arm yourselves; with cameras.  Stand your ground.  Be respectful.  And don't let them get away with anything.

    •  I See Your State of Mind, But Just A Daydream (5+ / 0-)

      ... kinda the thoughts you might want to keep to yourself, at least until thought-crime is prosecutable.  The ass-kissing fascist worshiping news media will line up right behind them against you along with most of the public whether you're in a coffin with your family standing in tears, in the ICU beaten to a pulp or shot, or 'just' in jail.

      Goons, being true to the nature of goons, are looking for that exact response to justify the response they long to dish out in their wet dreams.  What drives a person to even want to be a private thug?  Probably more often than not some policeman wannabee loser who either couldn't make the grade or was too bat shit crazy with an attitude and a desire to kick some ass?  

      Had there been any proven attack by the Kent State protesters prior to their being gunned down, their cause would be lost.  Look what's happened with Zimmerman/Martin case in Florida and think about if the kid had so much as a pocket knife on him.

    •  HR for inciting violence. (0+ / 0-)
    •  DFVS, thanks for "coming out of the closet", who (0+ / 0-)

      knew?  Your time would be better spent checking out how Pinkerton acted as hired guns for corporate interests during the Great Depression.

      •  Are you nuts? (0+ / 0-)

        That is exactly what I am talking about!
        Our grandfathers would be turning in their graves if they knew we had allowed it to come to this, allowed it to come to dealing with Pinkerton men all over again.

        They fought, bled and died in the hope that it would never happen again.

        Maybe try a remedial reading course, Focault.
        I specifically referenced Pinkerton acting as hired goons for corporate interests, and I cited it in historical terms.

        Maybe you're reading a blog in some alternate universe?

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