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View Diary: Wall Street Journal - "Obama spending binge never happened" (118 comments)

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  •  I wish. (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jm214, RFK Lives, caul, toosinbeymen

    No, I think the implication of this is that on economics, our options in November will be limited to Dumb and Dumber.

    I'm voting for Dumb. It could be worse.

    "The true strength of our nation comes not from the might of our arms or the scale of our wealth, but from the enduring power of our ideals." - Barack Obama

    by HeyMikey on Tue May 22, 2012 at 04:55:46 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  No. Our options are forward or backward. (17+ / 0-)

      Sorry but I don't find your comparative naming apt or funny.

      •  I don't see the forward option. (8+ / 0-)

        I just see the "keep Republicans from appointing more justices" option.

        •  So I guess you think killing medicare, (12+ / 0-)

          gutting Social Security, bombing Iran (or the flavorite of the day), profiteering from risk at the public's expense, denying women basic rights, keeping DOMA and overturning Obamacare is a good thing?

          Okay, then. Carry on.

          •  I expect Obama to try to gut social (6+ / 0-)

            security.  That's not really a debate over the direction we should take, but more of a prediction of the course he will take based on known facts.  

            Funny you should bring up social security.  Bad choice of words if you want to keep us supporting Obama.  I remember when Bush was president and he tried to gut social security, and all the Democrats in Congress stood up to him and said no.  I don't think ALL the Democrats in Congress will stand up and say no to Obama if/when he decides to compromise it away again.  In that sense, then, Social Security might have been safer under Bush than it is under Obama.  Twisted but true.

            As for rolling back Obamacare... I remember when it was called Romneycare.  And before that, it was called Dole-acare.  Republicans only oppose it because it came from Obama, not because it's socialism.  If it were, they wouldn't have been pushing for Obamacare for so many years.

            The Republican-dominated Supreme Court, however, seems to have already sharpened their knives to kill Obamacare, so we'll see if there's anything to protect, soon.  Probably not.  In which case, the only way we'll get Romneycare is if Romney passes it under a different name, I guess.

            The only thing that I can glean from all this is that we're better off with Obama so he can appoint more supreme court justices.  There hasn't been much else I can point to with any confidence.  

          •  Those are the reasons I'm voting Obama/Dem. (10+ / 0-)

            In a lot of ways, Obama and the Dems are clearly better than Romney and the GOP. But on economics...yeah, I'm sticking with Dumb and Dumber.

            I'm with Krugman and Stiglitz: we need a lot more stimulus, immediately. If Obama and the Dems had listened to them in early '09, the economy would've been better by November 2010, and we might still control the House and still have 60 votes in the Senate. Not to mention, a few million more people would now have jobs.

            "The true strength of our nation comes not from the might of our arms or the scale of our wealth, but from the enduring power of our ideals." - Barack Obama

            by HeyMikey on Tue May 22, 2012 at 06:23:06 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  I couldn't agree more but its Congress (10+ / 0-)

              that has to do that, the President cannot do that on his (or her) own.

              •  Yep. But... (3+ / 0-)

                They should've seen this coming when they had 60 votes in the Senate. They should've had a train of legislation loaded up and ready to go. They didn't.

                Anybody paying attention should've seen that 2009-10 could turn into 1993-94 deja vu. We were warned.

                "The true strength of our nation comes not from the might of our arms or the scale of our wealth, but from the enduring power of our ideals." - Barack Obama

                by HeyMikey on Wed May 23, 2012 at 07:43:16 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

              •  He has to want to do it. (0+ / 0-)

                You say that as if you know in your heart that Obama wants to.  However, look at the people that he chose for his economic team.  Listen to what they say.  They have said from the beginning that reducing the deficit would create "confidence in the market" that would fix the economy.  These are the same words, by the way, that the EU austerity economists have used for their disastrous choices -- that the "confidence fairy," as Atrios terms it, is going to fix things even when there's not enough demand.  This kind of flawed thinking comes from a core values belief in the investor class, the kind of belief that's easily reinforced by activities like political fundraisers and mooch-a-thons.

                That's how the EU got to this point.  That's why Obama didn't do what he should have.  The Republican Congress wasn't the problem.

            •  The dumb and dumber in all this is the American (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              HeyMikey, JBL55, sockpuppet

              Voter who waited two years, stamped their moronic feet when things did not improve and swung the house to the GOP.  

              •  See my response to NewDealer.... (5+ / 0-)

                The idiotic US voter, with an attention span of 5 minutes, was a known problem. You have to seize your rare opportunities when you get them, because they won't last long.

                Obama and the Dems should've known they were in a sprint, but they behaved like it was a marathon.

                "The true strength of our nation comes not from the might of our arms or the scale of our wealth, but from the enduring power of our ideals." - Barack Obama

                by HeyMikey on Wed May 23, 2012 at 07:45:30 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  I can't disagree with your point but at the end of (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  HeyMikey, sockpuppet

                  the day, things will never improve unless the electorate gets just a little smarter.  I am not holding my breathe.

                  •  I mostly agree. (3+ / 0-)

                    American voters: "The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity." Major problem. #1 problem.

                    BUT--even so, once every decade or three the planets align and the Dems get enough power to really do something.

                    The Dems should know their opportunities will be rare. They should be ready to pounce on them. In 2009-10, they weren't ready enough.

                    Yes, I give them credit for the stimulus, and healthcare reform, and student loan reform, and some other things. In most times, this would be a stellar record. But our times are extraordinary; the times demanded more; the Dems could see that, yet could not pull it together to deliver what we needed.

                    And yes, I'll vote for them anyway, because the alternative is even worse.

                    "The true strength of our nation comes not from the might of our arms or the scale of our wealth, but from the enduring power of our ideals." - Barack Obama

                    by HeyMikey on Wed May 23, 2012 at 09:40:43 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                •  Mikey, I think they did seize their opportunity, (0+ / 0-)

                  and they did exactly what they wanted.  The flaw here is in thinking that they were thwarted.  

          •  "Not backward" is not really the same thing (4+ / 0-)

            as "Forward".

            Non enim propter gloriam, diuicias aut honores pugnamus set propter libertatem solummodo quam Nemo bonus nisi simul cum vita amittit. -Declaration of Arbroath

            by Robobagpiper on Wed May 23, 2012 at 04:57:11 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  We have a choice between sideways and backwards (13+ / 0-)

        U3/U6 levels that were once deemed intolerable are the new normal.  Obama's economic policies being compared to those of Hoover's (not a new concept) isn't something to be proud of.  Yes, things would be much worse under Romney, but there's little reason to expect much improvement in a 2d Obama term.

        Some men see things as they are and ask why. I dream of things that never were and ask why not?

        by RFK Lives on Tue May 22, 2012 at 05:41:46 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Yep. NT (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          RFK Lives

          "The true strength of our nation comes not from the might of our arms or the scale of our wealth, but from the enduring power of our ideals." - Barack Obama

          by HeyMikey on Tue May 22, 2012 at 06:24:27 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  I tend to agree sort of. We needed a bigger (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          sockpuppet

          stimulus and a second round. That much is pretty obvious. That said, the economy will accelerate during the 2nd term for obvious reasons....business is just better than it ever has been in terms of efficiency both in investment (no flaming here, I know it could be much better) and figuring out how to profit. Combined with likely declining energy costs and the numbers are likely to look "pretty good" Unfortunately, this will hide / gloss over some big underlying problems. I don't think this will help as much as it could with income inequality and will leave much on the table in terms of potential full employment and capacity. Further, it will do nothing about addressing underlying issues like improved education, the need for higher infrastructure and R&D spending (Reps will continue to "starve the beast" despite a general consensus about the need to sustain or expand spending on those areas. Gotta sabotage everything to get power) and addressing the needs of the very poor. In other words, the lack of demand / Keynesian stimulus is preventing a much better outcome.
          We can do a lot better and Obama hasn't been able to do what needs to be done for whatever reason. I think it's pretty obvious our system is broken and the Reps are unhinged. I also think Obama hasn't been aggressive enough.
          Contrary to popular opinion, Hoover didn't do nothing about the economy / Depression. He was much better than that, he just didn't do enough compared to Roosevelt (and he didn't say the right stuff, which actually matters to some extent) Obama, considering the politics, is similar.
          As for Romney, who knows what he will do. If he does what he is currently saying, it will be a disaster. The Ryan budget is a prescription for a major recession / depression.
          Its possible he could reverse course and ask for stimulus / new taxes / health care reform (assuming ACA is struck down) etc. He could ask for these things and unlike Obama, congress would comply. It sucks, but its true. Unfortunately, I don't think that is likely. In the unlikely event that he wins, look to his time in Massachusetts minus Romneycare and that is what you are likely to get, or worse. More likely, he will be beholden to the Raging Billionaires / business cronies who will have put him in office, and will try to carry their water to the huge detriment of the country.  

        •  I'm voting for sideways. I especially liked the (0+ / 0-)

          part when Miles helps Jack get his wallet back.

          We must use what we have
          to build what we need. -Adrienne Rich

          by Xapulin on Wed May 23, 2012 at 07:22:43 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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