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View Diary: UPDATED: Why Republicans Lie - Must Read from Rick Perlstein on the Conservative Con Game (178 comments)

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  •  Actually, it's still at work ... (24+ / 0-)

    overheard a long conversation yesterday with an Air Force vet who brought it up while waiting in line to vote.

    Fortunately, my friend whose son is in the military was well versed in the story and engaged the Air Force guy. I will never know how he voted, but the handling of Benghazi was at the top of his mind.

    Even though the story is no longer alive in the media, the worm is loose and still making its way into people's decision making process.

    "Let us not look back to the past with anger, nor towards the future with fear, but look around with awareness." James Thurber

    by annan on Sun Nov 04, 2012 at 09:03:27 AM PST

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    •  Each of us - can make a difference in educating. (5+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      xaxnar, annan, boofdah, George3, FarWestGirl
    •  Have you heard this one? (6+ / 0-)

      Someone I know recently surprised me as a possible Romney voter. His grounds for voting against Obama? "Obama wants to dismantle the military."

      I'm not sure where that comes from, but apparently it's some common idea discussed by military folk. I thought it might relate to the GOP blaming Obama when they didn't meet the deadline for budget reform. Across the Board automatic cuts somehow became "dismantling the military". However, the accusation seemed more focused than a reference to the automatic cuts. Is there a "scare mail" out there saying Obama intends to dismantle the military?

      Le nirvane n'existe pas. - Etienne Lamotte

      by breakingranks on Sun Nov 04, 2012 at 01:59:46 PM PST

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      •  Lots of them (6+ / 0-)

        They've been trying paint Obama as anti-military all along. But most of this talk comes out of the mandatory cuts to the Pentagon (and the rest of the government) that came out of the House REPUBLICAN determination to wreck the budget process if they didn't get what they wanted. They've created a 'fiscal cliff' as yet one more excuse to slash government.

        Obama is to blame for this - by Republican logic - because he failed to cave in to their demands. They want to keep the Bush tax cuts for the rich, and cut social spending.

        But... the crisis is artificial, and can be waved away any time Congress can get its act together long enough to craft a real budget. The crisis will disappear all by itself pretty much even if Congress does nothing - the Bush tax cuts will expire and that will do a lot to close the revenue gap. Obama would like to keep the cuts for the middle class and let the rich go hang. The REPUBLICANS refused to go along.

        But in any case, closing the budget gap now while the economy is still recovering is the worst time to do it - if ever. And, rebuilding after Hurricane Sandy demands lots of government spending - which will act like a stimulus even as it helps get the economy moving again.

        "No special skill, no standard attitude, no technology, and no organization - no matter how valuable - can safely replace thought itself."

        by xaxnar on Sun Nov 04, 2012 at 02:43:19 PM PST

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        •  I tried to explain about the mandatory cuts (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          xaxnar, George3

          But my explanation - particularly the part about the GOP creating the "crisis" by refusing to compromise - did not sink in.

          In fact, the guy I was talking to seemed really stuck on a script. And he's not totally surrounded by wingnuts: he has progressive friends. But he also has friends in the military, and he seemed to take this one point as an article of faith. That's why it seemed to me there was some very specific messaging to create an imminent threat of Obama dismantling the military.

          Hurricane Sandy may create another trap. The midday open thread referred to this article about how disaster relief could get hijacked by private developers. Republicans will rush in to grab the goodies (like Michelle Bachmann trying to grab her bridge project), but then turn around and blame the Democrats for Big Spending.

          Le nirvane n'existe pas. - Etienne Lamotte

          by breakingranks on Sun Nov 04, 2012 at 02:53:15 PM PST

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          •  You can't fight lies with facts (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            xaxnar, 417els, breakingranks, rmx2630

            It is important to remember that these people did not arrive at their conclusions by looking at facts or reasoning about them.  It is not an exaggeration to say many of them have been essentially brainwashed.  

            Fighting back against this approach requires deprogramming, not reasoned debate.

            I mention this elsewhere in a comment in this diary, but "The Political Brain" by Drew Westen does an excellent job of explaining how the right wing uses fear (and other emotional responses) to program their followers.  I think it is an absolute must read -- we need to understand how the right wing is manipulating people -- and we need to fight back in a way that will be effective.  Facts won't work.

            Link to Drew Westen's site: http://www.thepoliticalbrain.com/...

            •  Interesting (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              xaxnar

              I noticed it has been endorsed by Howard Dean.

              “Drew Westen is a must read and must hear for any Democrat… In 2008 we will win the presidency if our candidate reads and acts on this book.”

              —Howard Dean, Chairman, Democratic Party

              "But all in all, it's been a fabulous year for Laura and me." - bush summing up his first year in office, 3 months after 9/11, Washington, D.C., Dec. 20, 2001

              by rmx2630 on Sun Nov 04, 2012 at 10:53:39 PM PST

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    •  Today I saw this tweet by digby: (7+ / 0-)
      digby ‏@digby56

      Last night I overheard someone say,"It's not like the Democrats could ever win a real election -- w/o women and blacks they've got nothing"

      Unbelievable.

      Demagogue: one who preaches doctrines he knows to be untrue to men he knows to be idiots.--H. L. Mencken

      by Ice Blue on Sun Nov 04, 2012 at 04:39:19 PM PST

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