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View Diary: I can no longer wholeheartedly support Israel (243 comments)

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  •  Will HR for racist statement. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    gustynpip, poco, Karl Rover

    "The Palestinians are as a whole 'not very likeable', having embraced terror and a culture of death and hate" blah blah blah.  

    as a german myself, your comment is very offensive.

    Romney in a landslide!

    by jj24 on Mon Nov 19, 2012 at 03:40:02 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  Why are you being a hypocrite, jj24? (3+ / 0-)

      Upthread you say

      so discuss the diary, quit the fucking HR'ing, man/woman-up.
      Yet you HR this comment.

      If you're really "having an anti-censorship day", why not have it in all directions? Lead by example, engage Zygoat in some back and forth debate instead of rushing to HR.

      I think you're just angry at one side, and looking for someone to punch, so you're behaving inconsistently.

      I am not saying that you can't rationalize this particular HR. I'm saying, if you preach debate over HRing, then debate is always better than HRing, even when you're already het up against one side of the debate.

      "Every man has a right to utter what he thinks truth" Samuel Johnson

      by Brecht on Mon Nov 19, 2012 at 03:53:37 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  i'm against HRing an idea. I HR'd for racist BS. (0+ / 0-)

        why don't you know the difference?  i mean, do you really not get it or are you just being a jerk?

        Romney in a landslide!

        by jj24 on Mon Nov 19, 2012 at 03:56:52 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  oh - and i actually didn't HR it, just said (0+ / 0-)

          it was worthy of it.  and it is, i think i just changed my mind and will move forward with the HR.  Thanks!

          Romney in a landslide!

          by jj24 on Mon Nov 19, 2012 at 03:57:58 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I do not understand your lying games, jj24: (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            volleyboy1, mahakali overdrive

            You did HR Zygoat's comment. I never would have written my comment otherwise.

            It looks like you retracted your HR, then changed your mind again and put it back, and also decided to accuse me falsely of something that makes no sense at all.

            You even left the evidence: at 3:56 you said I HR'd for racist BS.

            At 3:57 you said and i actually didn't HR it

            I am neither a liar nor a fool. You appear to be both.

            Goodbye.

            "Every man has a right to utter what he thinks truth" Samuel Johnson

            by Brecht on Mon Nov 19, 2012 at 04:10:14 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  i took HR off, then put it back on after your post (0+ / 0-)

              no games.  you just talked me into it.

              Romney in a landslide!

              by jj24 on Mon Nov 19, 2012 at 04:16:10 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  You talked yourself into it, then pointed at me. (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                mahakali overdrive

                You only took the HR off because I called you on your hypocrisy. Then you resented being pushed, put your HR back, and made up a lame rationalization.

                But you've already lied about this - it's not like I expect you to be frank or take responsibility here.

                Throughout this diary you seem to be caught up in the drama, responding emotionally, then making up rationalizations to justify your feelings. That's not evil. It's just misleading, and muddies up clear debate.

                "Every man has a right to utter what he thinks truth" Samuel Johnson

                by Brecht on Mon Nov 19, 2012 at 07:49:24 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

    •  I really don't care if (0+ / 0-)

      you find it offensive.  Every German should be pro-Israeli for the next 1,000 years after what we did to them.

      •  that is some true winger shit. (6+ / 0-)

        pro-jewish is not pro-israeli - two way different stances.  the day i'm pro-oppression, i'll be both pro-israeli and whatever other regimes who shant be named who have engaged in the systematic, long-term, brutal oppression and minimization of their political rivals or people of their choice to deny rights to.

        Romney in a landslide!

        by jj24 on Mon Nov 19, 2012 at 04:08:50 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Do you think the Palestinians (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Dogs are fuzzy

          would stop trying to kill Jews if  1) the Wall came down? 2) all travel and commerce restrictions were lifted?  3) Palestinians were free to travel everywhere in Gaza, the West Bank, and Israel?

          I think they would kill as many Israelis as they could.  I wish it were otherwise.

          Are the Israelis completely not at fault?  No.  The expansion of West Bank settlements and hindrances to commerce and travel that are not necessary for security purposes no doubt make a bad situation worse.

        •  Foreign Policy site with their take on this issue. (0+ / 1-)
          Recommended by:
          Hidden by:
          Red Sox

          ...Step 2: State or imply that anyone who writes critically about the Israel lobby is an anti-semite or a self-hating Jew.

          This is of course an old stratagem designed to silence anyone who thinks about raising the subject. It's not as effective as it used to be, because it was been used so widely and so inappropriately in the past, but it's still a key part of the playbook. As Rothkopf writes in this most recent piece, the Israel lobby "is just a boogie-man cooked up to serve the nasty agenda of people all too eager to sacrifice the truth on the altar of their prejudices." There's really nothing to see here, folks, and if you think you do see something, you must be a bigot.

          ...Facts are stubborn things, and no amount of dust-kicking and hand-waving can prevent more and more people -- including Jews like Peter Beinart and M.J. Rosenberg and philo-semites like Andrew Sullivan and me -- from pointing them out.

          If AIPAC and its allies are in fact beginning to lose some of their clout, the recent emergence of a somewhat more open discourse on this question is at least partially responsible.  
          http://walt.foreignpolicy.com/...

          •  STFU Bigot.... (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            hester, lostboyjim, RedPencil, Red Sox

            No one says you can't be critical of Israel. But what you can't do is quote stuff straight off of Stormfront or davidduke.com like you did above.

            You make a comment like you did above and then talk about "facts"... Really, now?

            "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

            by volleyboy1 on Mon Nov 19, 2012 at 06:21:00 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Not a "bigot" rude vollyboy...just trying to learn (0+ / 0-)

              like yourself...or not in your case.

              We do not know the whole truth and never will.  Having two sides of a conversation is a start.  Shutting down opposing sides is just that... shutting down progress toward real PEACE.

              From Veterans Today - full article at link, if you choose to read another opinion, or not.

              Gaza war, Israel’s military ruse to evade weakness
              Conclusion

              Turkish Prime Minister Erdogan was correct in his assessment that this is no longer “2008.” Israel’s actions in Gaza are radicalizing Egypt, destabilizing Saudi Arabia and the Persian Gulf States and will quicken the end of Jordan’s servile kleptocracy.

              What will be left is Israel, dependent on India, flanked between Pakistan and China, dependent on Britain, France and Germany, nations buried in debt crisis and instability and dependent on the United States, a nation increasingly aware that Israel’s “knife” has been in her back for decades.
              http://www.veteranstoday.com/...

              •  Bullshit.... You used a widely discredited (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                CTMET

                quote from Netanyahu and a list of Jewish or Mostly Jewish Americans and accused them of "dual loyalty" not too mention that you falsely stated that they were "dual citizens".

                You fool no one. And "Veterans Today"... Seriously? That site is rife with anti-Semitic CT. Why not just link to davidduke.com and tell me that is "just another opinion"?

                You are not fooling anyone Russgirl. Just FYI.

                "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

                by volleyboy1 on Wed Nov 21, 2012 at 04:42:52 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  I was wondering where you and Mets102 were (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  volleyboy1

                  I haven't seen any diaries in the usual groups come through my stream. All I've got to listen to are the "bomb them to the stone ages" posts  get and stuff like this. :(

                  The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy;the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness

                  by CTMET on Wed Nov 21, 2012 at 06:44:33 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Yeah.. Sorry CTMET... Mets and I (we've talked (0+ / 0-)

                    about it) are disengaging from I/P here at the G.O.S.

                    See we are interested in Liberal / Progressive politics so on the domestic front Daily Kos seems to have a fair amount of interesting stuff. However, bigots seem to be ruling the roost in I.P. with the Admins. apparent blessing.

                    We will still be talking about I/P but from an informed Zionist / Reasonable progressive perspective over at our blog The Progressive Zionist. The thing is that there when we can moderate comments. SO we can simply eliminate the "white noise" that exists at the fringes (both Left and Right) of the spectrum and talk about issues.

                    I had a lot of diary ideas but the bigotry and the attempt to turn DKos in MondoFront just puts me off. The fact that the admins. support this is amazing. Why they don't just call Phil Weiss and Adam Horowitz and put them in charge of I.P. is astounding to me since they very much seem to want the irrelevant "drooler" element hanging out here.

                    "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

                    by volleyboy1 on Wed Nov 21, 2012 at 07:47:41 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  I can't say I blame you for disengaging. Its (1+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      volleyboy1

                      unfortunate for the site that they will lose that point of view. I'll have to check out Progressive Zionist.

                      The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy;the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness

                      by CTMET on Thu Nov 22, 2012 at 07:19:00 AM PST

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  Well just on I/P (1+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        CTMET

                        I staying around to support Democrats (at least as long as the Admins. continue to keep the Paulbots, LaRouches and other nutjobs who claim to be "liberal" in check).

                        I just saw this and frankly I was completely reminded of what this place has become around I/P:

                        Notice the commentary by the little asshole at the end of the rant.

                        "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

                        by volleyboy1 on Thu Nov 22, 2012 at 09:46:39 AM PST

                        [ Parent ]

                •  Rude...again vollyboy. Wow, sad really. (0+ / 0-)

                  Rather lame - Calling me anti-semantic for trying to discuss and share info?  

                                                Look in the mirror rude one.

                  You paint a broad brush full of hateful words.  I do feel sorry for you, as you have closed your mind to discussion of any type that does not fit your stereotype, regardless of what is happening in reality.

                  Good luck with all that.

                                 •    "When the power of love overcomes
                                                 the love of power
                                                       the world will know peace."
                                           ~Jimi Hendrix, Guitarist, 101st Airborne

                  •  Russgirl... you are a bigot, so really I (0+ / 0-)

                    don't care if you call me rude. I am not nice to bigots or racists of any kind and I see no need to change that.

                    I am calling you anti-Semitic because you post info. from anti-Semitic sites. More than that, you actually published discredited quotes that come from Neo-Nazi sites. AND even more than that you posted a list of Jewish Americans (some of them) and then called them dual citizens and questioned their loyalty to the U.S. based solely on the fact that they are Jewish.

                    Now why the hell would I or anyone else want to discuss anything with you or view the lies you call "information" or "opinions". What next?

                    You represent the worst in all of us.

                    "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

                    by volleyboy1 on Wed Nov 21, 2012 at 07:39:21 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

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