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View Diary: CNN Losing Bradley Manning Story: Manning Was Reporting a War Crime, "The Van Thing" (286 comments)

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  •  Excessive? Maybe (1+ / 3-)
    Recommended by:
    databob
    Hidden by:
    chalatenango, Mindful Nature, aliasalias

    but last I checked tighty whitties were not a right.  

    Personally I would not have wanted to see him nekked all the time.  I would have given him rope, sharp objects and lots of alone time.  And a video camera monitoring him so there was ample proof that any harm was self inflicted.

    Quantico is a nasty place and Marines are nasty people.  He got his shorts  back when he moved to Leavenworth.  And he has stopped making stupid jokes.  

    It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it. Robert E. Lee

    by ksuwildkat on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 02:13:00 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  hey fuckwad you are proving everything wrong with (5+ / 6-)

      America and it's wars.

      Thanks for doing such a great job of it.

      •  I said personally (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        databob

        As a military commander his wellbeing would be my responsibility so I would have ordered everything harmful removed from his cell....including his under ware

        It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it. Robert E. Lee

        by ksuwildkat on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 03:40:05 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  IE (12+ / 0-)

          "I harbor lethal hatred for him and would act upon it, unless my job prevented me from doing so."

          •  no (0+ / 0-)

            its the difference between my personal feeling for someone who would betray his country and his fellow soldiers and my professional obligations.  And there is a big difference between harming someone and providing the means for them to harm themselves.

            It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it. Robert E. Lee

            by ksuwildkat on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 08:52:32 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Rigid thinking (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              raincrow

              Whistle-blowing isn't exactly what comes to mind when one hears the phrase "betray his country and his fellow soldiers."  It's very distinct from the sort of brazen treachery that should inspire contempt in a reasonable person.  

              •  Don't insult whistle blowers (0+ / 0-)

                PFC Manning had multiple avenues to report any bad acts and not compromise classified information.  In fact, because of his access to sensitive information he had MORE ways than the average soldier.  He passed on all of them.

                What he did he did for revenge and a need for attention.  Nothing more, nothing less.  

                It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it. Robert E. Lee

                by ksuwildkat on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 09:35:25 PM PST

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                •  There is a cloud of (0+ / 0-)

                  emotion interfering with your judgment.  When one ascertains, as BM appeared to do, that one's employer is in fact nefarious, it goes without saying that the channels for whistle-blowing operated by that same employer will not lead to resolution.  And I've never seen anything to suggest "revenge" as a motivation for the disclosure.  Revenge against whom?  For what?  

                  Honestly, your need for a punching bag is so controlling here that you're simply making things up to justify your feelings.  

            •  Betrayal. Yeah, right. Like gwb, cheney didn't (0+ / 0-)

              And Manning did.  

              You got it exactly upside down.

               We have a military beating the bushes looking for projects, missions, anything to justify hundreds of billions flowing to the well connected, the same ones offering sinecures to retired professional military in an incestuous closed loop of a decaying economic system. We all pay, we will all bleed, we will all pay dearly for outsourcing citizenship and waiving our duty to do informed decision making.

              Bradley did something audacious and heroic. He simply revealed, like Abu Gharib, something the powers that be wanted to be kept away from oversight, from the public.

              For that the tools, and loyal followers of various power centers and the self serving want him dead, or silenced permanently, or both.  They always show up to do the death dance on his grave.  Except he isn't buried yet and the story won't go away.

        •  Please... (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          raincrow, 84thProblem, ksuwildkat

          "underWEAR".

          "I'm not scared of anyone or anything, Angie. Isn't that the way life should be?" Jack Hawksmoor

          by skyounkin on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 06:03:51 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

    •  Not a remark that reflects well on you (n/t) (8+ / 0-)

      "So, please stay where you are. Don't move and don't panic. Don't take off your shoes! Jobs is on the way."

      by wader on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 04:15:03 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Hey, ksuwildkat, you are proving everything wrong (4+ / 0-)

      with America and it's wars.

      Thanks for doing such a great job of it.

      [slightly edited version of donoevil's post, which I agree with 100%.]

    •  HR'd for fascist suggestions and sadistic spew (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      aliasalias

      I preach the church without Christ, where the lame don't walk, the blind don't see and what's dead stays that way! Hazel Motes in "Wise Blood"

      by chalatenango on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 08:30:52 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I disagree (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Wordsinthewind

        I suppose that if you either go looking for something to complain about, or just walked into this thread, you'd HR this.

        But if you'd participated in this thread, especially if you'd read all of ksuwildcat's comments, you'd understand his comment in a different context, I reckon.

        Speaking for myself, I don't understand the whole 'suicide watch' thing, perhaps because I believe that not only is suicide a personal thing but also that in some cases it's the honorable choice.... and who are we to deny a person that right?

        Or maybe you don't agree that Marines are nasty people and Quantico is a nasty place.... just proves you don't know anything about either. But that doesn't deserve an HR, does it?

        And, before I get pummeled by anyone, I WANT our Marines to be nasty people, because we DEMAND they do NASTY things, and I respect that.

        Cheers.

        Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain. Friedrich Schiller

        by databob on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 08:46:42 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I read them (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          raincrow

          and he's way out of line.  If that's a common attitude, then a lot of military guys need to learn some professionalism

          Hay hombres que luchan un dia, y son buenos Hay otros que luchan un año, y son mejores Hay quienes luchan muchos años, y son muy buenos. Pero hay los que luchan toda la vida. Esos son los imprescendibles.

          by Mindful Nature on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 09:24:00 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  What exactly? (0+ / 0-)

            What exactly is "out of line"?

            That I dont want to see someone necked - which of course he was not.

            That on a personal level I would give him the option of being free from his troubles?

            Or that on a professional level I would ensure his safety - even tot he point of having people with no knowledge of the situation call me terrible things for doing so.

            You cant have it both ways.  Either Im evil for preventing him from killing himself or evil for enabling him.  

            Please be precise.  

            It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it. Robert E. Lee

            by ksuwildkat on Sat Dec 01, 2012 at 01:02:07 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  The suggestion of enabling (0+ / 0-)

              Is far over the line.  If military detention has created such mental conditions it is time to remove him from military custody

              Hay hombres que luchan un dia, y son buenos Hay otros que luchan un año, y son mejores Hay quienes luchan muchos años, y son muy buenos. Pero hay los que luchan toda la vida. Esos son los imprescendibles.

              by Mindful Nature on Sat Dec 01, 2012 at 04:00:40 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  In other words (0+ / 0-)

                you were just talking out of your butt and have no real basis for complaining.  

                PFC Manning was unhinged long before he was detained.  

                It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it. Robert E. Lee

                by ksuwildkat on Sat Dec 01, 2012 at 06:48:13 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  no (0+ / 0-)

                  you suggested facilitating the suicide of a prisoner.  That is a grave breach.

                  Hay hombres que luchan un dia, y son buenos Hay otros que luchan un año, y son mejores Hay quienes luchan muchos años, y son muy buenos. Pero hay los que luchan toda la vida. Esos son los imprescendibles.

                  by Mindful Nature on Sat Dec 01, 2012 at 06:56:36 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  See (0+ / 0-)

                    Now you are just displaying the emptiness of your arguments.

                    First you say it is evil to take away the mens he himself suggested he could kill himself with then you say I am evil for suggesting I would provide him with more.

                    And of course you take the position that suicide is evil contrary to most liberal thought.

                    Empty

                    It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it. Robert E. Lee

                    by ksuwildkat on Sat Dec 01, 2012 at 07:11:45 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  I never said the former at all (0+ / 0-)

                      I said that trying to get a prisoner to commit suicide shows an utter depravity

                      Suicide isn't evil.  Trying to get someone under your power to commit suicide  is

                      Hay hombres que luchan un dia, y son buenos Hay otros que luchan un año, y son mejores Hay quienes luchan muchos años, y son muy buenos. Pero hay los que luchan toda la vida. Esos son los imprescendibles.

                      by Mindful Nature on Sat Dec 01, 2012 at 08:15:30 PM PST

                      [ Parent ]

        •  Wow. (0+ / 0-)

          YES WE DID -- AGAIN. FOUR MORE YEARS.

          by raincrow on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 09:53:56 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  you have never been in the service is my guess (0+ / 0-)

          without the ants the rainforest dies

          by aliasalias on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 11:19:21 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Vietnam era, actually (USCG) (0+ / 0-)

            And the tales I heard about Navy brigs would curl yer hair.
            The sociopathic comment would be more at home at Glenn Beck's site.

            I preach the church without Christ, where the lame don't walk, the blind don't see and what's dead stays that way! Hazel Motes in "Wise Blood"

            by chalatenango on Sat Dec 01, 2012 at 09:59:06 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  and now sociopathic (0+ / 0-)

              Really, you need to look these words up before using them:

              so·ci·o·path
               [soh-see-uh-path, soh-shee-]
              noun, Psychiatry.
              a person with a psychopathic personality whose behavior is antisocial, often criminal, and who lacks a sense of moral responsibility or social conscience.

              I have been accused of many things in my years but lack of moral responsibility has never been one of them.  

              You do realize that PFC Manning is almost a case study in sociopathic behavior.  

              dictionary.com

              its free
              use it and live better

              It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it. Robert E. Lee

              by ksuwildkat on Sat Dec 01, 2012 at 01:24:25 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

        •  If you're the officer responsible for a prisoner's (0+ / 0-)

          safety, you should obviously be the one to "deny a person that right" or your ass would get busted.

          I preach the church without Christ, where the lame don't walk, the blind don't see and what's dead stays that way! Hazel Motes in "Wise Blood"

          by chalatenango on Sat Dec 01, 2012 at 10:07:10 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  Really? (0+ / 0-)

        Please explain the "fascist suggestion."

        From Dictionary.com:

        fascism  (ˈfæʃɪzəm)

        — n
        1.    any ideology or movement inspired by Italian Fascism, such as German National Socialism; any right-wing nationalist ideology or movement with an authoritarian and hierarchical structure that is fundamentally opposed to democracy and liberalism
        2.    any ideology, movement, programme, tendency, etc, that may be characterized as right-wing, chauvinist, authoritarian, etc
        3.    prejudice in relation to the subject specified: body fascism

        I would assume you believe that suggesting tighty whities are not a right I am somehow a fascist.  I have checked the Constitution and I dont see anything about undergarments.  

        sa·dis·tic
         [suh-dis-tik, sey-, sa-]
        adjective
        pertaining to or characterized by sadism; deriving pleasure or sexual gratification from extreme cruelty: a sadistic psychopath.

        I will further assume that you qualify providing the means to terminate ones life is "sadistic spew."

        From Wikipedia:  Liberalism asserts that a person's life belongs only to them, and no other person has the right to force their own ideals that life must be lived. Rather, only the individual involved can make such decision, and whatever decision they make should be respected.

        Philosopher and psychiatrist Thomas Szasz goes further, arguing that suicide is the most basic right of all. If freedom is self-ownership—ownership over one's own life and body—then the right to end that life is the most basic of all. If others can force you to live, you do not own yourself and belong to them.

        Your accusations seem to be in conflict.  if I am a Fascist I am fundamentally opposed to liberalism yet if I allow someone the freedom to continue or end their life on their own terms, I am at the very extreme of Liberalism.  

        Now you might be opposed to the things I say and might even find them offensive but do a little more research before trying to articulate your displeasure.  Words mean things.  Your words mean you dont know what they mean.

        It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it. Robert E. Lee

        by ksuwildkat on Sat Dec 01, 2012 at 01:16:08 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  sick (0+ / 0-)

      without the ants the rainforest dies

      by aliasalias on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 11:17:26 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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