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View Diary: Is Tyreese "Made to Suffer"? In The Walking Dead TV Show There Can Be Only One Black Male Character (342 comments)

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  •  it depends.... (7+ / 0-)

    i dont see race in the context of carl closing the doors on Tyrese's group.  considering Carl locked Tyrese's group which has white people and black people.  Carl saved them.  he didnt have to do that, he could have left them to die.   He just locked the door on them as a precaution to protect his group.  I would say that is pretty smart.  He knows of the bad guys.  If we are to defer to analyzing racial stereotypes and subtext, shouldn’t we expect Tyrese to ask for the Old Man permission to join.  Because shouldn’t the old white Man (Herschel) be the default  leader ?  But he wasn’t.
    Carl did right to help them.  He isnt holding them against their will.  They are free to leave any time or stay and use the food that was set aside in that part of the building.  In this world you cant trust other factions.  (and the is also the fact that Carl told them they needed to kill the girl who had died, but they kept refusing and dragging her along which slowed Carl’s attempt to bring them to safety, if you cannot follow a basic request from your host then why should Carl invite you to join tehir group.  And every child (black, white, green or blue), are taught by their parents not to let strangers into their home.
    Do you expect Carl to just open up the door and welcome their group in and while at it, take their guns, supplies, women (I think Carol is capable of defending herself but not the child and Beth(forgot her name)?  
    --
    In terms of Michonne vs Andrea.  Andrea walked in on them fighting and saw the Governor in pain and was definitely shocked to see Michonne.  Michonne pointed her sword at Andrea, andrea had her gun pointed right back.  I didn’t see Michonne lowering her sword when andrea came in.  Why would you expect Andrea to submit in that situation?  Wouldn’t both people as friends lower their weapons?  Or maybe they both did the human thing and we wary of each other is a messed up situation.  Andrea did not shoot Michonne, so you cannot say that there was no loyalty.  Andrea had made a home in Woodbury, she and Michonne previously parted ways, so yes maybe she would stick around in her new home and not go jumping off with a woman who just started a fight out of nowhere?

    --
    In terms of the lack of black men on the show, there are criticisms that can be made about the lack of strong black men/minorities and the lack of depth to their writing.  But I think there is conflation going on in your argument.  
    --
    You can even make arguments about the role of women and steretypes (Andrea the predator, etc)
    But hey, it is a good show and I enjoy it and it looks like Tyrese is going to be a good character (a new natural leader joining the group as Rick keeps his descent with seeing Shane).  We’ll see where it goes.  It has me hooked

    •  Not dismissing your entire post (4+ / 0-)

      But, please try not to write this anymore:

       And every child (black, white, green or blue)
      Race is a very real thing in this country. As a Native American, I find that phase (green, blue, purple with polka dots, etc.) sort of dismissive of the issues people of color face.

      Also, I agree with you that Karl did the right thing in locking the new people up.  And I also agree that there was not any racism in his actions. However, taken as a whole, the portrayal of Black people on the show is lacking any real sense of the characters as real human beings.  

      It is easy to take each scene separately and not see any problem with the Black characters on the show. But, seen as a whole, with the Black characters all lacking meaningful dialogue and insights into their "personality", I think it is beginning to be a real problem.

      ~*-:¦:-jennybravo-:¦:-*~

      by jennybravo on Mon Dec 03, 2012 at 09:11:14 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  nice of u (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Dr Swig Mcjigger

        not to dismiss my whole post... but maybe to preface a post with that phrase makes you dismissive of what I said (or trying to have it both ways)??????????  I am just saying that you yourself did not need to say that part...

        but about the whole different color thing... accept it... we all are different colors... not just you... no one was being dismissve of race and perception of race/skin tone has existed for thousands of years, makes it a reality... and even race gets redefined.

        Carl did not lock them up, he locked them out... big difference... one implies that he made them his slaves/chained them... the other shows that he put them out (what does it mean to lock out a group of blacks and white, men and women?  they had the choice to leave anytime they want, i.e freedom).

        and I am not saying that the the lack of black characterization is not problematic, but it is not easy to take each scene separately.  I believe it is much easier to paint in broad strokes and view things in stereotypes (from saying the whole show is good to the opposite side, saying the show is racist to minorities).  to get into the underlying context takes much deeper analytical skills and then a step above is to draw relationships between scenarios (and then even better analyses would require a person to distinquish between true and false correlations)...

        thanks for the reply... this is a good debate...

        •  ... (0+ / 0-)

          didnt mean to say "you should accept it" in the sense that you shouldn't question what I wrote or what the show has written....  you should do that.... just understand others have a different perspective and writing style (and use of rhetoric)... arguments involving race always become loaded...

        •  Sorry (0+ / 0-)

          All I meant by that phrase is that I didn't want you to think that I was criticizing your whole post because I did not like the green, blue comment.  I was trying to say that I did NOT dismiss the rest of your comment. I apologize I phrased that so poorly.

          I got the impression from that scene that they were locked inside a cell and unable to leave.  Again, even if that was the case, I agree that was the right move for Karl to make until his dad and/or the others came back. And I don't believe the decision was consciously or unconsciously  race based on the part of the writers.  It just made sense under the circumstances.

          I still hope these types of discussions open the eyes of the writers/producers to their portrayal of Black characters.

          And it would really cool if they had a Native American character!

          ~*-:¦:-jennybravo-:¦:-*~

          by jennybravo on Tue Dec 04, 2012 at 03:00:31 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  sorry (0+ / 0-)

            i wasnt trying to imply "accept it" in terms of not being critical of how race/etc interacts with tv shows or life, people should always challenge ideas and improve upon them...  
            just this particular scenario and my phrasing (although feel free to challenge that also, i will challenge back ;)

            --
            I would think native americans would be able to survive in this world... at least the ones who probably live as tribes (not modernized), if there are any who live off the land still... i would think any tribal society (from any part of the world) would be able to live in this world... treating zombies as any other predator to be fought (maybe that is part of michonne's charm is she has learned to live off basics, sword and the land, although she isnt much into tribal living/independent)

            --
            i am happy they at least have one intelligent minority written... glenn.  seems like Tdog had potential, but i think the writers were lazy in challenging themselves to give them character plots, so they killed him, same problem with lori.

    •  locking (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Prof Haley, mim5677

      up the new people until you really know who they are and can fully trust them is nothing new. It's what the compound group did to Max Rockatansky in the Road Warrior and what Faramir did to Frodo and Sam in Return of the King.

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