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View Diary: Terra Firma or Why We Better Start Getting Dirty (112 comments)

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  •  The studies on this go back a long way. (22+ / 0-)

    Imagine if childhood diseases were wiped out?  When adults got them they would be many many times more lethal.

    In the third world malaria gets to kids and they build up a resistance.  When attempts were made to wipe it out the kids got les exposure and as adults the results were horrible.

    Now my favorite hobby horse.  Anti-bacterial soap.  All this garbage does is help evolve more resistant strains of bacteria.

    We have known for a long time that when bacteria and virus populations are stressed their mutation rate goes way up.  It is their way of surviving the stress.

    Evolution is not just a long term thing.  It can happen as we watch.

    An idea is not responsible for who happens to be carrying it at the moment. It stands or falls on its own merits.

    by don mikulecky on Thu Dec 06, 2012 at 04:35:56 PM PST

    •  It gets pretty frustrating seeing the (13+ / 0-)

      anti-bacterial soap still out there in use. Just gives a false sense of security and might be harming us more than doing us any good.

      Good ole soap and water is all we need. But nothing drums up sales of that stuff more than the heavy stick of fear and the anti-bacterial soap manufacturers are more than willing to swing that stick in order to pad the bottom line.

      •  If you need it, you need it. (12+ / 0-)

        Most people don't need anti-bacterial soap, true. But a few of us do, and it's a good thing we can find it. I have a kidney transplant and take immune system suppressing drugs twice a day, every day. I take a lot less now than when I first got the transplant, but I do take them. I'm not allowed to do things like get scratched by a blackberry bush, and this is the Pacific Northwest; blackberry bushes are all over our land. If I garden, I have to wear not only thick leather gloves but a surgical mask. A fungal infection from a blackberry scratch or something in the soil has a good chance of landing me in the hospital and costing me my transplant, since the first thing they'd stop would be my immunosuppressants.

        So, yeah, anti-bacterial soap is a necessity for me. If using it means that I don't get the benefits from M. vaccae but I do get the benefits from having a kidney that works, I'm okay with that.

        Organ donors save lives! A donor's kidney gave me my life back on 02/18/11; he lives on in me. Please talk with your family about your wish to donate.

        Why are war casualty counts "American troops" and "others" but never "human beings"?

        by Kitsap River on Thu Dec 06, 2012 at 07:28:22 PM PST

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        •  As I mentioned above, (6+ / 0-)

          the anti-bacterial propaganda has unfortunately given cover cover to people have pathological obsessions with uncleanliness, and a lack of scientific training or a low priority for the information.  As someone with autoimmune problems, I understand what that means for you.  But I can tell the difference between someone who's exhausted and stressed from autoimmune problems, and somebody who's tweaking out on paranoia and needs a therapist.  The latter outweigh the former.

          Too many millions of uppity Americans could use a good glob of dirt upside the head.

          Thank you to jayden, Dr Erich Bloodaxe RN, Aji and everyone in the Daily Kos community involved in gifting my subscription and gifting others!

          by Nulwee on Thu Dec 06, 2012 at 07:34:27 PM PST

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        •  The situation was not as extreme, but my father (0+ / 0-)

          had an artificial valve and he did once wind up in the hospital after cutting himself while eating crabs. He most certainly played in the dirt plenty when he was a child and he definitely didn't want to be like that. In fact, my mother was constantly nagging him to be more careful about his health.

          While I agree with the point of this diary, some individuals do, unfortunately, need to be more scared of ordinary germs than the rest of us.

      •  Soap IS anti-bacterial (3+ / 0-)

        It's how soap WORKS. No additions needed.

    •  One of my children's friends (4+ / 0-)

      managed to escape chicken pox as a child, then got it as a young adult [~21]. Nearly killed him, he's had to wear a heart pacemaker ever since.

      Now I hear they've a vaccination for it. But when a nurse friend's kids got it, daughter took our grandson to play at their house so he'd get it, and so did all the other parents of young children in the neighborhood.

      •  My understanding of the chicken pox vax is (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        that it's simply a dose of the pox itself...just that you get to choose when you(r children) get it.

        "Push the button, Max!" Jack Lemmon as Professor Fate, The Great Race

        by bartcopfan on Fri Dec 07, 2012 at 03:04:15 PM PST

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