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View Diary: Obama, Boehner meet on fiscal mess (222 comments)

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  •  There is zero reason for Democrats to (25+ / 0-)

    "compromise" on anything.

    Let the rates rise, then see if Republicans dare hold back a middle class rate cut.   Let it happen.

    A couple week's worth of altered withholding in January isn't going to destroy the entire economy.

    Cutting Social Security or cutting Medicare or even cutting health care spending is WRONG.

    No reason for compromise on the part of Democrats.  Remember Democrats?  The guys who won the election?

    Obama shouldn't give on anything.  Make the orange man cry!

    "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

    by YucatanMan on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 09:03:30 AM PST

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    •  Not even a couple of weeks. Any policies (8+ / 0-)

      can be made retroactive so its all suffering just on paper rather than in reality. If that is the correct understanding of the istuation - and I believe it is, I just want to underscore how much we are being lied to here.

      •  Oh, I definitely agree. But the withholding will (0+ / 0-)

        take place out of people's pay checks.  That money likely won't come back until people file their taxes the following year.

        Of course, that means the IRS would have to be ready with new rate tables and schedules for payroll managers.  I haven't heard anything about that rolling out...  yet.

        "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

        by YucatanMan on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 09:14:54 AM PST

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        •  I think if you told people (7+ / 0-)

          2 weeks  delayed until your tax returns versus cutting your Medicare and Social Security, they would be able to handle the two weeks.

          Its just a sham argument. I appreciate what ou are saying, but I just don't buy its the reason.

          •  I'm agreeing with you. I'm just saying, (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Mr Robert, divineorder, bruh1

            if the IRS is ready, which is a big "if," withholding at the higher rates would take place.  It is only a few percentage points, because Bush saved his biggest tax cuts for the richest people.

            I agree with going over the molehill.  There are people making an argument that the increased withholding will send us into inflation.  It won't be that much withholding and the Congress can fix it ASAP with fewer Republicans to oppose the middle class tax cuts (while leaving the over $250k hike in effect).

            My argument is that even if there are some higher amounts withheld for a couple of weeks, it won't destroy the world.  In fact, it will heat up the pressure for Republicans to be the ones "compromising" instead of us.  So be it.

            "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

            by YucatanMan on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 10:01:26 AM PST

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            •  "inflation" ? I meant "Recession" (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              bruh1

              Shouldn't try to comment and do conference calls at work at the same time.

              ;-)

              "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

              by YucatanMan on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 02:05:01 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

    •  I agree! If we jump head first over the "cliff", (13+ / 0-)

      then we still get more of what we need and want.

      Why the hell are we dealing at all?!?   Didn't we win last month??  Didn't the people tell them in exit polls, in current polls, with our votes, that we wanted the President to stand up and hold firm???

      Why is this happening?

      I just hope and pray, this is bad reporting or nonsense that will never play out.  I can't imagine why there would be a deal when the President has said over and over again, that he will not deal on what the people want.

    •  I just received (9+ / 0-)

      notification from Social Security that my cost of living increase next year will amount to $11 a month.  That would buy two Whoppers at Burger King (if I could afford to eat at Burger King).  Funny.  I know the official inflation rate is close to zero, but that's not what it looks like when I go to the grocery store.  My rent just went from $498 a month to $630 a month.

      The Reptilians think that everybody should feel some pain, get some skin in the game.  So cut that Social Security.  We're just a bunch of whining welfare queens anyway.  I'd like to see any one of them live on what I get each month ($669) from Social Security.  I'll be happy to share some of my pain with them.

      "There are times when even normal men must spit in their hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken

      by rwgate on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 09:44:40 AM PST

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    •  Insanity to negotiate away rate increases. (0+ / 0-)

      Rate increases are the toughest things to get and Ds will never be in a stronger position to get them.  Toughest to get because they are so visible and so easy for individuals to calculate the impact on their own situation.  Cuts in deductions like mortgage interest can come later.  Let the rates rise.  THen, and only then,  negotiate spending cuts which will turn out to be a debate on whether to cut oil subsidies or food stamps or 'spending' on mortgage interest deductions for billionaires.  And in the end, tie all deduction not to Cost of Living Increases or CPI, tie them to the minimum wage.  EG, maximum mortgage interest deduction might be 2000 hours X the local minimum wage.  THat will at least give minimum wage increases some political backing which it desperately needs.

      GOP Wars against: Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Immigrants, Mexicans, Blacks, Gays, Women, Unions, Workers, Unemployed, Voters, Elderly, Kids, Poor, Sick, Disabled, Dying, Lovers, Kindness, Rationalism, Science, Sanity, Reality.

      by SGWM on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 10:40:38 AM PST

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