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View Diary: Time for the "LEADER" of this country to start the conversation about gun control (105 comments)

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  •  I think it is fair to wait a day or two (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Vacationland, KenBee, Mistral Wind

    and it won't hurt the cause of gun control a single bit.

    You never trust a millionaire/Quoting the sermon on the mount/I used to think I was not like them/But I'm beginning to have my doubts -- The Arcade Fire

    by tomjones on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 11:55:52 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  I think the best way to show we as a country care (5+ / 0-)

      for those that have been killed and injured and effected by this is to not wait.

      By waiting, we show a deep disrespect for what has happened to them.

      •  But don't you see (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        if politicians immediately start making the pro-gun control arguments, then the NRA and others will immediately start making the anti-gun control arguments and...we'll just be having another political slug fest within hours of families learning they have been permanently, irrevocably torn asunder.

        You never trust a millionaire/Quoting the sermon on the mount/I used to think I was not like them/But I'm beginning to have my doubts -- The Arcade Fire

        by tomjones on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 12:01:35 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  as opposed to what (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Smoh, ssgbryan, isabelle hayes

          saying nothing and having charlton heston come speak for the nra days later just as an "in your face gesture" just for fun...

          the real issue here isn't timing...the real issue here is who has the stomach for the fight.

          their side gives two shits about the victims of today's tragedy if they can be used to further their cause.  you can already hear them saying how teachers should be armed.  

          MORE GUNS! MORE GUNS will save us!

          they don't give a shit whether teachers actually want to be armed or have that responsibility.  whether its factually effective or even reasonable.  and of course if a deranged teacher actually turned a gun on their classroom, then they would just suggest we arm the children.

          again--not about timing.  it's about the nature of the people having the gd argument.

          it's about compassion or lack thereof.  we want to consider the victims.  their families.  we want to take time to mourn.  to evaluate.  to act responsibly. because we're reasonable, compassionate people.

          they don't have those same concerns.  they're just assholes.

          and guess what, every now and then in order to deal with an asshole--you have to be an asshole.  so prepare yourself for this fight--because it IS time to have it.

          •  Both my parents were teachers and I absolutely (0+ / 0-)

            can't imagine either of them being willing to learn to handle a gun as part of their training as educators. Don't these right wingers hate teachers anyway? There are days that I think the far right won't be happy until each of us is living alone on our own compound armed to the teeth and driving to the armed compounds of our friends, presuming we trust anyone enough to call them a friend, in huge SUVs. Meanwhile, we can all educate our children at home. Exactly where all the land for everyone to live like that is supposed to come from, I don't know.

            the real issue here is who has the stomach for the fight.
            This is the truth.
        •  If we didn't do things based solely on the (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          progressivist, T100R

          failing nature of our politicians, we wouldn't do anything ever.

        •  I am sure that the parents of a murdered child (3+ / 0-)

          would like to see that this does not happen to another parent ever again. We need to have a slug fest over this. And I sure the parents would support an effort to fix this problem in memory of their lost children.

    •  Yep My Feeling Is, As Soon As News Is No Longer (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      breaking and the basic facts are known.

      We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy.... --ML King "Beyond Vietnam"

      by Gooserock on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 11:58:59 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  How do the basic facts of this slaughter have (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        progressivist, Domestic Elf

        anything to do about addressing our country's relationship with guns?


        How is that not clear and what unknown in this particular event is going to make that more or less clear?

        •  We don't know anything about the guns (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Norm in Chicago

          for example. Magazine capacity. Bullet type. Whether the shooter was licensed or unlicensed.

          All the sorts of things that would, y'know, factor into a discussion on gun control.

          You never trust a millionaire/Quoting the sermon on the mount/I used to think I was not like them/But I'm beginning to have my doubts -- The Arcade Fire

          by tomjones on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 12:02:39 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Does it really matter? (8+ / 0-)

            Isn't what matters is the fact that guns are readably obtainable and we have an unprecedented amount of gun violence in our country.

            It's not just this one incident.

            Gun control isn't the only issue here either. It's our relationship with guns. What else about our culture has to be addressed?

            Now I think we have gotten out of the arena of gun control and into the question of why are mass shootings taking place at this rate in this country?

            Is gun violence a symptom of wider problems? I think it is. Gun control isn't the only issue and the problem can not be solved by control alone.

            •  But gun control is the only solution offered (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:

              My problem with most of the comments on threads like these is that no one is talking about pychopath control, or trying to deal with the issue of violence directly.

              It all devolves to "Everyone is guilty until proven innocent, ban all gun ownership, overturn the 2nd Amendment"

              My issue with that is the War on Drugs.  If you think guns are too obtainable now, wait until they're supplied only through the black market.  There will be zero gun control.

              If those who want to stop the violence would first start by respecting our rights, we'd be much closer to progress.

              •  Yeah, I think you should lock up "defectives" (0+ / 0-)

                like me so you can keep the guns that you value above everything.

                •  that's not what he's saying, you know it....nt (0+ / 0-)

                  This machine kills Fascists.

                  by KenBee on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 03:44:14 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Actually, I don't know it. (0+ / 0-)

                    There's been a petition to the White House to arm teachers. Would someone like me with a history of depression be able to be a teacher in your violent, Wild West fantasy world? What other job would I, and many others I know, not be qualified. If carrying a gun were normative, what would people think of those of use who not permitted to? I don't have a problem with the right to bear arms, I have a problem with people walking around carrying guns all the time and encouraging more people to have more guns.

                    If you don't know, I'll tell you right now, your rhetoric about the mentally ill hurts people who alread carry a large burden in this world.

          •  It does not matter. If it can kill someone it (0+ / 0-)

            should be banned. The points about pistols, assault rifles, the size of the bullet are not worth discussing

    •  We waited a couple of days after the last (14+ / 0-)

      one, and that got us to today.  How many will be killed in the next massacre because we waited?

      'The cause of gun control' might not be hurt a bit, but more human beings will die each day we wait.

    •  at the rate these things (9+ / 0-)

      are happening, a mall last week, a family shoot out before that, if we wait a couple days,  we only get a day or so to talk before we have to shut up again.  Clearly, respecting the grieving isn't fixing the problem.  Maybe we should respect them by making sure we don't add to the number of grieving every couple weeks.

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