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View Diary: Disband RKBA Today (344 comments)

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  •  It is better to engage them than quiet them. (10+ / 0-)

    Although they would love to HR to oblivion anyone who speaks out in favor of stricter registration and licensing, and I definitely don't support their tactics. I would prefer that you form a group here that is for implementing better gun laws and not restricting the voice of a group here.

    If you believe strongly in your conviction, then go to any diaries that promote gun control, and help fight against the RKBA rush.

    "If you don't sin, then Jesus died for nothing!" (on a sign at a Mardi Gras parade in New Orleans)

    by ranger995 on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:29:40 PM PST

    •  Have you ever tried to "engage" with people (13+ / 0-)

      in one of those diaries? Its not possible.

      "I smoke. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your fuckin' mouth." --- Bill Hicks

      by voroki on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:45:15 PM PST

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      •  I have often, and I have been HR'd for it. (16+ / 0-)

        I agree they are organized and they use strong bullying tactics.

        Just the other day they piled on me and knocked me down a bar. I am not going to stop standing up to them though.

        One always plays the nice guy while the rest take an aggressive attack approach. They bait and push and pry until you say something they can construe as HRable, then they pile on. Many people here know that, but they don't want to help out. That is what has to change.

        If we can't stand up to them here, how are we every going to get meaningful change?

        "If you don't sin, then Jesus died for nothing!" (on a sign at a Mardi Gras parade in New Orleans)

        by ranger995 on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:48:23 PM PST

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        •  But that's different. I'm all for standing up to (7+ / 0-)

          them I just won't waste my time on engaging them. Engaging implies to me trying to have a reasonable conversation in the hopes of changing minds and its not possible in those diaries.

          "I smoke. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your fuckin' mouth." --- Bill Hicks

          by voroki on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:53:20 PM PST

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          •  That's been my experience as well. (6+ / 0-)

            202-224-3121 to Congress in D.C. USE it! You can tell how big a person is by what it takes to discourage them. "We're not perfect, but they're nuts."--Barney Frank 01/02/2012

            by cany on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 05:00:22 PM PST

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          •  The place to engage them is not in THEIR (5+ / 0-)

            diaries, but in the diaries that they attempt to derail and shut down. It is better to let them have their diaries to themselves, better to engage in diaries that people post in support of stricter gun control laws.

            "If you don't sin, then Jesus died for nothing!" (on a sign at a Mardi Gras parade in New Orleans)

            by ranger995 on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 05:04:11 PM PST

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            •  They really always derail those diaries. (5+ / 0-)

              People need to school themselves to ignore their comments.

              Cats are better than therapy, and I'm a therapist.

              by Smoh on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 05:21:04 PM PST

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              •  Perhaps taking a different technique - try to get (0+ / 0-)

                more communication so Aurora and Virginia Tech don't happen again.

                I don't know the subtleties of what happened today - but mental health professionals have GOT TO COMMUNICATE better.

                I realize mental illness has quite a stigma, but it's nothing against a dead kid or 20.

                "I believe more women should carry guns. I believe armed women will make the world a better place. Women need to come to think of themselves not as victims but as dangerous." Anna Pigeon

                by glorificus on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 05:40:51 PM PST

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                •  Communicate what? I'm really confused. (0+ / 0-)

                  Cats are better than therapy, and I'm a therapist.

                  by Smoh on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 05:58:44 PM PST

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                  •  I believe in both the Virginia Tech and Aurora (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    BlackSheep1

                    cases (maybe Tucson also) the shooters were known to have mental heath issues but that info was not communicated to law enforcement or if it was, it was not taken seriously.

                    "I believe more women should carry guns. I believe armed women will make the world a better place. Women need to come to think of themselves not as victims but as dangerous." Anna Pigeon

                    by glorificus on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 06:51:04 PM PST

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                    •  The disclosure of personal health and behavioral (1+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      DeadHead

                      health information is protected by HIPAA.

                      HIPAA Privacy Rules for the Protection of Health and Mental Health Information

                      The Privacy Rule protects all “protected health information” (PHI), including individually identifiable health or mental health information held or transmitted by a covered entity in any format, including electronic, paper, or oral statements.
                      http://www.omh.ny.gov/...

                      The allow does allow disclosure at times:
                      Providers may disclose PHI that they believe necessary to prevent or lessen a serious and imminent physical threat to a person or the public, when such disclosure is made to someone they believe can prevent or lessen the threat (including the target of the threat).
                      But as someone who works in behavioral health, I can tell you that the improper disclosure of phi is a big deal.
              •  school themselves to ignore their comments (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                ranger995

                or avoid the thread.
                If the ReBeKAs are on a thread, I don't want to get on at all. That limits my enjoyment of the site because I don't come here to get in fights.

                If I ran this circus, things would be DIFFERENT!

                by CwV on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 06:07:13 PM PST

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        •  Yup. (6+ / 0-)

          If one person engages them alone, it doesn't go well.

          But if more people engage, using reasonable, un-impassioned  arguments, it can only improve the discourse.

          I blog about my daughter with autism at her website

          by coquiero on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:55:48 PM PST

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        •  so, how about that? They're kinda like a union (5+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          deedogg, kalmoth, VClib, ER Doc, sviscusi

          they stick together and stand up for what they believe is important, and they hold out for the rights of the individual as guaranteed in the Constitution.

          How much more illiberal can they be?

           Of course there's a call to ban them!

          Why, they don't swallow the "guns = evil" koolaid.

          They actually, you know, own and operate firearms. Legally. They even advocate that other people ought to be allowed to do so, and offer to help people who want to know more about firearms.

          LBJ, Lady Bird, Anne Richards, Barbara Jordan, Sully Sullenberger, Ike, Drew Brees, Molly Ivins --Texas is no Bush league! -7.50,-5.59

          by BlackSheep1 on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 08:59:40 PM PST

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          •  The problem isn't with their position wrt guns (0+ / 0-)

            ...as misguided as that might be.

            It's how they bully and game the system and gang up on people espousing a contrary opinion.

            And yes, such behavior in my opinion is illiberal.  Rather, it has much in common with what the incipient tea baggers did during Congressional town hall meetings in 2009: shout down those with whom you disagree. Perhaps you find that acceptable.  I don't.

            It's offensive. It's no wonder why some of the more prominent RKBAers are viewed so poorly. Many kossacks simply refuse to interact with them because of their aggressive and offensive tactics.  

      •  Yes, they make sure that discussion never takes (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ranger995, glorificus, CwV, john07801, Sandino

        Place.  They also seem to be able to be completely oblivious to their own nastiness.  I have had civil interactions (with a great deal of work) with some and they seem to actually believe they are reasonable. The only way discussion will take place is if we swallow our emotions and COMPLETLY ignore their comments.

        Cats are better than therapy, and I'm a therapist.

        by Smoh on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 04:53:44 PM PST

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      •  engage me. (9+ / 0-)

        I'm one of the original members. I rarely issue donuts in our diaries  and the only ones I've ever gotten were from Dickmath, one of or longest running and most obnoxious trolls.

        Plenty of pie gets thrown in our diaries, but there's light under the heat, and if everyone ignored the shit stirrers, the ratio would improve.

        --Shannon

        "It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." -- Emiliano Zapata Salazar
        "Dissent is patriotic. Blind obedience is treason." --me

        by Leftie Gunner on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 06:42:56 PM PST

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