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View Diary: Today everything changed at school. (183 comments)

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  •  Office level security (33+ / 0-)

    Actually the locked classrooms take it a level beyond that.  That is a fairly serious nuisance.  Are you guys sure the fire codes are ok?  (if the classrooms can be opened from the inside without a key, that's likely ok).

    It can help against some kinds of problems, at the cost of increased hassles with everyday legit activities.

    Unfortunately the problems such security DOES address (casual theft, or intrusion by parents or strangers into classrooms to disrupt them) probably weren't much of a problem given what you describe about the environment.   The locked classroom doors, in particular, don't seem to address any normal security concern beyond the "lone shooter" idea.

    What you described would not help very much against the kind of mass shooting we just saw.  The shooter went through an exterior locked door (shooting out the glass and stepping through).   The locked classroom doors are unlikely to be sturdy enough to withstand even kicking them in, although they'd slow things down a little.  If they're unusually strong they could reduce a shooter to shooting blindly through doors.   So I'm guessing these are a specific response to the recent shooting, rather than meeting an unmet security need that might come up aside from such an unusual event.

    The whole setup wouldn't help at all against a Columbine type shooting.  If the shooter goes to the school he'd know to attack during the change in periods, when all the doors are open and unlocked and the students mostly in the hallways.   Or at some recess or lunch period where classes aren't in session and lots of people are around.

    Well...at least if they're going to institute increased security, they chose one of the less expensive options, and one which, if managed reasonably, won't be too disruptive once everyone gets used to it.   It is sad though that your environment is more like a fort and less like a school though.

    •  You are aware that bulletproof doors exist, though (0+ / 0-)

      they are heavy and might be too heavy for students to open (100lb solid steel).  Also, blast doors could be installed that can be slammed down in case of an emergency though they would have to be strictly controlled as they will fatally crush anyone underneath them (as having sensors like in elevator doors would defeat the entire purpose of having them).

      You have watched Faux News, now lose 2d10 SAN.

      by Throw The Bums Out on Mon Dec 17, 2012 at 06:25:12 PM PST

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      •  If you build a school along the lines (25+ / 0-)

        of what you're proposing, it won't be a school, it will be a minimum-security prison.  I don't think that the answers to this problem will be found in changing the school end of the equation.

      •  We should install bullet proof doors (8+ / 0-)

        in every school?  How about the windows? Should there be doors or windows at all?

      •  Schools cannot buy enough books and supplies and (4+ / 0-)

        somehow they are going to afford several dozen bulletproof doors for every single school in the district?  

        Lots of things "can" be done.  Doing them, and whether that's really the right solution, is up for discussion.

        "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

        by YucatanMan on Mon Dec 17, 2012 at 08:37:09 PM PST

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        •  Anyways, it's not possible to harden every place (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          YucatanMan, AllisonInSeattle

          on the planet where kids are.  OK, so we turn the high school into Baghdad's Green Zone, but then the next guy takes his military weapon and shoots up the gym?  The YMCA?  The local mall?  It's only by dumb luck that we didn't have 26 dead teenagers at the Clackamas mall, which has really been overshadowed (understandably) by 26 dead kids and teachers.

          "The first drawback of anger is that it destroys your inner peace; the second is that it distorts your view of reality. If you come to understand that anger is really unhelpful, you can begin to distance yourself from anger." - The Dalai Lama

          by auron renouille on Mon Dec 17, 2012 at 09:35:17 PM PST

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          •  Yes, the solution is not to build fortresses (4+ / 0-)

            (or "secure the nation with Homeland Security).  The answer is to change the conditions under which we live.

            Freely available ammunition (ordering over the Internet, really?) and human killing machines is something that can change.

            Other nations have done it. So can we.  The fringe just has to give.  

            "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

            by YucatanMan on Mon Dec 17, 2012 at 09:41:40 PM PST

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        •  The (0+ / 0-)

          big high school where I teach has over 80 outside/in doors.  That is why detectors don't work--too many doors.  When you try to get 2000 students into one door only, it takes a lot of time.

      •  I don't think this is economical really. (0+ / 0-)

        I mean I get the idea in theory.  But keep in mind that so many school buildings on the East Coast and Midwest date from between the '20s and the '50s.  I'm to believe that a lot of buildings were built or rebuilt as public works during the Depression, but I stand to be corrected on that, I'm not an expert on the '30s.

        Reasonable security is definitely good, but sadly it's just not enough to prevent casualties against a guy armed like this. Even at an airport or even the Pentagon, security checkpoints are the point of vulnerability.  A person could charge the Department of Defense and inflict a lot of casualties with that kind of weapon.  The person would be stopped, eventually, and they wouldn't make it to the heart of the building, where they keep our super duper awesome top secret plan to invade Canada, but not before causing untold tragedy.  Lower the ability of the person to do mass carnage in a short amount of time and the fatalities are lower.  Other than that, we're going to be here again sooner or later.

        Although I've really become converted on the weapons issue, I'd also like to learn more from skilled psychologists about what's going on here.  Dealing harshly with the sorts of ordnance available to these people is important, but that's still not everything.  But it sounds like this guy managed to obliterate so much of his life and family that it's taking longer than "usual" to start to get that picture.

        There's something disgusting about there being a "usual" at all.

        "The first drawback of anger is that it destroys your inner peace; the second is that it distorts your view of reality. If you come to understand that anger is really unhelpful, you can begin to distance yourself from anger." - The Dalai Lama

        by auron renouille on Mon Dec 17, 2012 at 09:25:06 PM PST

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    •  Yes, there are other threats to children. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      PsychoSavannah, not this time

      Custody disputes can easily play out  at school.

      In areas where gangs and drug sales are an issue, it's deemed wise to limit access to the school, so people can't interact negatively with the students.

      Take back the House in 2014!!!!!!!!!!!! (50 state strategy needed)

      by mungley on Mon Dec 17, 2012 at 08:26:01 PM PST

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