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View Diary: High School Rape in a small American city (71 comments)

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  •  Rape is already a crime (2+ / 0-)
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    CA wildwoman, Sparhawk

    I think this sort of thinking is very misguided.  Rape is already considered a crime and people know it's wrong.  Telling people not to rape is a very pointless suggestion.  It's like saying in the wake of a school shooting that people should be told not to kill people.  It's simply an absolutely ineffective idea.

    Teaching people how to protect themselves from crime is not the same as condoning that crime.  If I went down to the worst part of town in a crimeridden city in the middle of the night and got victimized, that would be partially due to me putting myself in that situation. That does not excuse the perpetrators, but I would have been better served avoiding a situation where there is a high chance of something bad happening.

    Teaching people how to avoid potentially bad situations only makes sense.  The simple fact of the matter is not every single member of humanity is a noble person.  It's a dangerous world.  Ignoring that fact is simply naivety, and opens yourself up to being more likely to be victimized.

    •  Teaching people how to protect themselves (1+ / 0-)
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      jplanner

      makese sense.

      But it is an understanding of morality that needs teaching not simply saying "don't do that."

      "Do what you can with what you have where you are." - Teddy Roosevelt

      by Andrew C White on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 08:19:56 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Wow. Where to start. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Andrew C White, jplanner

      Yes Rape is a crime. The problem is that the word rape carries it's own cultural baggage.  People imaging rape as this brutal, violent thing that happens to virgins.

      The problem is that Rape isn't always what people imagine.

      Sometimes it's a crime of opportunity when a woman or man passes out, either because they drank too much or were given a drug.

      Then they cannot consent or withhold consent. Some people, whether sober or buzzed, think it's perfectly alright to take advantage of that state of unconsciousness or that state of semi-consciousness.

      Some people are taught, even in the 21st century that no means yes. Especially if she has already kissed you or made out with you, or is dressed provocatively. Heck if she follows you up to your room for a chat, then "We all know the score", and it's okay to jump on her, because her presence in your domicile is an open invitation.

      Some men have issues understanding or delineating between sexual flirtation and normal niceties. All you have to do is make eye contact with them, or be alone with them, and it's because "secretly" you want them. They just know it, and you will too in a moment soon.

      Rape can also be about coercion. Sexting suddenly turns into blackmail. Or maybe you really need that A, or  maybe you need that job, or maybe he will let you live, if you just don't fight him.

      It's not always this animalistic attack from nowhere on Polly Purelood, sometimes, it comes from people you thought you knew, they can be anyone in your life, simply waiting for the right moment when the two of you are alone and their best defense in court is to tell everyone how you were there with them willingly, maybe you even kissed them.

      So please, I am asking you to get a clue

    •  what you miss is that some young men don't know (0+ / 0-)

      the definition of rape

      Sure, people know that it is illegal and it is rape to assault a woman physically and violently and force sex on her while she screams and fights. That is the public picture of rape.

      Young men do need to be taught that they should never have sex with a drunk woman (or man) because she may be too drunk to consent. Rape is defined, IIRC, as when someone has penetrative sex with someone who CANNOT or does not give consent.

      SO young men ...and if I had a son I would tell him this...need to be told to NEVER have sex with a woman that is drunk. Because she may not be able to consent

      We can tell the young men that the women are over there being taught how to avoid those situations as well.

      Being told the legal definition of rape brings clarity

      That they are not being talked to and the women are is SYMBOLICALLY TROUBLING. Don't forget we very much live in and historically it was even worse (and still is in many parts of the world) a place where women are often blamed for rape. That is what their instructing on ly the women says...reaffrims message to all that its the woman's responsibility NOT the mans

      SO if you are going to lecture one of the two, lecture the potential perpertrators to take responsibilty. I could easily say to you that it is equally (to the fact that rape is a crime) know to most women how to avoid rape. I agree with all you said about why the women are talked to.

      They should be talked to though not exclusively but with the men. IT send a terrible message of "the women is to blame" the way they don't talk to the men. It supports old beliefs and stereotypes.

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