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View Diary: They planned to kill us "if deemed necessary." (290 comments)

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  •  And what if your wishes are not true? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    gramofsam1, Bush Bites

    What if it was a specific person who made the threats against OWS, not a "publicly-identified right wing group"?

    What if it was a known kook, someone who makes threats and doesn't follow up on them?

    Actually, re-reading your comment I'm not sure you were responding to my post.  Did you mean this for a different poster?

    Nothing is as evilly imaginative as the mind of a teenage gamer. -- Sychotic1

    by Sarea on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 11:47:32 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  Shouldn't have been hidden in the first place. (8+ / 0-)

      Citizens shouldn't have to dig through redacted, months-old FISA requests to learn that someone wishes them dead.

      If any wealthy VIP was under an assassination threat, they would be directly notified. Why all the secrecy?

      The whole decade needs an asterisk.

      by James Kresnik on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 12:44:11 PM PST

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      •  And why no arrests? (4+ / 0-)

        Why didn't the FBI arrest the right wing groups who were plotting these illegal activities?  

        Democratic Leaders must be very clear they stand with the working class of our country. Democrats must hold the line in demanding that deficit reduction is done fairly -- not on the backs of the elderly, the sick, children and the poor.

        by Betty Pinson on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 01:09:39 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Could have been part of an ongoing investigation. (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Bluesee, Adam B, Sarea

        You know the justice dept is worried about right wing nuts starting to bomb things, especially after the reelection.

        What if they have sources they want to protect? Or what if they don't want some Bubbas to know they're being watched?

        "Michael Moore, who was filming a movie about corporate welfare called 'Capitalism: A Love Story,' sought and received incentives."

        by Bush Bites on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 02:22:24 PM PST

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    •  The FBI knows who they are (5+ / 0-)

      and they need to identify the group publicly.  

      They also need to explain why, if these threats were real, no legal action was taken against the guilty parties.

      Democratic Leaders must be very clear they stand with the working class of our country. Democrats must hold the line in demanding that deficit reduction is done fairly -- not on the backs of the elderly, the sick, children and the poor.

      by Betty Pinson on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 01:08:02 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  OK now I understand what you're saying (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        mahakali overdrive, 6412093

        I think it was likely the case that the threats were investigated and were NOT considered serious.

        Think about all the threats to the President every month.  We don't know whether these threats were made online by someone ranting, or trying to get attention, etc.

        If a threat was made against me, I would want to know, of course!  But since, as many have pointed out here, there is no way to identify the "leaders" of OWS, we don't know whether or not these "leaders" were notified of the threats.  

        Nothing is as evilly imaginative as the mind of a teenage gamer. -- Sychotic1

        by Sarea on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 01:13:33 PM PST

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        •  Anyone actually targeted (5+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          suesue, Sarea, zett, Noor B, Williston Barrett

          should be notified, however, so that they can take appropriate legal action if need be.

          One of my close relatives was an Occupy organizer. I would like that person to be able to take out a suitable restraining order if need be against either an individual or else be assured protection for any threat, whether or not it came to fruition. If it was simply investigated, there is a right to know about this as well. We're talking about young people, by and large, simply protesting what they believe in.

          There's literally no reason that I can think of that if a threat were discovered by the FBI, that information would NOT be shared with the group targeted by the threat (that's more common with the CIA, not the FBI).

          Click the ♥ to join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news & views written from a black pov - everyone is welcome.

          by mahakali overdrive on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 01:26:43 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Yes, I agree (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            mahakali overdrive

            but I'm operating under the assumption that this wasn't a specific threat about a specific person, but rather a 'I wanna stand on the roof and take shots at the (unspecified) "leaders" of OWS' type of threat.

            Nothing is as evilly imaginative as the mind of a teenage gamer. -- Sychotic1

            by Sarea on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 01:55:25 PM PST

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            •  Every person commenting on this (5+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Sarea, Bluesee, nickrud, zett, dradams

              including myself is operating on some assumption or another.

              I hope they succeed in obtaining more of the documents so that there can be more information and less speculation all around.

              Click the ♥ to join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news & views written from a black pov - everyone is welcome.

              by mahakali overdrive on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 01:57:20 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  Bingo :) (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                mahakali overdrive

                Releasing partial information helps no one.  It stirs the pot, creates more questions than it answers, etc.

                I really hope that the OWS movement can communicate about this document dump clearly and effectively to the media, and stay unemotional and fact-driven.  It needs to be publicized and then investigated.  But if there is too much crazy cross-talk or hypothesizing, the media won't take them seriously (again).

                Nothing is as evilly imaginative as the mind of a teenage gamer. -- Sychotic1

                by Sarea on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 02:03:10 PM PST

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                •  I hope it encourages further (7+ / 0-)

                  information gathering.

                  And I agree with your point about stirring the pot. I do have to say, as a relative of an OWS organizer, that it's disconcerting. But it's also not surprising to me that anyone wanted to "kill" OWS folks. They made a conscious point to be provocative. I applaud that. They knew what they were doing. Thankfully, no one killed anyone. Still, I'd like to know who threatened that.

                  I also think that the amount of information redacted is unusual. All of Mississippi? Why?

                  I don't think Ms. Wolf's take on this accords with the documents I skimmed and have read now.

                  I hope that further information gathering is inspired by any sense of these documents upsetting people. I believe that could happen legally through FOIA's, but it could also happen -- whether we would like to see this or not -- via something like Wikileaks  and some Anon who are, of course, quite adept at intercepting these sorts of documents and then republishing them. I would hope that the legal path is honored, naturally.

                  Also, this is pretty much a classic experiment in Cloze reading. We use this with students when we teach them English. Any Linguist knows that "blank" information is filled in based on strongly, strongly subjective interpretations of it which are based in someone's pre-existing ideology and values. That's a basic neurocognitive fact of how people make meaning through language. I'm surprised no one has really brought this up yet. We will all inevitably read what we expect, or have learned, to read. Whether it's right or not. This is why I strongly oppose "fill-in-the-blank" type quiz questions for any assessment in education, ever, especially from the for-profit pseudo-groups run by ETS and the like. These are WIDELY critiqued on these very same grounds of subjective learning and neurocognition.

                  Click the ♥ to join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news & views written from a black pov - everyone is welcome.

                  by mahakali overdrive on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 02:21:55 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  very perceptive comment - thanks! (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    mahakali overdrive

                    I can't rate people anymore because KOS has decided I'm a bad boy....for acknowledging diaries or comments like this

                    Without geometry, life is pointless. And blues harmonica players suck.

                    by blindcynic on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 04:45:57 PM PST

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                    •  Do you know what you uprated? (0+ / 0-)

                      I can't even begin to imagine that there is anything in my comment which would remotely result in anyone receiving a NR. I'm not one to make hot-headed remarks or say things that fly in the face of site rules.

                      But I'm sorry to hear you've received a NR status although I don't know what you uprated. Have you tried talking to Kos about it? You might want to if you feel like it was out of line.

                      Click the ♥ to join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news & views written from a black pov - everyone is welcome.

                      by mahakali overdrive on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 05:26:15 PM PST

                      [ Parent ]

                  •  I think this redaction and release was purposeful (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Into The Woods

                    or stupid and sloppy.

                    < snark >

                    considering the high standard the FBI has for agents, how could this have possibly happened unless intentional.

                    < /snark >

                    This machine kills Fascists.

                    by KenBee on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 01:46:53 AM PST

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                •  Actually, it plays a significant role. (0+ / 0-)

                  Releasing partial information that raises more questions than it answers is a very effective means of creating doubt and fear in the minds of anyone that thinks they may have been targeted.

                  Call it a "chilling effect," if you will.

                  Atlas shrugged. Jesus wept.

                  by trevzb on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 07:54:23 AM PST

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        •  I need proof (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          JesseCW, Dirtandiron

          they must have been serious for them to have been included in the report.

          Making a threat of this nature is illegal.

          Democratic Leaders must be very clear they stand with the working class of our country. Democrats must hold the line in demanding that deficit reduction is done fairly -- not on the backs of the elderly, the sick, children and the poor.

          by Betty Pinson on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 01:29:36 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  if they are threatening to kill with sniper rifles (0+ / 0-)

          I want to know whether they still have the rifles and if so, why

      •  also, it may not have been a group (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        suesue

        It may have been a crazy random person.  And I think the phrase "death threat from someone in Texas" means something different to the FBI than "death threat from someone in Seattle."  Again, I'm stereotyping here, but something tells me that crazy death threats are more common in gun-crazy secessionist and gun-loving Texas.

        Nothing is as evilly imaginative as the mind of a teenage gamer. -- Sychotic1

        by Sarea on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 01:15:33 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

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