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View Diary: Text of the proposed 28th Amendment to the Constitution. (97 comments)

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  •  Lot of things we could use a new one for. (6+ / 0-)

    No reason a constitutional convention couldn't bring up multiple issues.

    The point is we need one, and this issue should not be dodged because "Nobody can agree".

    I don't blame Christians. I blame Stupid. Which sadly is a much more popular religion these days.

    by detroitmechworks on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 02:08:33 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  Not saying that we shouldn't do anything about gun (3+ / 0-)

      but repealing the 2nd is an extreme measure and there isn't a state in the union that would ban every firearm.

      My solutions to gun safety:
      1. Full enforcement of current gun laws and full funding.  Ram through head of ATF(hopefully with filibuster reform, that will be easier) and frame this needed funding as a "national security issue".
      2. Ban people on the Terrorist Watch List from owing any firearm, and add an Assault Weapons Ban with teeth that has civil penalties(i.e a gun tax) on anybody who keeps their now-banned assault weapons.   Add buybacks and tax credits to those who give up their Bushmasters and etc.  Frame anybody opposed to this as being soft on terrorism.
      3. 72-hour background checks and records of background checks must be kept on file for 5 years.
      4. Develop smart trigger locks that will engage if the gun owner's BAC is over .08

      Washington and Colorado said that you've got to legalize it. Hope the DOJ respects that.

      by pistolSO on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 02:17:50 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  With the current political climate, it's necessary (6+ / 0-)

        All those are great ideas, but will be blocked by the second amendment.

        Pull the plug and let's start some REAL gun control work.

        I don't blame Christians. I blame Stupid. Which sadly is a much more popular religion these days.

        by detroitmechworks on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 02:19:34 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Those ideas are not blocked by the 2nd amendment. (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          pistolSO, AuntieRa, Adam B

          There's nothing in the 2nd amendment that says we can't have reasonable safety regulations on guns.
          The NRA is what is in the way.
          First thing that has to happen is for there to be a new national organization that is pro-gun ownership but is not a front for the gun industry, and that supports reasonable regulations.

          This would significantly curtail the power of the NRA.
          Then it would be possible to get decent gun regulations as well a a much serious, more adult attitude about gun ownership.
          Trying to repeal the 2nd amendment would:
          1. Fail.
          Let me repeat: It would fail.
          2. Convince the idiots that they were right in worrying about their 2nd amendment rights.
          3. It would divert effort and funds, political capital, etc. away from actual meaningful controls and at best cause years of purposeless, unfruitful bickering.

          It's much better to divide the pro-guns segment of the population. Separate the responsible adults from the gun whacks, KKK types and paranoid hysterics who like to play army. Create a meaningful debate in this country about gun worship, gun fetishism and gun addiction as opposed to gun ownership, collecting, connoisseurship, and sport.

          I appreciate the desire for peace, but this will produce no progress in that direction. Sooner or later, this whole gun violence sickness in this country will subside, and we can do things to speed that process.

          You can't make this stuff up.

          by David54 on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 02:55:55 PM PST

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          •  I disagree completely. (4+ / 0-)

            This is within the states ability to fix.  It merely requires political will.

            I quite honestly could care less about the "Power" of the NRA.  When they lose their trump card, they will lose their power.

            It's time to stop trying to kill them with papercuts.

            I don't blame Christians. I blame Stupid. Which sadly is a much more popular religion these days.

            by detroitmechworks on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 03:00:38 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  I disagree with this in part (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Glen The Plumber

            I don't know whether a repeal of the 2nd would fail. It would fail right now, but things might look very different several years down the road. Sandy Hook is not going to be the last mass gun murder.

            A movement to repeal the 2nd could energize all sorts of gun control efforts rather than drain them. Again I would suggest a parallel to the ERA (the Equal Rights Amendment), which helped energize a generation of American women to change our status in the society, even though its ratification was blocked by the right. There were similar arguments back about whether the ERA would "drain energy" from things like domestic violence shelters and women's health and reproductive freedom. It did not - quite the opposite.

      •  Wonderful ideas (5+ / 0-)

        none of which will be upheld by SCOTUS so long as there's a Second Amendment.  That's the point.

        Repealing the Second Amendment bans nothing.  It just eliminates the existing ban (for all intents and purposes) of any common sense regulation of firearms.

        "Power concedes nothing without a demand; it never has and it never will."—Frederick Douglass

        by costello7 on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 02:24:40 PM PST

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        •  I don't see SCOTUS overturning 1 or 2 (0+ / 0-)

          Item 1 was make sure current laws are enforced and make sure they have all the funding they need and make sure things are properly staffed.   I think we are going to finally get a new head of the ATF(after six years of not having one).   The gun lobbyists will fight but there is no 2nd Amendment issue and the majority of the NRA members would support it.

          Item 2 is based on one item that the majority of the NRA supports(banning those on the Terrorist Watch List from having a gun) and the second is based on what the majority of SCOTUS did by upholding the PPACA.   If you have those two things together, do you really think a majority of the Supreme Court will make a decision that puts weapons in the hands of Al Queda?    Can you imagine the public outrage if SCOTUS says that Al Queda has a right to have a Bushmaster .223?

          Item 3 is just an upgrade to existing laws and if other public records have to be archived, this should pass muster.   Item 4 is just an idea of mine to reduce using firearms while intoxicated.

          Washington and Colorado said that you've got to legalize it. Hope the DOJ respects that.

          by pistolSO on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 02:46:25 PM PST

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          •  What Scalia et al will say: (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Glen The Plumber, atana

            1.  Court will not take up the issue, because it is not a constitutional question.  Will delegate to congress, which will continue to filibuster and not bring the issue to a vote.

            2.  Court will rule that the public has a right to maintain arms.  They will also default to the "Presumption of Innocence" defense.

            3.  Court will overturn law on the grounds that the 2nd amendment "shall not be infringed."  Infringed will be taken at the most liberal interpretation, and infringement will include "Unnecessary burdens upon owners."

            4.  Probably something about a tax without representation, if they don't regurgitate their argument from #3

            I don't blame Christians. I blame Stupid. Which sadly is a much more popular religion these days.

            by detroitmechworks on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 02:57:16 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  I honestly believe (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            eru, atana

            the current SCOTUS will overturn any gun regulation that comes before them, including any law currently in place should such a law be challenged--all the while insisting that they aren't saying there can be no regulations on firearms.

            I also think the NRA is fully in support of any terrporist or terrorist group owning and buying as many guns as they like, even if they say otherwise.  They are a lobbyist group working on behalf of gun manufacturers and their goal is the sale of as many guns as possible without regard to who is doing the purchasing.

            "Power concedes nothing without a demand; it never has and it never will."—Frederick Douglass

            by costello7 on Sun Dec 30, 2012 at 03:00:28 PM PST

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          •  If you were to ban those (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            pistolSO

            on the 'Terrorist Watch List' from having a gun, it would necessitate making the names on the list public. Or at least informing individuals that they're on that list. This has not been the practice, most people - i.e., Ted Kennedy - don't find out they're on the list until and unless they try to board a plane.

            Not that I'd be averse to making the list public. That would certainly cause some ruckus and ripples through society as people find out they're on the list and come back with serious lawsuits because they don't belong there. Damage to livelihoods for innocents on the list would be very real, after all.

    •  And that's a problem with a Con Con (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Sparhawk

      Could also enshrine the ability of states to place further restrictions on abortion, or a right to religious exemptions to neutral laws, or walk back the 4th and 5th Amendments further ...

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