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View Diary: Who won? (54 comments)

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  •  We'll find out in two months (7+ / 0-)

    This deal can only be evaluated when we know what is or (I hope) is not bargained away in the impending debt ceiling deal. As it stands now, the deal protects people with $250K to $450K of taxable income, after deductions, with cuts still looming to already-gutted federal functions. If it gets worse in two months, as it may well, it's hard to see any of this as good.

    I'm also a lawyer, but I'm first and foremost a citizen and a Democrat. I don't really appreciate the suggestion that only the insiders at the table have the right to discuss the deal. In this negotiation we (the American people and the Democratic base) are not just outsiders, we are the client in your analogy. And we are the ones who will bear the costs of whatever the deal gives up. We've been giving up ground for 40 years now. I think we're well within our rights to question if the deal is a good one, all things considered.

    Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

    by fenway49 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 at 09:08:54 AM PST

    •  And the House Republicans (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      MPociask, elwior, rudy23

      did not vote to "raise taxes." The 85 who voted yes were voting for a bill that lowered taxes from the rates that took effect when the ball dropped in Times Square.

      We can debate this bill vs. no deal, but I hardly find the argument that 89 Senators voted for this bill compelling evidence that it's good for the American people. The Iraq war resolution passed 77-23.

      Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

      by fenway49 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 at 09:14:00 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Excellent comment. n/t (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      hester, elwior, rudy23

      A waist is a terrible thing to mind.

      by edg on Thu Jan 03, 2013 at 09:55:24 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Excellent comments. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      elwior, rudy23

      I too was a bit put off by idea that "my negoitator" knows best for me.  Indeed, we are the clients, and I will full well put my nose inside the tent.

      From a certain perspective, and using the analogy, clients putting their noses into the talks was critical.  There was no chained CPI and no increase in retirement age because clients in mass said "no way" to the White House through our representatives (yes, the analogy is getting strained).

      I hope that both Pelosi and Obama realize that they cannot rely on just republican votes to put in any kind of "austerity" budget.  And if the current bill is any sign, then maybe we are looking at much more assertive and aggressive Dem lawmakers who will not simply roll over to Obama's give-aways or go along with Pelosi when she says that chained CPI for gawdsakes will strengthen social security.  

      •  You're kidding, right? (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        rudy23, jello5929

        Obama offered chained CPI, and he was fully prepared to give it up.  It's not the Dems in Congress you have to thank that it didn't pass, it's the Republicans.  The House GOP rejected that offer.

        They rejected it because they know they can get it again in two months when Obama doesn't have the leverage of an automatic tax increase hanging over their heads.

        •  Were you replying to me? (0+ / 0-)

          It doesn't seem so. I basically agree with you, though I'll wait and see if he keeps his vow not to give anything up for the debt ceiling.

          Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

          by fenway49 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 at 12:07:06 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  Sorry (0+ / 0-)

          I see what you were replying to now.

          Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

          by fenway49 on Thu Jan 03, 2013 at 12:07:44 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

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