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View Diary: Dick Durbin's new Social Security reform commission (Social Security Defenders blogathon) (205 comments)

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  •  The long game.... (13+ / 0-)

    The VSP want SS to BE welfare (or perhaps they'd like to call it a guaranteed minimum income for seniors). No more,no less. What Durbin and this admin. don't seem to get is that too many other VSPs oppose welfare or guaranteed minimum incomes for anyone. The greedheads and no-nothing libertarian crowd are the barbarians at the gate and Durbin/Obama bipartisanship is providing room for them inside. Bad politics,bad policy. The same mixture that has played out over and over again but most especially the past 40 years.  

    "George RR Martin is not your bitch" ~~ Neil Gaiman

    by tardis10 on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 08:30:59 AM PDT

    •  And say totally good-bye to older voters (10+ / 0-)

      Do you think middle class seniors already concerned about whether their assets are going to last long enough are going to accept having all the payroll taxes they paid for 45 years diverted to a poverty program??

      You could make voters so angry about this that they take their wrath out on all poverty programs.  You want to create more Reagan Democrats, we might start calling them Ryan Democrats, this is how to do it.

      •  The senior vote (5+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        KBO, tardis10, orlbucfan, aliasalias, Just Bob

        A lot of that vote has been lost already, I believe.

        This will hurt current seniors but the people who get hurt the most, imho, are people in their 50s who have had no time to plan for this, have paid into these programs for decades and it's almost like Cyprus, reaching in and taking away things promised and paid for.

        But even more, the younger generations will be screwed.  They get the full effect of the COLA cuts, compounded, the higher retirement ages (assuming they bump them up again) and an even bigger thing is the way the neoliberal policies have made profound changes to our economy and jobs situation.  As we can see from the sudden realizations of the media, retirees won't be able to retire anymore.  They won't clear out of the job market, making more jobs available for the younger people behind them.  This is a paradigm change and it hurts the youth the most, imho.  Yes, they have more time to plan for weaker retirement programs from the govt. but how are they supposed to save when they can't get good jobs, the job market is clogged up with older workers, they are saddled with student loans, and  the financial system for their entire working lives so far has been corrupt and our government has admitted that they basically can't stop them.  For us, at least we had some time during our working careers when you could still save and invest your money.  Now the small investor is just prey.

        "Justice is a commodity"

        by joanneleon on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 09:23:30 AM PDT

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        •  This is just the same old sad (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          tardis10, joanneleon

          tale that has played out through human history. Its ending is always bad and stained w/the blood of innocents. The one weapon we have is the innertubz. We can connect & inform/educate each other. Didn't have it 13 years ago when Cheney/Bush stole the election.

          Some people make u want to change species! --ulookarmless, quoted w/his permission: RIP good man.

          by orlbucfan on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 11:26:56 AM PDT

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    •  VSP (8+ / 0-)

      = very serious people?

      You make some really important points on making room for the "barbarians". That is what is happening.  There is a reason why Social Security has been the third rail.  Sensible Democrats know that this is one of the few things where you allow no breach.  None.

      But our pragmatic friends don't understand that.  They call us ideologues and use a broad brush, relegating us to the fringe far left.  The truth of the matter is very different.  We are pragmatic and reasonable on a lot of things. But not on Social Security.  Our pragmatic friends are so pliable that they would let the gates be breached and have no sense at all of slippery slopes, etc.  They could use a spoonful of ideology once in awhile and a principle or two. This is not an all or nothing type thing.  You can hold the line on some things and compromise on others.  

      "Justice is a commodity"

      by joanneleon on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 09:16:00 AM PDT

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      •  When pragmatism is a synonym for moral and (5+ / 0-)

        political imbecility, you end up with what my sig says:

        If Republicans said every 3rd person named "Smith" should hang, we'd bargain them to every 7th. Then we'll see apologia written praising this most pragmatic compromise. There's our losing formula.

        by Jim P on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 10:12:34 AM PDT

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      •  Any true pragmatist should see that (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        joanneleon, aliasalias

        the US ongoing inequality crisis means that SS benefits need to be raised. (among other things) A focus on how to accomplish those goals would be most pragmatic. A goal of "beggar thy neighbor" accomplishes nothing useful unless you happen to live next door to Lloyd Blankfein.

        "George RR Martin is not your bitch" ~~ Neil Gaiman

        by tardis10 on Tue Mar 26, 2013 at 10:50:43 AM PDT

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