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View Diary: Nothing Says Freedom Like Laws Requiring Gun Ownership (85 comments)

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  •  Nonsense. (0+ / 0-)

    If the collectivist interpretation of the second amendment were correct, then sure.  But it isn't.

    Your end of the Constitution is sinking.

    by happymisanthropy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 12:52:18 PM PDT

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    •  I bet people in Nelson will sleep well now. (0+ / 0-)

      Don't you agree?

      Suggested liberal gun lovers' motto: "More liberal than the NRA on everything except guns."

      by Bob Johnson on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 12:54:06 PM PDT

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      •  I've never heard (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Utahrd

        from people in other cities with such laws who lie awake at night.  

        However, I imagine keeping a regular sleep schedule and avoiding stress around bedtime is more effective.

        Your end of the Constitution is sinking.

        by happymisanthropy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 01:05:13 PM PDT

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        •  As I note, above, I bet the burglarly rate drops (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          LilithGardener

          ... 33% in the next year in Nelson (from 3 to 2).

          Suggested liberal gun lovers' motto: "More liberal than the NRA on everything except guns."

          by Bob Johnson on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 01:09:12 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  And, of course, the NRA will tout this statistic (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            a2nite, LilithGardener

            ... a press release under the headline:

            Georgia town cuts burglary rate 33% with mandatory gun ownership law

            Suggested liberal gun lovers' motto: "More liberal than the NRA on everything except guns."

            by Bob Johnson on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 01:10:55 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  now that everybody knows (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              a2nite, LilithGardener

              everybody in town has a gun, the burglary rate will increase significantly, the Willie Sutton rule for guns.  Everyone in the greater Atlanta area that needs a gun for a driveby shooting or some armed robbery will head to Nelson to get one.

              •  Meh. (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Utahrd

                -How many more people are going to comply with this law who don't already have guns?
                -Does the law specify handguns?  Criminals don't have much use for rifles.
                -Burglars tend to be more worried about meeting an armed homeowner than they are of meeting a cop.

                Your end of the Constitution is sinking.

                by happymisanthropy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 01:19:15 PM PDT

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                •  read the local news reports (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Bob Johnson, LilithGardener

                  about what gets stolen in break ins around north Georgia, where I live.   Rifles, shot guns, are just as popular as handguns. Mostly it's the money for fencing them that counts.  

                  •  It's a good market, what with suggested mandatory (3+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    jfromga, a2nite, LilithGardener

                    ... ownership of weapons on the docket!

                    Suggested liberal gun lovers' motto: "More liberal than the NRA on everything except guns."

                    by Bob Johnson on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 01:30:43 PM PDT

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                  •  but regardless (0+ / 0-)

                    they aren't being used to murder people.

                    Your end of the Constitution is sinking.

                    by happymisanthropy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 01:37:11 PM PDT

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                    •  actually they are, (2+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      a2nite, LilithGardener

                      just not the usual choice in gang related murders, but people up here are happy to shoot each other with shotguns and rifles as well as handguns.  

                      City folks may be more particular about their killing, we aren't.

                      •  asdf (1+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        Utahrd
                        Everyone in the greater Atlanta area that needs a gun for a driveby shooting or some armed robbery will head to Nelson to get one.
                        cannot be reconciled with
                        just not the usual choice in gang related murders, but people up here are happy to shoot each other with shotguns and rifles as well as handguns.  

                        City folks may be more particular about their killing, we aren't.

                        Your end of the Constitution is sinking.

                        by happymisanthropy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 01:56:54 PM PDT

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                        •  one was snark (1+ / 0-)
                          Recommended by:
                          LilithGardener

                          I was replying to Bob Johnson afterall, but you apparently don't have the snark meter on.

                          The other was a statement of fact,  guns are a popular target of burglaries around here, they bring good money, regardless of type.

                          Guns are ubiquitous around here,  you hear gunfire pretty regularly, you should just assume most people have a gun of some sort on their person, in their truck or home. So no, a rule like Nelson's doesn't really matter.But  to try to argue that the city council was doing anything to defend people's constitutional rights is an absurdity, they were grandstanding to the crowd.

                          •  So, would it be almost ordinary? (2+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            jfromga, WakeUpNeo

                            For example, for some troubled young person to shoot their parent 4x about 9AM on a weekday and someone who heard it, might not bother to call the police?

                            "They did not succeed in taking away our voice" - Angelique Kidjo - Opening the Lightning In a Bottle concert at Radio City Music Hall in New York City - 2003

                            by LilithGardener on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 02:38:59 PM PDT

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                          •  yes, that might be ordinary (1+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            LilithGardener

                            If it clearly came from inside someone's house, probably someone would call, but if it was just an echo and you weren't sure where it was, a yard or a house or out across the road somewhere, then nobody would call.  In an apartment building or in the shopping areas, something like that in town, it would be more likely someone would call.  

                •  Have you polled burglars? (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  a2nite, WakeUpNeo
                  -Burglars tend to be more worried about meeting an armed homeowner than they are of meeting a cop.

                  Suggested liberal gun lovers' motto: "More liberal than the NRA on everything except guns."

                  by Bob Johnson on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 01:29:59 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I haven't. (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Bob Johnson, Utahrd
                    Rengert and Wasilchick's book about how burglars work reveals that fear of armed homeowners played a major role in determining burglary targets. Burglars reported that they avoided late-night burglaries because, "That's the way to get shot." [FN63] Some burglars said that they shun burglaries in neighborhoods with people of mostly a different race because, "You'll get shot if you're caught there." [FN64]

                    The most thorough study of burglary patterns was a St. Louis survey of 105 currently active burglars. [FN65] The authors observed, "One of the most serious risks faced by residential burglars is the possibility of being injured or killed by occupants of a target. Many of the offenders we spoke to reported that this was far and away their greatest fear." [FN66] Said one burglar: "I don't think about gettin' caught, I think about gettin' gunned down, shot or somethin'...'cause you get into some people's houses...quick as I come in there, boom, they hit you right there. That's what I think about."

                    In 1982, the town of Kennesaw, Georgia, passed an ordinance requiring every home to have a gun. [FN89] Exceptions were made for conscientious objectors, people with criminal records, and for people in various other categories. [FN90] In the seven months before the ordinance, there had been forty-five residential burglaries; in the seven months after the ordinance, residential burglaries declined eighty-nine percent. [FN91] Over the next five years, the residential burglary rate in Kennesaw was eighty-five percent below the rate before the enactment of the ordinance. [FN92]

                    The ordinance may not have actually changed gun ownership patterns much in Kennesaw. The mayor estimated that even before the ordinance, about *358 five of every six Kennesaw homes contained a gun. [FN93] But the publicity surrounding the Kennesaw law may have served as a very powerful warning to persons contemplating a residential burglary in that town: any homeowner confronted during a burglary would almost certainly be armed.

                    Your end of the Constitution is sinking.

                    by happymisanthropy on Tue Apr 02, 2013 at 01:54:58 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

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