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View Diary: Exxon's Skies: Why Is Exxon Controlling the No-Fly Zone Over Arkansas Tar Sands Spill? (219 comments)

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  •  knowledge is a good thing (8+ / 0-)

    Exxon has not declared a no-fly zone.  The FAA has issued a temporary flight restriction.

    The FAA recognizes the necessity to limit air traffic in a very small area around an oil spill (as with many other emergency response situations).  The FAA issues a temporary flight restriction for safety of flight reasons.  

    FAA air traffic controllers still control the airspace.  If a nonparticipating pilot violates the airspace, the nasty letter will come from the FAA.

    Someone needs to be in charge of who gets waivers to the airspace for operational reasons; that someone is the incident commander on the ground (just how it is done for forest fires etc.).  How else would the FAA know who to authorize into the restricted area without asking the guy who is coordinating the response?

    "They let 'em vote, smoke, and drive -- even put 'em in pants! So what do you get? A -- a Democrat for President!" ~ Faster, Pussycat! Kill! Kill!

    by craiger on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 07:25:46 AM PDT

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    •  the newspaper article in the post disagrees (8+ / 0-)

      The Arkansas Democrat-Gazette revealed that the FAA site noted earlier today that "only relief aircraft operations under direction of Tom Suhrhoff" were allowed within the designated no fly zone.

      Suhrhoff is not an FAA employee: he works for ExxonMobil as an "Aviation Advisor" and formerly worked as a U.S. Army pilot for 24 years, according to his LinkedIn page.

      Lynn Lunsford, an FAA spokesman, told Dow Jones a no fly zone was issued because "at least one" helicopter was needed to move clean-up crews around, as well as to spot oil that can't be seen from the ground.

      Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell. --Edward Abbey

      by greenbastard on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 07:28:08 AM PDT

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      •  You're not paying attention (5+ / 0-)

        It's even starting to look like yourself and others here in a panic over this are purposefully ignoring the facts.

        This is NOT a no-fly zone. It's a temporary restriction 1000 feet AGL and below.  If you keep saying it's a no-fly zone it becomes clear that you are ignoring the facts and you should basically be ignored.

        Come on, join the rest of us in reality.

        [Terrorists] are a dime a dozen, they are all over the world and for every one we lock up there will be three to take his place. --Digby

        by rabel on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 08:08:15 AM PDT

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        •  what you call it isn't the point (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          shaharazade, mrkvica, elwior, madhaus

          the point is they need to get a move-on with this, from the article in the post:

          "This also means press is prohibited from the area, though Lunsford told Dow Jones that the FAA "is in the process of amending the restriction to allow news media aircraft into the area.""

          From the Gulf Disaster, we know that the current trend is  cut off access to control the story.

          Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell. --Edward Abbey

          by greenbastard on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 08:11:03 AM PDT

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          •  Yep (3+ / 0-)

            You're refusing to pay attention.

            Press is not prohibited from the area.  Press, and everyone else who doesn't get clearance, are prohibited from flying aircraft in the area below 1000'. As far as I know you are welcome to wander in to the area on foot and to fly your aircraft at 1001' anywhere you like.

            Seriously, I refuse to try to explain things or attempt to have a rational discussion about the current situation with people like yourself who completely reject the reality of the situation and are refusing to pay attention.

            [Terrorists] are a dime a dozen, they are all over the world and for every one we lock up there will be three to take his place. --Digby

            by rabel on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 08:23:50 AM PDT

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            •  I quoted the FAA person from the article (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              elwior, madhaus

              so you are fed up with them, not me:

              "This also means press is prohibited from the area, though Lunsford told Dow Jones that the FAA "is in the process of amending the restriction to allow news media aircraft into the area.""

              That is what I copied from the article, and you are the one mistakenly taking their quote out of context to mean all the area, and not the no fly zone area, which is how the FAA person described it as well.

              Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell. --Edward Abbey

              by greenbastard on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 08:33:43 AM PDT

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              •  Really? (4+ / 0-)

                You're going to run with this ignorance?

                So now the FAA can restrict media from the ground as well? You do realize that FAA is the Federal Aviation Administration, right? They don't have any ability to limit people on the ground. You also refuse to acknowledge that this is a limitation on aircraft 1000'AGL and below.

                You apparently are too dense to recognize this isn't a no-fly zone, it's simply restricted access 1000' and below. I'm done with you and your conspiracies, fantasies and frankly outright delusional thinking and voluntary ignorance. You refuse to understand and that makes you just as dangerous and irresponsible as any oil executive trying to squeeze out another dollar by raping the land and lying to the people.  Good day.

                [Terrorists] are a dime a dozen, they are all over the world and for every one we lock up there will be three to take his place. --Digby

                by rabel on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 08:41:59 AM PDT

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                •  you say you won't continue to argue (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  elwior

                  but then you keep doing it, and you keep arguing with yourself because I never said anything about it being on the ground, nor did the FAA person from the article I quoted.

                  When the FAA person stated, ""This also means press is prohibited from the area," I didn't say they meant the ground, nor is that their implication. It is yours alone.

                  Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell. --Edward Abbey

                  by greenbastard on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 09:01:55 AM PDT

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                  •  Please get a clue. When the FAA referred (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Larsstephens, Otteray Scribe

                    to "this area", they're talking the area IN THE AIR LESS THAN 1000 FEET.

                    This kind of absolutely silly - no, make that stupid - chicken little type crap is the weakest part of the progressive movement.  Too many people are similar to the redstaters, and won't let go of their conspiracy or plutocracy theories even when the facts slap them in the face.  How ridiculous a  few of you are being.  And solely because you couldn't accept sensible explanations in the beginning, but just kept digging your hole deeper and deeper and now when faced with how silly you've been, can not face admitting it.  

                    "If you trust you are not critical; if you are critical you do not trust" by our own Dauphin

                    by gustynpip on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:12:42 AM PDT

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                    •  rAmen!!! (0+ / 0-)

                      "Double, double, toile and trouble; Fire burne, and Cauldron bubble... By the pricking of my Thumbes, Something wicked this way comes": Republicans!!. . Willkommen im Vierten Reich! Sie haben keine Bedeutung mehr.

                      by Bluefin on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 01:48:34 PM PDT

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      •  no it doesn't (4+ / 0-)

        Tom Suhrhoff did not declare a no-fly zone.  The FAA issued a temporary flight restriction.  Tom Suhrhoff is the guy who the FAA has designated to approve waivers into the restricted area, which is not the same as controlling the airspace.  Tom Suhrhoff has no enforcement powers.  He is not sitting at a radar scope issuing air traffic clearances.

        "They let 'em vote, smoke, and drive -- even put 'em in pants! So what do you get? A -- a Democrat for President!" ~ Faster, Pussycat! Kill! Kill!

        by craiger on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 08:13:27 AM PDT

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        •  only Exxon's people are allowed (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          elwior

          from the article:

          "FAA site noted earlier today that "only relief aircraft operations under direction of Tom Suhrhoff" were allowed within the designated no fly zone.

          Suhrhoff is not an FAA emploee"

          So while that dude isn't directing the traffic, only people he designates as his traffic get in.

          Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell. --Edward Abbey

          by greenbastard on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 08:24:49 AM PDT

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          •  situation normal (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Mad Season, gustynpip, Otteray Scribe

            This is how TFRs work.  Whether it's for an air show, a forest fire, or an oil spill.  Or gas plumes, or blasting operations, or ...

            Is this the first you've heard of TFRs?  Are you going to get this up in arms about all TFRs?  The FAA has already issued six new ones just today in CA, AZ, MN, and TX.  Three of them with corporate contacts for flight waivers:

            KEETAC LARRY SCHMELZER TELEPHONE 218-778-8739 IS IN CHARGE OF ON SCENE EMERGENCY RESPONSE ACTIVITY. MINNEAPOLIS ZMP ARTCC TELEPHONE 651-463-5580 IS THE FAA COORDINATION FACILITY.
            NORTH SHORE MINING COMPANY COMMUNICATION, TELEPHONE 218-827-2018, OR SECURITY TELEPHONE 218-827-2021, IS IN CHARGE OF THE OPERATION. MINNEAPOLIS ARTCC ZMP /651-463-5580, IS THE FAA COORDINATION FACILITY.
            FLORIDA GAS TRANSMISSIONS TELEPHONE 713-303-4315 IS IN CHARGE OF ON SCENE EMERGENCY RESPONSE ACTIVITY. HOUSTON /ZHU ARTCC TELEPHONE 281-230-5560 IS THE FAA COORDINATION FACILITY.

            "They let 'em vote, smoke, and drive -- even put 'em in pants! So what do you get? A -- a Democrat for President!" ~ Faster, Pussycat! Kill! Kill!

            by craiger on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 08:37:53 AM PDT

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