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View Diary: Republicans embrace Social Security cuts they'll blame on Obama (294 comments)

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  •  Here's why (5+ / 0-)

    The lobbying system.  It has nothing to do with Democrats being Democrats.  So long as we fight against the lobbying system and remove the strange hold (i.e. demanding a minimum of a one year moratorium or ban on all lobbying to members of Congress), then at least we can be able to allow the Democrats we elect to be able to communicate with constituents rather than lobbying groups.

    The problem is, lobbying has a strange hold on democracy because the system which it stands now, even with past lobbying rules underway during the 2007-2008 years, still is flawed and members of Congress are getting pressured by lobbying groups (i.e. pro-gun Democrats) like the NRA and others to vote a certain way on a piece of legislation.  The job of Congress is to serve constituents, not lobbying groups.  Lobbying groups do have a dialog to play in the process but telling a Congressman or Senator to vote a certain way or else suffer no campaign contributions is putting a strange hold on democracy.

    And your argument seems to be missing a few things:  Senators Jeff Merkley, Tom Udall, Elizabeth Warren, three very progressive U.S. Senators who are fighting the chained CPI and are real fighters so perhaps you may want to communicate with them rather than threatening on not voting or thinking Democrats don't give a damn.  I'm a progressive Democrat and I continue on with my fight.  We've got more progressives in Congress now than even in years and they're continuing to fight.

    Also, even if chained CPI is passed, it can still be repealled

    I'll be DAMNED if we Democrats don't fire our base up in 2014 and defeat the GOP.  If this doesn't happen, I blame us on Daily Kos and others in the progressive community more than I blame the people in Congress.  I've lived through 2004 when John Kerry didn't get elected president and the progressive base wasn't as fired up but you know, that was basically a vote for four more years of Bush in office and screwing up the U.S. even more.  Then of course 2010 came and the Democrats had the worse PR campaign on the Affordable Health Care Act and did not fight hard enough against the Tea Party.  We lost Russ Feingold, one of our greatest progressive heroes who would fight with Jeff Merkley, Tom Udall and Elizabeth Warren against chained CPI today.  Feingold lost the election to Mr. Dickhead U.S. Senator Ron Johnson (aka the man who couldn't even complete his MBA degree due to not finishing his thesis). We can't afford another 2004 or 2010.

    We need to start fighting now and by that, we need to continue focusing on getting more Democrats elected and particularly defeating more GOP in Congress.  You don't want to fight?  Good.  That means more brain dead GOP being elected and our democracy failing.

    •  Repealed, oh yeah, like the 80's cuts (5+ / 0-)

      I am fighting now.  I am fighting against these cuts and I will definitely hold any party that passes them accountable.

      If Senator Franken wants my vote in 2014, he'll stop them.  It's his choice.   I mean he's doesn't have to pass anything new.  He doesn't need 60 votes.  All he has to do is defend the status quo and stop this budget proposal from being enacted.  

      •  80's cuts? (0+ / 0-)

        What on earth are you talking about?  I'm talking about lobbying.

        •  You said it could be repealed (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          denise b, Paper Cup, Patango

          That's a fantasy.  Let me cut your Social Security benefits now and I'll repeal the cuts later.   Ah, no.  I'm old, I'm not cognitively impaired.

          I mean if the Democrats want to show me they really care, why don't they repeal the 80's deal that raised the retirement age for Boomers?  But I am not asking for that.  I'm just saying you already screwed me in that deal and that is the last time you get away with it.  You can do it.  I will not vote for you if you do.

          •  Wait just a second (0+ / 0-)

            I'm talking about LOBBYING.  You can't repeal lobbying.  Put a moratorium or ban on lobbying.  Repealing means you're repealing previous pieces of legislation.

            I think you're getting way too carried away on cuts for social security and not understanding exactly what I'm talking about here.

            Lobbying is an issue completely separate from social security and such.  However, it does have a strange hold on how Democrats and GOP run things.  Ever note how difficult it is to even get a piece of reasonable gun control laws passed?

            What's the reason?  You guessed it, lobbying groups like the NRA breathing down Congress's neck.

            But what we need to make sure is that lobbying doesn't control Congress.  Congress is above lobbying.  That's what needs to be in the argument and if we can translate it into reality, then maybe we don't need to deal with the DLC or beltway Democrats anymore as much.

            It's like 2009 and 2010 didn't exist and we didn't have the Wall Street Reform, the Affordable Health Care Act, the prevention of an additional Great Depression and the auto industry bailout.

            •  I will vote on the Social Security benefit cuts (6+ / 0-)

              That will impact me every month for the rest of my life.  People vote on different issues.  I don't expect everyone to agree with me, but I do want the Democratic Party to know that this is the 3rd rail for me, and there is NOTHING else that they can or will do that will make up for them deliberately, callously, deceitfully, arrogantly, cutting my Social Security benefits FOREVER.  

              I will remember this at every election for the rest of my life.  I'm not saying what I will do forever, but I am saying that I will vote on this and this alone in 2014 and 2016.  

              I am mad as hell.  I feel totally betrayed.  I don't trust them not to make more cuts if they get away with this.  I have no idea where the party stands anymore.  

              •  I don't feel betrayed (0+ / 0-)

                The lobbying system is what's putting a strange hold on this process.  If it didn't have such a strange hold, guess what?  Democrats would be winning elections a lot easier and we wouldn't even be in this business of having to fight these seemingly endless battles against the GOP.

                I mean, yes, Social Security cuts are terrible and as a progressive Democrat from Berkeley, California, I'm always going to fight against chained CPI and anything else that cuts Social Security.  I may be coming from a different profession or industry than you are but I also recognize that I also have IRAs, 401k accounts, mutual funds, etc.  Those are an opinion but of course, Social Security is the ultimate safety net for all Americans that prevents a lot of poverty.

                And a point to make:  The cuts have not been done yet so there's still fighting power to be done.  President Obama can present his budget but the House and Senate needs to still vote on it.  That's what's known as checks and balances.

                I hope you're not listening to Jill Stein here.  There are lots of Democrats inside Congress and outside of Congress who are going to support you.  The AARP is 100% against chained CPI.  

                http://www.aarp.org/...

                In addition, the AFL-CIO is 100% against the Chained CPI so that's a large percentage of union representatives (who the Democrats depend on a lot for votes) that any Democratic Congressman/Congresswoman or Senator will feel the wrath off and get defeated for re-election if say they vote for the budget as it contains chained CPI.  Keep in mind also we're dealing with a divided Congress where the GOP has the control over the House of Representatives

                And you might as well start calling the White House and vent your frustration there so they hear an additional voice, rather than spending time on Daily Kos.  Every additional angry constituent needs to be heard by the White House:

                Comments: 202-456-1111
                Switchboard: 202-456-1414

                You can also contact Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid's Office Line:  (202) 224-3542

                Or Dick Durbin's Office Line:  (202) 224-2152

                Or Nancy Pelosi's Office Line:  (202) 225-4965

                 

                •  A Berkeley Progressive is a bit of cliche (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Patango

                  And one with 401K, IRA's and mutual funds too.  

                  You might want to seek out a waitress in Stockton or somewhere and see how losing $650 a year in Social Security benefits is going to work out.

              •  I'm not exactly happy myself (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Just Bob

                As a federal retiree, I'll get double the cuts. Have been taking cuts for the past three years already. And I didn't go along with the corruption...I fought it. That cost me financially, too. But, vote Republican...not even in my dreams.

            •  You keep mentioning the lobbying (corruption) (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              splashoil

              While at the same time, Obama is signing a bill that destroys the anti-corruption ban on congressional insider trading.

              Democrats are not better on this, and we have already lost it. But at least we still have social security left....for now.

              Anybody who tries to grab the third rail must be burned.

      •  Voting Republican won't make it better (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Thomas Twinnings

        Both parties are in the clutches of lobbyists on this issue. Would voting Republican be worse? I think so--mainly because lobbyists would take that as a mandate to push more aggressively on these issues; like stepping on the plutocracy gas pedal.

        Yeah, frustrating. But, here's some hope.

    •  "blame us on Daily Kos"? (4+ / 0-)

      I think 30+ years of DLC, New Democrats, and Third Way have something to do with our current situation.

      At what point in the continuing rightward movement will you no longer support the Democratic Party? Where do you draw the line? Why do we settle for a false choice of center right or far right? Where is the balance of a two party political system?

      Others have simply gotten old. I prefer to think I've been tempered by time.

      by Just Bob on Tue Apr 16, 2013 at 12:39:20 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Good questions! (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Just Bob, splashoil, Patango

        Where do you draw the line?  Me, I am focusing on the individual's actions or inactions.  I simply will not vote for a congressperson who supports Chained CPI.  

        The Democratic Party should not be abandoned to those on the Right.  We must try to win it back.

        An illusion can never be destroyed directly... SK.

        by Thomas Twinnings on Tue Apr 16, 2013 at 05:17:13 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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