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View Diary: Are Chechens Really White? Racial Formation Theory and the Boston Marathon Bombing (207 comments)

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    •  Did you expect anything more? (1+ / 0-)
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      Be Skeptical

      Chauncey ignores anything not written by his fave crit race theory guys and doesn't like it when people point out the whole.  He likes to pose as an expert

      Touch all that arises with a spirit of compassion

      by Mindful Nature on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 01:24:56 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  oh please. offer something up. (0+ / 0-)

        Engage or not. What joy do you get out of being a misanthrope? Alternatively come over to my main site, listen to my interviews, etc. etc. and see if if I am "posing" or not.

        If you have such disdain, why even bother trolling--is it the joy of it? Addictive? Self-esteem issue?

        •  good lord (2+ / 0-)
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          heybuddy, Be Skeptical

          I think your stuff here is incredibly wrong headed and contributing the ongoing problems in the world.  Why on earth would I want to subject myself to more of that?

          Touch all that arises with a spirit of compassion

          by Mindful Nature on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 02:23:07 PM PDT

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          •  I've been reading (1+ / 0-)
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            Be Skeptical

            his stuff for years, and you are exactly right. And the damage that people like him do to our party should not be underestimated.

            I'm afraid that my signature won't match the mood of my comment.

            by heybuddy on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 03:36:50 PM PDT

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            •  I have been actually also (2+ / 0-)
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              heybuddy, Be Skeptical

              but I'm not sure I'd go as far as that.  My concerns are less about the Democratic Party and more about addressing racism.  I am pretty firmly of the opinion that one cannot address the problems caused by dividing people into groups and denigrating certain groups (roughly what Painter describes in her book Chauncey cites, although I obviously don't limit my opposition to the activities of just one group the way CDV does) cannot be really addressed by dividing people into groups and merely denigrating a different set of people.  Either you get over the habit of division and denigration or you aren't going to solve this problem at all, only perpetuate it.

              Touch all that arises with a spirit of compassion

              by Mindful Nature on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 04:00:04 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  classic white supremacy colorblind (0+ / 0-)

                racism white-splaining move 101. those who actually describe the world as it is are to blame for racism and other types of inequalities along the cololrline.

                If those damn black and brown folks would just shut up things would be fine.

                "Either you get over the habit of division and denigration or you aren't going to solve this problem at all, only perpetuate it."

                Mighty privileged of you, no? You are a case study out of textbook for Soc 101.

                •  not the least what I said (0+ / 0-)

                  but I'd say accusing people calling you out is a pretty classic diversion and covering move.  Did I say you shouldn't call out white racism at all anywhere?  No.  What I said isn't the slightest that anyone should refrain from calling out white racism loudly.  To the contrary.  I'm saying you should be louder and call out MORE racism and more widely, not less.

                   What I"m saying is that one shouldn't engage in the same kind of behavior in decrying it.  This business of accusing the people calling you out for your words of racism is wrongheaded and distressingly a common response to having the divisive frames pointed out.  If you want to oppose racism, do it everywhere, and don't be selective about it. Don't cover for it just because the people doing it are black or whatever.  If it's wrong, it's wrong for everyone.  Don't be covering for it in one group and then try to pretend you are opposed to racism.  THAT'S the take home message

                  Touch all that arises with a spirit of compassion

                  by Mindful Nature on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 08:24:19 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  you mean the mass systematic racism (0+ / 0-)

                    against white folks in the U.S. where every major social and political institution is controlled by the white in-group. Okay. Sign me up for that silliness.

                    "If you want to oppose racism, do it everywhere, and don't be selective about it. Don't cover for it just because the people doing it are black or whatever.  If it's wrong, it's wrong for everyone.  Don't be covering for it in one group and then try to pretend you are opposed to racism.  THAT'S the take home message"

                    Again, you are the poster child for racism in the post-civil rights era.

                    Your arguments are dishonest and flat because you are seeking some type of false equivalency where you sincerely want to believe that white people are somehow disadvantaged in this society. This is the very heart of white supremacy in the post-civil rights era--we could go farther back too as their were such claims made during Jim and Jane Crow and the slave regime too.

                    Given that you have not written anything here, perhaps you can start your own web project documenting anti-white racism. This would earn you quite a following and you would be in good company with the White Right and honest white supremacists--and racially chauvinistic conservatives--who would flock there.

                    You are playing a tedious game, and it is a very obvious one too.

                    •  Obviously not (0+ / 0-)

                      I"m asking you to take a stand against the animus that gives rise to it in the first place.

                      But I see you are far to wedded to your odious views and have all of your pat diversions ready to trot out immediately.  POster child for racism.  Yep, that's mean, ready to reinstitute segregation and supporting crappy schools for minorities and the whole nine yards (never mind that I am on a board of a non profit to improve those schools and sued the state for more money for them, but whatevs!  I'm white, so I MUST be racist amirite?)  

                      Yep, it must be tedious to be called out for your "all whites are racist" crap.  Say, are we all child molesters too?  Thieves?  moral degenerates?

                      Your "opposition" to racism is a total joke and a farce. YOu revel it in like a hog in mud.

                      Touch all that arises with a spirit of compassion

                      by Mindful Nature on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 08:59:25 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  you are offering up a stew of silliness (0+ / 0-)

                        more classic white racist colorblind distractions--how we go from talking about white supremacy and a society structured around white privilege to talking about child molestation is a classic one--really, I mean that--worthy of a poster somewhere.

                        you are so vulnerable! it must hard being such a white do gooder. how do you get the energy dealing with all of us ungrateful colored folk? would you like a hug or a sticker?

                        "Yep, it must be tedious to be called out for your "all whites are racist" crap. "

                        In this society whiteness equals racism; all individual white people may not be equally invested in white supremacy; they do benefit from that system. Own that fact and move on.

                        i am a man in this society. i benefit from how gender gives me undo privilege. when we discuss how sexism is real and men as a group are complicit in it, I do not throw a fit. If I am living my life righteously and trying to fight those systems I am at peace. Your defensiveness suggests a deep investment in white supremacy and the normativity of Whiteness.

                        There are many liberal white racists. In fact, they are among the most dangerous.

                        •  Yep (0+ / 0-)

                          Totally unwilling to examine your biases.  Yes privilege exists.  Old news.  Maybe someday you'll have a broader understanding

                          I am not in the slightest bit defensive.  I am simply opposing racism where it exists.  You should do the same

                          Touch all that arises with a spirit of compassion

                          by Mindful Nature on Sat Apr 20, 2013 at 11:54:01 PM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

                          •  stop dodging and playing (0+ / 0-)

                            do you believe that white people are victims of "racism?"

                            that will reveal exactly where you stand and the degree of your complicity in a system of colorblind racism and white supremacy. think hard before you answer. just be honest.

                            are you a white victimologist?

                          •  "Victims"? (0+ / 0-)

                            No.  That would hardly be accurate.  Do I think racism nevertheless is expressed? Absolutely

                            I like you notion that you wouldn't pitch a fit. You kind of are now.  I'd certainly be interested to see how you would react to an assertion by Glenn Beck or someone that all blacks are morally inferior or something like that.  Hard to imagine you'd be sanguine about it.  Maybe if he said it about Jews or Hispanics you'd be ok with it.  I don't know

                            Touch all that arises with a spirit of compassion

                            by Mindful Nature on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 12:12:21 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  false equivalence (0+ / 0-)

                            again, do you believe that white people are somehow subjected to racism? yes or no. easy answer. stop playing.

                          •  I told you (0+ / 0-)

                            By a reasonable, common definition, yes.  There are plenty of people who express racist views out there.

                            I am sorry I haven't been able to make it clearer to you what this means or how to think about it that makes sense to you.  My failing I suppose.  

                            Touch all that arises with a spirit of compassion

                            by Mindful Nature on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 07:50:28 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  and you are being dishonest as well (0+ / 0-)

                            we have done this many times. i am frustrated at myself for dealing with your trollish behavior. my hope is that someone will see this, who may be ignorant about white supremacy, and learn about its modern variety by reading your responses.

                            Whiteness does not equal all white people; masculinity does not equal all men. Given your supposed deep reading on these topics you would understand that. Social systems are not necessarily comments about individual level behavior. They are however, comments about the aggregated level behavior of individuals.

                            Again, are white people subjected to racism? Are you a white victimologist?

                          •  I agree with all you just said here (0+ / 0-)

                            Truly.  I honestly agree that racists institutions, processes and cultural ideas are ubiquitous and exact a terrible toll in our society and are profoundly unjust.   This is all correct and not controversial

                            The point I am trying to make so poorly then comes from the question of how does an individual respond to that?  What is the best and most appropriate response to these facts?  

                            I am sorry I have frustrated you

                            Touch all that arises with a spirit of compassion

                            by Mindful Nature on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 07:56:38 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  And (0+ / 0-)

                            It is only know that I finally figured out what, precisely, my objection is to, which is why it has been soo befuddled up to now.

                            Touch all that arises with a spirit of compassion

                            by Mindful Nature on Sun Apr 21, 2013 at 08:17:03 AM PDT

                            [ Parent ]

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