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View Diary: UPDATES: Cooper Union's Admin Threatens Students w Dismissal, Trespass, Denial of Bathroom Access (194 comments)

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  •  The students are wrong. (7+ / 0-)

    Free tuition at highly selective colleges is a huge subsidy to better-off families, because the ability to present with high credentials is closely correlated with family income in our country.  There are good and bad ways to migrate from free tuition to some kind of tuition, and I don't know whether Cooper Union has chosen a good way or a bad way, but there's no sense in letting well-off kids get a lucrative degree for free while the institution works under financial constraints that erode its ability to provide an education "equal to the best."

    You know, I sometimes think if I could see, I'd be kicking a lot of ass. -Stevie Wonder at the Glastonbury Festival, 2010

    by Rich in PA on Thu May 09, 2013 at 03:58:58 PM PDT

    •  These are working class student (3+ / 0-)

      who will not be able to attend a school that was explicitly created to be free. Certainly not all of them are working class, but people who are working class are benefited far more because they can actually afford to go to art school and not end up hopelessly in debt from which they will never escape.

      If debt were a moral issue then, lacking morals, corporations could never be in debt.

      by AoT on Thu May 09, 2013 at 04:05:16 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Ummm...not likely. (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        jpmassar, Rich in PA, eXtina

        Now I wont say there are not a few students of working class background. But make no mistake...getting into Cooper Union isn't something you can do with a B-average from a public high school in Detroit. They're almost all from upper middle class or wealthy backgrounds that can afford all the things that make a for a top flight candidate.

    •  Well, that's a reasonable argument. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      AoT, Odysseus

      The argument against is that the school should endeavor to find those who can make it at CU by "merit" from the non-economically privileged, thereby maintaining its founder's wishes and vision.

      That some children from rich families get in should not be a horrible thing.  But if too a lot are getting in that should be something the trustees seriously look at.

      •  All students at CU are accepted based on merit. (14+ / 0-)

        My family was working class when I attended.  I applied to 2 colleges, Cooper and CCNY (City College of NY).  One was tuition free and the other had a very modest tuition at that time.  I was very lucky to be accepted to CU and attended as an engineering student.  At the time, there was no need to fill out lengthy application forms, write essays, etc....  I was accepted based on my grades in high school and on standardized tests.  Engineering is a very rigorous program to complete in 4 years and about 15-20% of the incoming freshman didn't make it through the 4 years.

        Almost all of my classmates were from working class families.  The school had no amenities at the time...no gym, no dorms, no intercollegiate sports, no campus (the line they gave us was the City is your campus)...I commuted from home 90 minutes each way on the subway and bus.  And I worked like a dog for 4 years to graduate.  CU now has a freshman only dorm and a new engineering building.  My assumption is students from rich families may decide to attend CU, but probably not because it is tuition free.

    •  The essay I just posted in the diary (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      AoT, srkp23

      suggests that by charging $20K tuition that will result in MORE upscale and rich students, which makes perfect sense.

      •  Unless they have quotas (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        AoT, jpmassar

        that require that a broad spectrum of students in terms of financial background get to attend, the richer ones subsidizing the less rich ones.

        "Liberty without virtue would be no blessing to us" - Benjamin Rush, 1777

        by kovie on Thu May 09, 2013 at 05:45:57 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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