Skip to main content

View Diary: Books So Bad They're Good: Defenestrating the Daughter of Time (or, I'm just a gal in Kalamazoo) (90 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  An interesting historical fact of fascism (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    RiveroftheWest

    Is that there were some Jewish fascists in the 1920s. I was surprised when I discovered that. I can't name names at this moment, but this was before Hitler added the anti-semitic element to fascism, & they were attracted to Mussolini's original version.

    Mussolini's version was much closer -- if not identical -- to Republican ideology under George W. Bush / Dick Cheney, which was pro-business & didn' t have an overt racial element. (Well, except for when it came to certain uppity African countries inhabited by non-whites.) "Fascism" referred to the fasces carried by ancient Roman officials, thus implying they were for "law & order".

    •  Actually (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      RiveroftheWest

      the fasces was the symbol of the supremacy of State power over the individual. Hence the totalitarian character of Fascism.

      Nothing human is alien to me.

      by WB Reeves on Sun May 12, 2013 at 12:53:42 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  actually, the fasces referred to the committees (0+ / 0-)

        of elite capitalists -- the representatives of the corporations -- who were the fists in the gloves of l'estato corporativo.

        or so i've read.

        think: Dick Cheney's energy policy commission.

        To put the torture behind us is, inevitably, to put it in front of us.

        by UntimelyRippd on Tue May 14, 2013 at 06:15:29 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  The fasces is a bundle of sticks (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          RiveroftheWest

          bound around an axe. It is a symbol dating to before the Roman Republic, predating Fascism and corporatism. It has historically represented the unity and supreme power of the state. For these reasons it was appropriated by Mussolini for his own purposes. It has been used in the official symbolism of many countries, including the US.

          Sorry if I came across as sniffy.

          Nothing human is alien to me.

          by WB Reeves on Tue May 14, 2013 at 01:00:17 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  sigh. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            RiveroftheWest

            yes, of course Mussolini took the Fasces from the Romans.

            we weren't talking about that -- we were talking about what he claimed it represented, about the explicit symbology he asserted when he named Fascism.

            i might be misinformed, but I can't actually confirm it one way or another -- i've found at least three conflicting accounts, one of which notes that the term already had currency as the name of a left-wing party (where the "fascio" was the party itself -- the group of people).

            if someone can produce an authoritative statement in Mussolini's words as to why he chose the symbol and the name, that would be great, but for the most part all i get is a sort of "everyone knows" authority.

            To put the torture behind us is, inevitably, to put it in front of us.

            by UntimelyRippd on Tue May 14, 2013 at 04:41:00 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

    •  Not all that surprising (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      RiveroftheWest, Ellid

      Antisemitism wasn't really important to Mussolini- most of his policies against Jews were enacted under German pressure.  It's also true that the earliest versions of the Fascist platforms, and to a lesser degree the Nazi platform, contained some progressive elements, which conservatives never tire of pointing out.  They also don't tire of pointing out that when Fascists came to power, they didn't implement the progressive elements of their platforms in either Germany or Italy - since that is a fact they never mention.

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site