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View Diary: Chris Hedges NPR Interview: On The Right Wing "Proto-Fascist Movement" in The U.S. (232 comments)

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  •  And what can be done? (16+ / 0-)

    If both parties are controlled by the corporatists, then voting is pointless. But if you dare suggest a third party you're labeled as a Sarah Palin/Ted Cruz supporter. Seems like blindly loyal Democrats are as much of a problem as anybody.

    •  True believers are true believers, whichever side. (6+ / 0-)

      Nothing can be done as long as the propaganda keeps both or all sides divided.  

      "I'm an antiwar propagandist as accused by democrats. Not even republicans have called me that."

      by BigAlinWashSt on Thu May 16, 2013 at 11:47:52 AM PDT

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    •  That's exactly my point (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Aquarius40, sidnora, 3goldens, yella dawg

      The Democratic party is a center-right party interested in social justice but compromised by monied interests. The Repubican party is a FASCIST party. Intolerant, nativist,  angry, militant, and constantly on the lookout for enemies foreign and domestic and completely working on behalf of plutocrats.

      So yes the Democratic party is compromised and in need of new leadership but it's no time to talk 3rd party, the barbarians are at the gates and they aren't taking prisoners.

      Once this current version of the GOP has been utterly destroyed we can start talking about 3rd party and the flaws of the Democrats but right now I'm too scared of what the Republican party is to risk abandoning the Dems on the field.

      That's the hard truth the left better start accepting.

      •  Lesser evil thing again. How long do we have (10+ / 0-)

        to play that game?  Until all the wars and all the austerity measures are completed?  

        "I'm an antiwar propagandist as accused by democrats. Not even republicans have called me that."

        by BigAlinWashSt on Thu May 16, 2013 at 12:18:30 PM PDT

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        •  We are in a period of economic and political (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Aquarius40, WB Reeves, yella dawg

          crisis. It a dangerous time to abandon nominal allies when you have a radicalized political opponent.

          Ask the communists in how well it did them to abandon the social democrats against the radicalized right-wing in Weinmar Germany.

          •  Second time that's been brought up, the (8+ / 0-)

            Nazi thing.  Be very afraid.  Vote for Hillary then and see what you get.  
            The point is both parties are corrupted by the same entities.  What exactly would the right wing do differently than Obama has done?   What if McCain had been President, what would be different?  Cut Social Security?  And Asian Pivot? Wars with Syria and Libya?  Colonizing of Africa?  Interference in latin American democracies?  Bail out the banks?  Ease restrictions on Corporations?

            "I'm an antiwar propagandist as accused by democrats. Not even republicans have called me that."

            by BigAlinWashSt on Thu May 16, 2013 at 12:37:55 PM PDT

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            •  Take a good look a Paul Ryan's or (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Aquarius40, yella dawg

              Rand Paul's budget and ask yourself again if there is a difference between the parties.

              Now if your arguing the right-wing doesn't believe what they are saying and they will govern similar to Obama then fine that's an argument I'm open to.

              But if they really believe what they are saying then the idea that they aren't different then the Democrats is absurd.

              •  Kabuki theatre man. (7+ / 0-)

                Look at the progression from Clinton (Glass Steagal, Commodities Mod Act of 2000, Iraq, Syria) to Bush (Iraq, Afghanistan, Financial depression, Patriot Act, Homeland Security) to Obama (Obama/Romneycare, more and more).  In the end, McCain would have done the same things.  It's not like the democratic party would go away and not prevent more extreme positions from taking place.  We can place a little faith with the American people at least.  Not much, but a little.

                "I'm an antiwar propagandist as accused by democrats. Not even republicans have called me that."

                by BigAlinWashSt on Thu May 16, 2013 at 12:57:15 PM PDT

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                •  We can agree to disagree (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  yella dawg

                  To me the Republicans don't want me to vote, get an education and think my taxes are too low and Mitt Romney's taxes are too high.

                  You form some new coalition with intellectually honest tea party people (good luck with that) or make the Greens a viable party or even tell me how a successful revolution happens that gets rid of the plutocrats I'll be the first to apologize for my ignorance and slavish devotion to the Democrats.

                  Until then I'm staying on the field and fighting my ass off to defeat Republicans.

            •  "Those who refuse to learn from history..." (5+ / 0-)

              You know the rest.

              Lesser evilism is a perennial problem because we haven't succeeded in building a strong, militant movement from the left in the US. The only remedy is to build such a movement. Ignoring the threat posed by the RW is no way to do this. This error has repeatedly disarmed the left and made it ineffective in the face of advancing corporatism.

              Nothing human is alien to me.

              by WB Reeves on Thu May 16, 2013 at 02:38:17 PM PDT

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            •  Yes both Parties are badly corrupted (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              BigAlinWashSt, Words In Action

              by corporatist monies and influence. I think they have always been somewhat corrupted, and now they are very corrupted.

              But together they constitute the two halves of whatever government we have. Such as it is. It still functions, though less well than it has in the past. But if things keep going the way they have been going, it might not be able, in the not-too-distant future, to function at all... except as a fascist police state.

              An official Third Party is not practicable at this time. But maybe a defacto Third Party is possible. A progressive coalition that (while still nominally Democratic, and generally supportive of Democratic candidates) could put significant pressure on them. It could organize and function independently, raise money, and recruit challengers in primaries.

              A Tea Party of the left, in other words.

    •  It isn't the is the system (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Words In Action

      that first of all only allows those with BIG BUCKS to have a chance of being a successful candidate.  So we preselected for shilldom right from the get go.  

      And if they don't feel sufficiently indebted to their campaign contributors ....they soon will be once enscounced in their lucrative life style or offered their next job as a lobbyist at 10 times the salary...if they vote this way now.

      People who clamor for a new party don't understand what in the hell is going on.  imho LOL  (I only get this emphatic at my evening wine time!)

      “... there is no shame in not knowing. The problem arises when irrational thought and attendant behavior fill the vacuum left by ignorance.” ― Neil deGrasse Tyson, The Sky Is Not the Limit: Adventures of an Urban Astrophysicist

      by leema on Thu May 16, 2013 at 03:33:54 PM PDT

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