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View Diary: Is OFA Serious about Climate Change or Not? (105 comments)

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  •  Giving Nixon credit for the movement? Sick. (1+ / 0-)
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    Onomastic

    Earth Day 1970 was huge. The first dirty dozen list was released and dirty members of Congress were defeated. The movement was more than on the radar. As I already wrote, the initiative for environmental progress during Nixon's term came from Congress. There's no evidence that he had any environmental vision or took any personal initiative. Giving Nixon credit for a mass movement just to bash Obama is disgusting and inaccurate.  

    Yes, Carter introduced the idea of a national energy policy, far too late in his term, and what little he accomplished was quickly undone by Reagan. Obama built more clean energy and did more to reduce oil consumption long term.

    Some chump change to clean coal, that's far, far less than stimulus spending on clean energy, hardly negates everything good Obama has done. That's weak spin.

    •  asdf (0+ / 0-)
      Giving Nixon credit for the movement?
      OK, so now you are despearat and are misrepresenting what I said in a desperate attempt to make an environmental hero out of somebody who isn't. Fine. Lemme know when you feel like discussing what I said and not some fabrication of your own.

      That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

      by enhydra lutris on Sun May 19, 2013 at 08:43:32 AM PDT

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      •  You wrote: (0+ / 0-)

        "Nixon, EPA, Clean Air Act, NEPA, discussed environmental policy in State of Union Speech (a first) at a time when the environment was pretty much not on the radar."

        Attributing those accomplishments to Nixon is misleading because the initiative didn't come from him in most cases. Claiming the environment was not on the radar is inaccurate. I responded to exactly what you wrote. You gave Nixon credit for things that happened only because he was strongly pressured, not because he had any real environmental agenda.
        You're stretching to puff up Nixon because you can't process the reality that Obama has done more to reduce oil consumption and bring new clean energy online than any President in American history.

        •  asdf (0+ / 0-)
          You're stretching to puff up Nixon
          Nope. The things I say happened on his watch really did.  Ditto Carter. And the things on Obama's did and are happening. Some of the "greatest evah" stuff is sort of bullshit, though.

          The first CAFE standards  were under Jerry Ford - 100%, not some fractional increase over his immediate predecessor's (like Obama's small percentage change in Bush's standards, which were a huge change).

          That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

          by enhydra lutris on Sun May 19, 2013 at 11:50:32 AM PDT

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          •  The numbers are what they are. (0+ / 0-)

            Who built the most clean energy? Obama.

            Who created the first heavy truck mileage and emissions standards? Obama.

            Who forced Detroit to finally get serious about alternative fuel vehicles and electric cars? Only Obama.

            Who had TWO rounds of auto emissions and mileage standard increases? Obama.
            You're ignoring the second increase in auto standards, but it happened.

            Who invested the most in high speed rail and made Transportation stop focusing on only auto-traffic? Obama

            Who reduced oil consumption the most? Obama.

            Who stopped the building of new coal power plants that don't include carbon capture? Only Obama.

            Who stopped the issuance of new mountaintop removal mining permits? Only Obama.

            Who was the first major party nominee to make clean energy and climate change a major part of his campaign platform? Obama in '08.

            Who invested the most in energy efficiency? Obama, thanks to the green stimulus.

            It may pain you to admit it, but Obama has gotten more tangible results than any of them.

            •  Yoou just don't see it, that's ok, but simply (0+ / 0-)

              tweaking your predecessor's CAFE standards a bit, much of which occurs in 2020-2025, sharing the hydrocarbon subsidies with wind to a larger degree than your predecessors, etc while encouraging more and more extraction at the dame time is not a crisis response, it's business as usual.

              That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

              by enhydra lutris on Sun May 19, 2013 at 08:42:40 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

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