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View Diary: Have Dems sold out too early on immigration? Not if they want something to actually pass (317 comments)

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  •  It's a job killer (9+ / 0-)

    It will ruin the careers and lives of hundreds of thousand Americans, many of whom are young adults struggling to pay off student loans.

    Why would Democrats want to destroy the futures of our best and brightest? What is gained by doing that, other than campaign donations laundered from the higher profits cheap labor tech firms reap?

    "If you can't take their money, eat their food, drink their booze and then vote against them, you have no business being up there."

    by Betty Pinson on Wed May 22, 2013 at 12:55:52 PM PDT

    •  This is incorrect (7+ / 0-)

      immigration creates jobs, boosts economic growth, increases the pay of low-wage workers, and would strengthen Social Security, among other economic benefits.  If you're interested in learning more, read this by the Center for American Progress.

      “Th’ noise ye hear is not th’ first gun iv a revolution. It’s on’y th’ people iv the United States batin’ a carpet.” - Mr. Dooley

      by puakev on Wed May 22, 2013 at 01:12:07 PM PDT

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      •  Please sell it somewhere else (9+ / 0-)

        Those studies and reports are as credible as the ones pushing austerity.

        Take the H1B visa expansion out, its a dealbreaker.

        "If you can't take their money, eat their food, drink their booze and then vote against them, you have no business being up there."

        by Betty Pinson on Wed May 22, 2013 at 01:25:59 PM PDT

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        •  H1B visa expansion is ESSENTIAL (0+ / 0-)

          to keep much of the economy going. And it is the pathway for citizenship for international graduate students who want to stay here.

          •  and what about (4+ / 0-)

            domestic students with 3.96 GPAs who can't get into grad school?  What do you tell them?

            Why should policy be written to benefit only the tiny handful of specialties who are coming up short, when there are hundreds of thousands of graduates in closely related fields working retail?

            What are you doing to fight the dangerous and counterproductive error of treating dirtbag terrorist criminals as though they were comic book supervillains? I can't believe we still have to argue this shit, let alone on Daily Kos.

            by happymisanthropy on Wed May 22, 2013 at 03:19:10 PM PDT

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          •  No H1b is not about grad students (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            tardis10

            they get a different kind of visa while they study and the IEEE has recommended that smart advanced degree folks get Green Cards, that convey permanent resident status so they can start meaningful careers and stay here.

            The H1b visa is a temp worker who comes for 3 years with a possible 3 year extension then they go home.  It is very difficult to get a Green Card.  While that low level worker is here they are also tied to the employer who brought them in on the visa.  Guest Workers are Indentured Servants.  And that is why the GOP like them, and sadly many Dems have also bought the bull that we don't have smart enough Americans to do tech jobs.

            Congressional elections have consequences!

            by Cordyc on Wed May 22, 2013 at 08:53:16 PM PDT

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          •  You must not work in hi-tech (0+ / 0-)

            The abundance of cheap indentured foreign-born labor has created a nightmare for anyone in hi-tech who is over age 40.  I have been in the field for over thirty years.  I was trained in data center operations and software development by the United States Navy immediately upon graduation from high school.  I earned undergraduate and graduate degrees in computer science after leaving active duty.  I understand computer and data communication systems down to the bare metal.  I pray everyday that I do not loose my job because I would never find another position in the field.  

            The H-1B program has made age discrimination and Title VII violations a part of every day life for experienced American citizens and legal residents.  The program has also made life very difficult for "fresh outs."  It takes between two and five years to turn a recent college graduate into a self-directed worker.  Companies used to have training programs for recent graduates before the H-1B program was created.  Now, companies expect all candidates to have at least two years of compensated experience.  It is a chicken and egg situation for recent graduates.  What ends up happening is that recent CS/IS/IT grads get assigned to dead-end help desk positions while H-1B visa holders are brought into do the work that the recent graduates believed that they would do upon graduation.

      •  This Is Your Opinion (0+ / 0-)

        You cant' prove that legalizing eleven million, or however many million it is, is going to create jobs anymore than the  Center for American Progress can prove it.

        I won't be coming home tonight, my generation will put it right - Genesis 9:3

        by superscalar on Wed May 22, 2013 at 01:29:15 PM PDT

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        •  I've seen far more credible evidence (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Sentido, Miss Blue

          out there that immigration helps than there's evidence that it'll hurt.  The arguments against immigration reform, such as the one put out recently by the Heritage Foundation, almost always fall apart under scrutiny.

          And there's a reason why labor unions support immigration reform.  Hint: it's not because unions want American workers to lose their jobs and work for lower wages.

          “Th’ noise ye hear is not th’ first gun iv a revolution. It’s on’y th’ people iv the United States batin’ a carpet.” - Mr. Dooley

          by puakev on Wed May 22, 2013 at 01:54:00 PM PDT

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          •  The Evidence Is Credible Because (5+ / 0-)

            You want it to be credible, in the same way that you want to believe that somehow if Congress passes a bill that legalizes everybody that is currently in the country illegally and creates three more guest worker programs to add to the ten that already exist -- that this somehow proves that the U.S. legal immigration system is 'broken' and whatever Congress passes is going to 'reform' it.

            And there's a reason why labor unions support immigration reform

            Sure there's a reason why labor unions support what you call 'immigration reform', because unions like the SEIU have a large proportion of their members who are in the country illegally, and the SEIU wants to keep these members, and they want to keep the money and the political power that these members represent.

            Please don't try to convince me that labor unions like the SEIU and the AFL have the best interests of the American worker in mind, this isn't 1955, and I ain't as stupid as you might first assume me to be.

            Finally, unions represent about 10% of all American workers  and Richard Trumka no more has the right to speak for the American worker than Tom Donoho has. Fact is, I am a software engineer and Richard Trumka has shown that he is working at odds with my interests rather than for them.

            I won't be coming home tonight, my generation will put it right - Genesis 9:3

            by superscalar on Wed May 22, 2013 at 02:08:31 PM PDT

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            •  This post belongs in Redstate (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              kimoconnor
              "Finally, unions represent about 10% of all American workers  and Richard Trumka no more has the right to speak for the American worker than Tom Donoho has."
              I am frankly stunned.
            •  Wait a minute (0+ / 0-)

              What kind of proof do you have that shows unions hire any, much less 'large proportion' of undocumented immigrants?

              Where ignorance is our master, there is no possibility of real peace. - Dalai Lama

              by kimoconnor on Wed May 22, 2013 at 03:48:30 PM PDT

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              •  Wait A Minute (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                jncca

                So, illegal immigrants are "cleaning all of our hotel rooms", and those hotels are hotels that are staffed by SEIU union member ... but the illegal immigrants ... aren't really illegal immigrants?

                I won't be coming home tonight, my generation will put it right - Genesis 9:3

                by superscalar on Wed May 22, 2013 at 03:55:50 PM PDT

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