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View Diary: WATCH: The "Obama Pipeline"? (168 comments)

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  •  Who said anything about fealty to Obama? (4+ / 0-)

    This type of crap is a large part of why we fail. It is the same kind of authoritarian mindset as the wingnuts. "Agree with us or you are evil and worship Obama"!

    Opponents have failed to move public opinion within the Democratic Party and general public. Yet now we claim it would be a "betrayal" if President Obama approves what most in his party and the public at large approve of?

    That is some denial of reality and insulting me isn't going to change that fact.

    The politicians may be bought, and the system corrupt, but it is our duty to fix these things.

    by sebastianguy99 on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:07:21 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  Then you'd like to revise your statement? (16+ / 0-)
      Haven't we failed and isn't the real scandal that we once again want President Obama to go against public opinion in order to make up for our failure?
      (Emphasis mine.)

      There is no rational excuse for the President to cave on KXL.  Please stop trying to excuse it in advance by blaming "us".

      And BTW, your statement is an insult to the many, many people here who have been talking, writing, blogging, contacting elected officials, and protesting to keep this issue in the public eye and get people talking.

      OUR failure?  What rubbish.

      A slower bleed-out is not a sustainable value.

      by MrJayTee on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:15:41 AM PDT

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      •  hear hear (7+ / 0-)

        Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell. --Edward Abbey

        by greenbastard on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:17:29 AM PDT

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      •  So you haz hurt feelins, well ok then. (4+ / 0-)

        If you don't  accept responsibility for failing to get the public to agree with you on Keystone XL, then you aren't going to help the cause any way. It is up to those that believe we have to transition off of dirty energy to effectively advocate our position.

        I'm on your side when it comes to Keystone XL, but I just acknowledge we didn't get it done instead of throwing the blame elsewhere.

        But hey, if taking shots at me makes you feel good, go right ahead.

        The politicians may be bought, and the system corrupt, but it is our duty to fix these things.

        by sebastianguy99 on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:24:34 AM PDT

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        •  again here you are saying we didn't get it done (11+ / 0-)

          when the doing is still happening.

          Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell. --Edward Abbey

          by greenbastard on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:26:56 AM PDT

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        •  MrJayTee M.O. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Deep Texan
          But hey, if taking shots at me makes you feel good, go right ahead.

          I'd like to start a new meme: "No means no" is a misnomer. It should be "Only 'Yes' means yes." Just because someone doesn't say "No" doesn't mean they've given consent. If she didn't say "Yes", there is no consent.

          by second gen on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:42:26 AM PDT

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          •  Whoa! (9+ / 0-)

            I'm not the one who called you (and many, many others) a scandalous failure.  Or effectively said the President is too weak to stand up to polls.

            Haven't we failed and isn't the real scandal that we once again want President Obama to go against public opinion in order to make up for our failure?
            I don't think WE have failed until the matter is over.  And I don't think President Obama is too weak to make a decision contrary to the polls.  

            Do you think the President is too weak to make a decision contrary to the polls?

            I'm not giving up.

            A slower bleed-out is not a sustainable value.

            by MrJayTee on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:58:25 AM PDT

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            •  Indeed. I think it takes (4+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              MrJayTee, expatjourno, quill, YucatanMan

              more than a little courage to stand up against the Democratic wing of the Democratic Party, to say nothing of the environmentalism he invokes in the occasional speech.

              Dogs from the street can have all the desirable qualities that one could want from pet dogs. Most adopted stray dogs are usually humble and exceptionally faithful to their owners as if they are grateful for this kindness. -- H.M. Bhumibol Adulyadej

              by corvo on Thu May 30, 2013 at 12:09:15 PM PDT

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        •  My feelings? (8+ / 0-)

          You're not getting it.  My feelings are fine, I'm pointing out your falsehoods.

          *WE didn't fail.  Maybe you did, but WE didn't.  WE are still working instead of pre-excusing a possilbly catastrophic decision.  I'm not assuming the President will approve KXL.  

          He may well say no, but either way, we have to keep working.  The President has to make unpopular decisions all the time, and does.

          *Blaming people who have worked long and hard to stop KXL for "failure" is an insult.  You don't have to "haz hurt feelins" to understand that.

          A slower bleed-out is not a sustainable value.

          by MrJayTee on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:49:58 AM PDT

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          •  Yeah, we failed, the thing is going to be built. (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Deep Texan, Onomastic

            Built=failure. That's the only fact that matters in my opinion.

            If you can't deal with me, a person who doesn't support the building of Keystone, how the hell you ever going to persuade those that do not agree with you on the issue?

            What we are doing isn't working. We need to adapt and start winning. This change in strategy should not be dependent on any POTUS overriding public opinion but us changing public opinion.

            We are losing this battle but we can win the war if we are willingly to adapt. Now if you believe we are doing just fine and don't need to change strategies, then say so but stop pretending this is all on President Obama and we play no role.

            The politicians may be bought, and the system corrupt, but it is our duty to fix these things.

            by sebastianguy99 on Thu May 30, 2013 at 12:05:24 PM PDT

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            •  rebranding it the Obama Tar Sands Pipeline is a (5+ / 0-)

              new strategy. Maybe the knee jerk tea party haters of Obama will come out against it ; )

              Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell. --Edward Abbey

              by greenbastard on Thu May 30, 2013 at 12:21:21 PM PDT

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            •  You're a fool if you think this is the end (0+ / 0-)

              of the issue. You are a failure, not me. There's a blockade going on as we speak and it will be continued and expanded if Obama continues to ruin the planet.

              Of course, he has ignored public opinion plenty of times before, but only when it was to run to the center and fuck over his base. You don't want to talk about that though, do you?

              If debt were a moral issue then, lacking morals, corporations could never be in debt.

              by AoT on Thu May 30, 2013 at 04:33:12 PM PDT

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    •  I also make it clear in a response above (5+ / 0-)

      To Betty Pinson that the legislative branch is responsible, too.  We need leadership from both branches.  But since the matter is in the President's hands, we need him to draw a clear line here and make it stick.

      A slower bleed-out is not a sustainable value.

      by MrJayTee on Thu May 30, 2013 at 11:20:23 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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