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View Diary: Here's one reason Darrell Issa didn't want to release the full IRS transcripts (65 comments)

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  •  The NSA thing is not a scandal. (8+ / 0-)

    If Congress passes a law, a President signs that law and the courts don't strike it down, it's not a scandal.

    Acting within the boundaries of that law, no matter how much you or I might hate it, is not a scandal.

    Even pushing those boundaries, which may then result in pushback from the courts, is not a scandal.

    The American people need to force their representatives to have an open debate about the balance of privacy and security, and the courts and the VOTING BOOTH is where that debate will ultimately be settled.

    •  Legal means good, is the general idea here (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Laconic Lib, cybersaur

      however, we know this isn 't good and much of it occurs in secret - that's not good.

      It's scandalous enough.

      And if you don't like "scandal" we can always fall back on "outrage".

      I like "totally unAmerican", myself.

      •  "Scandal" (0+ / 0-)

        has political implications to give one side an advantage over the other.

        This ain't it.

        It is other things, perhaps - distasteful, unAmerican, outrageous - and only time will tell.

        •  No, it is scandalous. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Laconic Lib

          It is scandalous that the entirety of the Beltway intelligensia and political class seem to think that a) the dictates of national security legitimate any encroachment on individual privacy and civil liberties, and 2) that ordinary citizens don't need to be kept informed about such encroachments. They didn't want us to worry our pretty little heads about it.

          I think you're using an overly legalistic definition of "scandal." A scandal is called a scandal because something outrageous has been revealed that was not known before -- and this clearly qualifies. It's especially scandalous that this travesty is bipartisan in scope and wholly legal.

          Nothing requires a greater effort of thought than arguments to justify the rule of non-thought. -- Milan Kundera

          by Dale on Mon Jun 10, 2013 at 09:10:01 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  take it up with Congress (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Lefty Ladig, eps62, Inkpen

        ya know, a course of action that might actually result in a change, as opposed to endless ranting and raving here.  
        Are you really surprised about what is happening re NSA?  You shouldn't be if you've been paying attention the last ten years.  Don't mean to dampen your righteous indignation.  

        •  If we went back to look at your comments (0+ / 0-)

          on NSA wiretapping circa the middle of the Bush administration, would we find a similar hard-nosed realpolitik at work?

          Or does your scorn about "righetous indignation" only kick up a notch after, say, January of 2009?

          Nothing requires a greater effort of thought than arguments to justify the rule of non-thought. -- Milan Kundera

          by Dale on Mon Jun 10, 2013 at 09:12:19 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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