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View Diary: Grayson: "There’s no probable cause here." Talking to Mom is NOT a Terrorist Act (134 comments)

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  •  Not only do I not want them looking at (11+ / 0-)

    my records, I do not want them sucking up and storing them even if they do not look at them.

    The act of collecting the information is itself a 4th Amendment violation.

    I do not want them to be able to at some unknown future time do a data search and  through pattern recognition answer some as-yet unasked question about my activities.

    These records (kept in the sole custody of the utility company, as business records) should be destroyed after a certain amount of time (I guess based on their need for use in an audit).

    "When will our consciences grow so tender that we will act to prevent human misery rather than avenge it?"--Eleanor Roosevelt

    by KJC MD on Sun Jun 16, 2013 at 01:59:51 PM PDT

    •  KJC DM -- Excellent! (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      KJC MD, jamess, deep info

      You've made the point beautifully, in just a few lines, that it has taken me reams and reams of words on some other threads here.  Very well put!

      Yes, "The act of collecting the information is itself a 4th Amendment violation."

      The instant my electron-packets are diverted into NSA'a data stream, my First and Fourth Amendment rights have been violated my Fifth Amendment rights have been put at risk.

    •  So...when Amazon, Facebook, Google, et al (0+ / 0-)

      buy and sell data over the internet, when I can buy your data for not a lot of money, that's a violation of the 4th Amendment?

      The acquisition of data I don't think has been tried in a Constitutional court yet.  Because of its economic and corporate connections, this SCOTUS will rule that the acquisition of data BUT NOT USING IT is Constitutional.

      "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." --M. L. King "You can't fix stupid" --Ron White -6.00, -5.18

      by zenbassoon on Sun Jun 16, 2013 at 07:59:36 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  The collection is repression. If you know that (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      deep info

      your records and connections and patterns are being held, then you'll be more careful in your speech and in your behavior.  You'll self-repress, because you know it all is being monitored.

      Some reporters have said that sources are becoming reluctant to talk about anything, let alone this.

      Whether they look at any given person is beyond the point. The fact that they have collected all the information on everyone, all the time, means that they CAN look whenever they feel like it and you'll never even know (until they come knocking at your door).

      With a regular search warrant, the warrant is served on the target.  The FBI issues "subject of an investigation letters."  In other words, in traditional crimes, you are always notified by one means or another that the government has it's eyes on you.

      Not so with the NSA and secret warrants, etc.  No one ever knows what they are doing with your info. All sorts of abuses are possible.

      "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

      by YucatanMan on Sun Jun 16, 2013 at 08:34:04 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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