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View Diary: Alan Grayson on Dems willing to cut Social Security "Members like that deserve to be Disciplined!" (94 comments)

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  •  Not only do we need more Dems but BETTER ones (120+ / 0-)

    too!

    "If Wall Street paid a tax on every “game” they run, we would get enough revenue to run the government on." ~ Will Rogers

    by Lefty Coaster on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 03:01:09 AM PDT

    •  Can we not sacrifice the latter for the former... (8+ / 0-)

      this time?

      “I don’t make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts.” – Will Rogers

      by markthshark on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 04:15:59 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Not right now, unfortunately. (10+ / 0-)

        Numbers aren't high enough. Right now we need MORE BETTER Democrats, and those who can't behave themselves need to be slapped around inside both Congress and the Senate.

        Love or hate the President all you want -- but we have GOT to retake the House and hold the Senate in 2014!

        by mwm341 on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 04:37:06 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  I'm sorry but if they aren't with us on social sec (20+ / 0-)

        they can call themselves democrats but they're WORTHLESS to us.  There's no point in voting blue otherwise. you're either with us or we're going to vote green just to prevent the party from justifying the "third way" position.

        I want a democrat to primary these people. I'd rather vomit then have to vote green but after all this time I refuse to consider it a non option because simply not showing up is the alternative and the simple truth is if I don't show up because the party pissed me off I give the third way assholes who keep saying the party needs move to the mythical center right. I'm an "indepedent" but registered democrat. I swing by not showing up.

        http://www.actblue.com/page/accountabilitynow If the dnc dscc or dccc send you mailers, send that link back to them and tell them you won't send money to people who defend democrats who betray progressive principals!

        by daeros on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 06:49:42 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  No more. I don't intend to let the remnants of the (9+ / 0-)

          DLC and third way groups  justify their crap

          you should be thanking me, not pissed at me because i'll vote blue if I POSSIBLY can. and here in oregon I don't think I have much to worry about but i'm so tired of the disillusioned 27 year olds I hang out with who just won't show up because the party doesn't represent us

          No more. No more letting people get away with talking about how the left right paradigm is unreal and no more letting the third way crowd give them a n excuse to make the parties resemble each other.

          vote. Vote even if you have to protest vote.

          http://www.actblue.com/page/accountabilitynow If the dnc dscc or dccc send you mailers, send that link back to them and tell them you won't send money to people who defend democrats who betray progressive principals!

          by daeros on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 06:53:22 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Completely agree (29+ / 0-)

          Until the recent NSA spying revelations broke, my sig line was "If you want to cut Social Security you're not a real Democrat."  The president, particularly, has done his best to rob that label of any meaning whatsoever, especially since his chained-CPI betrayal.  He's the one who should have been disciplined by the party, with a loud and universal chorus of "NO!"  The party's leadership's craven acquiescence with this plan did more to damage the Democratic party's reputation and prospects than anything Republicans have done in my memory.

          We have always been at war with al Qaeda.

          by Dallasdoc on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 08:51:16 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  To a large extent, president is the party (13+ / 0-)

            Which is a major part of the problem.  OFA is the only viable grassroots organization--the structure that Dean built up was essentially folded into it.  Presidential fundraisers are (literally) political gold for many members.

            When the WH exerts that much influence over grassroots efforts and fundraising, it exerts a lot of control over senators and MOC's.  While I agree w/ this comment and w/ Grayson's thesis,  I (very) reluctantly understand why the members would act differently.  Plus, there are far too many of them who have bought into the Turd Way, anyhow.

            Some men see things as they are and ask why. I dream of things that never were and ask why not?

            by RFK Lives on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 09:11:23 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  If that's true, the party is screwed (18+ / 0-)

              The party needs its critics and its left wing represented.  If it doesn't have us, it will shrink dramatically and be in an even worse position than the Republican party is.

              Corporate-wing Democrats shouldn't assume that the rest of us will follow meekly behind and swallow their bullshit forever.  That just won't happen.  They'll have more disaffected voters dropping away, see voting participation fall, and invite more agitation on the left for a viable alternative.  If that's the way they want to roll, we probably can't stop them.  Doesn't make it a good idea, though.

              We have always been at war with al Qaeda.

              by Dallasdoc on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 09:20:32 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  I'll go further than that (10+ / 0-)
                The party needs its critics and its left wing represented.
                The Democratic Party has to be the left wing.

                I'll say it again, the virtue of a two party political system with a left and a right is that each party acts as a check on extremism on the part of the other party.

                We no longer have a two party political system with a left and a right. There hasn't been a check on the right in decades.

                Others have simply gotten old. I prefer to think I've been tempered by time.

                by Just Bob on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 10:21:48 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Running Center Left, Obama got 69.5 (6+ / 0-)

                  million votes.

                  Governing Center Right and running Center, he got 66.

                  Mr. Universe is a known degenerate Robotophile, and his sources include former Browncoat Traitors. What is their agenda in leaking top secret information about the Reavers and endangering us all?

                  by JesseCW on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 11:09:26 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  We have to define the center (0+ / 0-)

                    It isn't what it once was.

                    I'll take a crack at it.

                    The center is objective reality. I know it's an elusive philosophical term and many would argue it doesn't exist. I have no intention to indulge in philosophical and rhetorical discussion. The extremists at both ends of the spectrum will be quick to debunk any departure from reality.

                    There is room for differences in perspective. There will never be a time when we all agree, but we can still rely on empirical observations. It's incumbent on the individual to be well enough informed to separate the wheat from the chaff.

                    Others have simply gotten old. I prefer to think I've been tempered by time.

                    by Just Bob on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 11:31:07 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

              •  I'm not sure if they realize it yet (9+ / 0-)

                just how much they screwed the pooch with "Social Security on the table". I think they're gonna find out next year.

                They'll be damned lucky if they eke out any kind of majority.

                "The “Left” is NOT divided on the need to oppose austerity and the Great Betrayal. The Third Way is not left or center or even right. It is Wall Street on the Potomac."--Bill Black

                by lunachickie on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 10:47:25 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

              •  These folks are the Rockefeller Republicans (7+ / 0-)

                who already had to switch parties once.

                If they could drive them out, we can too.

                Mr. Universe is a known degenerate Robotophile, and his sources include former Browncoat Traitors. What is their agenda in leaking top secret information about the Reavers and endangering us all?

                by JesseCW on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 11:07:54 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

            •  The president is not the party! That is why (12+ / 0-)

              our party is at war with itself. He was elected to represent our values, our wishes, not the other way around.

              Democratic values define our party. I think the Obama supporters have forgotten the values that were listed in the 2008 Democratic Platform:

              We Democrats have a special commitment to this promise of America. We believe that every American, whatever their background or station in life, should have the chance to get a good education, to work at a good job with good wages, to raise and provide for a family, to live in safe surroundings, and to retire with dignity and security. We believe that quality and affordable health care is a basic right. We believe that each succeeding generation should have the opportunity, through hard work, service and sacrifice, to enjoy a brighter future than the last.
              --
              The American Dream is at risk. Incomes are down and foreclosures are up. Millions of our fellow citizens have no health insurance while families working longer hours are pressed for time to care for their children and aging parents. Gas and home heating costs are squeezing seniors and working families alike. We are less secure and less respected in the world. After September 11, we could have built the foundation for a new American century, but instead we instigated an unnecessary war in Iraq before finishing a necessary war in Afghanistan. Careless policies, inept stewardship and the broken politics of this Administration have taken their toll on our economy, our security and our reputation.

              But even worse than the conditions we find ourselves in are the false promises that brought us here. The Republican leadership said they would keep us safe, but they overextended our military and failed to respond to new challenges. They said they would be compassionate conservatives, but they failed to rescue our citizens from the rooftops of New Orleans, neglected our veterans, and denied health insurance to children. They promised fiscal responsibility but instead gave tax cuts to the wealthy few and squandered almost a trillion dollars in Iraq. They promised reform but allowed the oil companies to write our energy agenda and the credit card companies to write the bankruptcy rules.

              These are not just policy failures. They are failures of a broken politics –a politics that rewards self-interest over the common interest and the short-term over the long-term, that puts our government at the service of the powerful. A politics that creates a state-of-the-art system for doling out favors and shuts out the voice of the American people.

              So, we come together not only to replace this President and his party –and not only to offer policies that will undo the damage they have wrought. Today, we pledge a return to core moral principles like stewardship, service to others, personal responsibility, shared sacrifice and a fair shot for all –values that emanate from the integrity and optimism of our Founders and generations of Americans since. Today, we Democrats offer leaders – from the White House to the State House – worthy of this country's trust.

              The president has turned his back on the commitments we made as a party to the American people when we wrote that platform. Instead of returning us to values that embrace human worth, he has repeatedly sided with the republicans, and now, we have the largest income gap in American history. He has broken almost every campaign promise he has made. If you don't believe it, just read how many of these promises have been pushed aside during his term in office.
              We will start by renewing the American Dream for a new era – with the same new hope and new ideas that propelled Franklin Delano Roosevelt towards the New Deal and John F. Kennedy to the New Frontier. We will provide immediate relief to working people who have lost their jobs, families who are in danger of losing their homes, and those who – no matter how hard they work – are seeing prices go up more than their income. We will invest in America again –in world-class public education, in our infrastructure, and in green technology –so that our economy can generate the good, high-paying jobs of the future. We will end the outrage of unaffordable, unavailable health care, protect Social Security, and help Americans save for retirement. And we will harness American ingenuity to free this nation from the tyranny of oil.
              •  Well stated (11+ / 0-)

                The party is its followers, not its leaders.  The reason corporatists hogging all the power positions is deeply damaging to the party is that their actions threaten to lose many followers who disapprove of those actions.  This, by definition, hurts the party by shrinking it.  

                Obama has shown little or no interest in party-building since he was first elected.  His campaign apparatus has been oriented toward his personal use, and did piss-all for the party in 2010.  We saw how that went down.  Leaders and those choosing to follow them can blame others for drifting away when they don't feel heard or represented.  But the fault lies with them, not with those walking away.  If a party can't attract a majority of voters, it fails in its most basic task.  The leaders have to take the fall for that.

                We have always been at war with al Qaeda.

                by Dallasdoc on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 10:02:16 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  Absolutely. Every good company realizes that (7+ / 0-)

                  signs of poor leadership is a sudden exodus of employees from the company.

                  •  I'll be interested to see (4+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    praenomen, Dallasdoc, niemann, elwior

                    registration numbers overall as we approach 2016.

                    IMO, I've thought for awhile now that all of this shit is by design--this "dividing the left". We're more easily divided than the right anyway, because we are so much more diverse to begin with.

                    But we couldn't have had a Lefty Tea Party. It would have actually been popular. It still frosts me to this day how that corporate astroturf bullshit cheapened something as real as the Tea Party Revolt.

                    "The “Left” is NOT divided on the need to oppose austerity and the Great Betrayal. The Third Way is not left or center or even right. It is Wall Street on the Potomac."--Bill Black

                    by lunachickie on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 10:50:39 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  IOW a Republican org became... a Republican org. (1+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      Dallasdoc

                      With all due respect, since what you're talking about is Ron Paul's "tax day tea parties" (old Republican grumps in mock-colonial garb whining about taxes) being replaced by Dick Armey's Teabaggers (Aetna employees in Aetna blazers chanting slogans against health care), you're merely discussing astroturf replacing astroturf.

                      Frankly, several Democratic Party "camp-followers" have already founded a few well-funded vanity projects of that sort that are currently sucking the air out of the political atmosphere, & I for 1 want nothing to do with those people.

                      Occupy was/is true grass roots — & you can tell how much the neoliberal establishment hated & feared them by how brutal their hired goons have been to its outward signs. What it needs now is a constant, society-changing street-presence.

                      •  Astroturf is astroturf (1+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        praenomen

                        and words and phrases matter when you have blanket coverage from coast-to-coast. The words "Tea Party" have been re-defined in terms of "audience reaction". Kind of like "impeachment" has.

                        There's a whole sub-chapter of propaganda devoted to that sort of thing...

                        "The “Left” is NOT divided on the need to oppose austerity and the Great Betrayal. The Third Way is not left or center or even right. It is Wall Street on the Potomac."--Bill Black

                        by lunachickie on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 02:18:54 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

                  •  Absolutely (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    praenomen, aliasalias

                    And good companies don't blame the employees walking away for their leadership failures - they blame the poor leadership.

                    However, the Democratic Party Third-Way Beltway Corporate-Coin-Operated Party and their apologists continue to blame the voters for not continuing to suck it up and stand in line for hours to vote for a party that repeatedly fails to represent their interests.   We work hard to elect people to represent our interests and when they repeatedly support policies that don't they cannot expect people to support their re-election.

                    Yes, the other guys are worse.  Much worse.  But continuing to work for and vote for those who treat us like chumps says more about us than it does about them.

                    There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

                    by Puddytat on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 04:39:46 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

            •  It would help, too, if ... (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              elwior, Dallasdoc, Puddytat

              ... the Senate and House seats -- including those of Democrats -- weren't overwhelming filled with WEALTHY PEOPLE.

              Plus, there are far too many of them who have bought into the Turd Way, anyhow.
              Really, how many members of Congress count as middle-class -- let alone lower middle-class?  Let alone, in poverty?

              Even with the best intentions -- which is granting them a lot -- can they still really "represent" the rest of us?

      •  Why should we sacrifice anything? (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        elwior, Puddytat, aliasalias

        How about better Dems, period?

        DINOs have hurt us much too much in the last 20 years.  I want to vote for a Dem who espouses a Democratic platform based on the US Constitution, not some middle-of-the-road compromiser who is going to always, consistently, give in to the fucking Repukes every blasted time.

        I'm sick of attempts to steer this nation from principles evolved in The Age of Reason to hallucinations derived from illiterate herdsmen. ~ Crashing Vor

        by NonnyO on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 01:15:45 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I thought we did that in 2008 (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          NonnyO

          It was the first time in years that I was voting FOR great candidates and not just against someone.   I was pumped up and excited.

          And all I've got to show for it are my Obama/Change You Can Believe In tee shirts.

          There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

          by Puddytat on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 04:43:14 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I voted against... (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Puddytat

            ... the old man and the tundra tramp.  I could not vote FOR the favored Dem candidates (whose positions differed very little from the others who had the exact same positions, down to using the same words, sentences, phrases).

            After all the Frontrunner Candidates had answers very much like Obama's by the summer of '07, I gave up on them.

            I liked Kucinich's not-for-profit single-payer health care plan and admired the fact that he brought articles of impeachment against Dumbya and Dickie and originally planned to write his name in.

            Then came RNC.  Before she was three sentences into her VP acceptance speech, my jaw dropped into my lap, I knew the Tundra Tramp could not be allowed within walking distance of the Oval Office because she was just as, or more, stupid than Dumbya, so I was forced to reconsider my planned write-in and vote against them [thus, "for" Obama-Biden].  Anybody but the lecherous old man and the tundra tramp!

            I'm sick of attempts to steer this nation from principles evolved in The Age of Reason to hallucinations derived from illiterate herdsmen. ~ Crashing Vor

            by NonnyO on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 05:41:43 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

    •  Citizens United and Legalized Bribery (10+ / 0-)

      make it such that OUR representatives do not work for us.  They know where their bread is buttered.  But I love Grayson suggesting when they do this, they are TOAST!

      Separation of Church and State AND Corporation

      by Einsteinia on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 08:37:04 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  They need to fear a backlash (12+ / 0-)

        "If Wall Street paid a tax on every “game” they run, we would get enough revenue to run the government on." ~ Will Rogers

        by Lefty Coaster on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 08:43:53 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  they need to get a backlash (10+ / 0-)

          not just fearit. Threatening them just doesn't work as what choice do we have? Fuck this more non Dems. If they aren't democratic and are flying under the the D's primary their asses. What where up against is a Democratic party machine that is owned and run by the Third Way'ers. Debbie Wasermann with her 'What kill list?' Harry with his bs. procedural rules? Dkifi the torture loving 'intelligance' queen. Even Nancy Pelosi with her take it off the table and get off my lawn. All these so called centrist's are not even center or moderate they may be better then a vagina probing theocratic Ayn Randain but they are not Democratic or even democratic.

          They sucked at being the loyal opposition and they were worse once they became the majority. They certainly blew off their majority but quick. In a way they are worse then as they do share the same agenda as the right on many issues and the RW maniac's are so nuts that the blue dog's use them as a fear tactic to keep real Democrat's, in DC and the rank and file, from demanding real Democrat's to vote for. In short they are complicit and all we get from the DC establishment pols is kabuki that is so bad only a fool believes that this all we the people can get.

          Howard Dean a real moderate Democrat is thinking about running. Even if he doesn't we need to run real Dems who are not purist's but democratic and primary these complicit Third Way anti-democratic neocon corporatist's. The Third Way is not Democratic and it owns our party at this point.

          'I'm taking back my country and the vehicle I'm using is the Democratic Party' Howard Dean

          If the a political party stops being a vehicle for representation and is just a more cosmetic version of the oh so scary hardliner RW what good is it. Cart before the horse politics that makes loser of all of us even when we win. These DINO's have gone too far and it's time to say enough and take it back.  

                 

    •  Support your local Democratic candidate (11+ / 0-)

      Seek them out.  They have very small budgets.

      Alan Grayson inspired me to run for office, State Representative ... I got squished.  No hard feelings, I did it and that's a bucket item crossed off.

      •  Thank you for running!! (6+ / 0-)

        Maybe the next Dem won't be squished because you paved the way.  Or the one after that.  Funny how, despite our oft repeated mantra "Better Democrats!", we never think that the better Democrat might be US!  Anyone who has been paying attention knows how hard it often is to FIND a candidate for many of these local races.  And we have a nasty habit of referring to new (brave!) unknown candidates as "some dude".   We always seem to be paying attention to the wrong end of the stick.  If we want Better Democrats in our national houses of congress, we better start at the other end, by selecting and electing Better Democrats at the local level.  Instead we ignore the local and let the guy who thinks he has to be a centrist, or conservative run. We don't pay much attention to selecting Better Democrats at the local level, and promoting them up the ladder, and then were surprised and disappointed when we don't have Better choices at the national level.

      •  First time out & you got squished? Well . . . (5+ / 0-)

        that is the normal outcome. Now apply what you learned to what you knew, and take a look around at the here and now. Did you break the ice for another candidate or yourself? You did if you got 4 to 5% more votes than the last challenger for that office.

        If you pay attention to what is being preached and taught at the NetRoots Convention, you know there are emerging new ways to overcome a deficit of campaign dollars.

         

        Those who fought the war in Afghanistan won it. Get them out of Afghanistan NOW . . . It's long past time. The time has come to repair this country and care for its' veterans.

        by llbear on Sat Jun 22, 2013 at 09:32:07 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Put Alan on the Supreme Court! (7+ / 0-)

      Alan would make Scalia's life a living hell.

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