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View Diary: "They Like Sticking It To The United States" (330 comments)

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  •  I guess I don't believe we're getting dirtier (1+ / 0-)
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    Don midwest

    Rather, we're devolving to where we used to be, be it regarding race relations, militarism, paranoia, imperialism, misogyny, etc. We were never quite the country many of us like to claim we were, just as Obama isn't quite the "greatest president evah" that some still like to delude themselves into believing. You can't fix a problem until you recognize its nature and severity.

    I guess I'm saying that I'm what some call a "realist", preferring to see things are they are, not as I'd like them to be. To suggest that that's defeatism is just silly. Realism is a starting point, not a justification for inaction.

    "Liberty without virtue would be no blessing to us" - Benjamin Rush, 1777

    by kovie on Sun Jul 07, 2013 at 05:40:59 PM PDT

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    •  You seem to be confusing realism with acceptance (0+ / 0-)

      I think there are honest disagreements with your opinion, starting with its defeatism. You can be of the opinion that you're not being defeatist, but that doesn't change the fact that others see you that way.

      To appear to claim some kind of "smarter position" because in you're opinion, you're more realistic than others is not terribly conducive to change, either.  

      •  That's the old moon is made of cheese argument (0+ / 0-)

        To state things as they objectively are is neither defeatist nor optimistic, and no, we are not all entitled to our facts. What one does with the facts and how one predicts they will unfold is where one finds defeatism or optimism.

        When I say that we have always been far from perfect and often just plain godawful I'm not expressing an opinion, nor saying that we're never going to get any better. I'm expressing indisputable fact, and leaving the door open on whether we can ever get any better.

        "Liberty without virtue would be no blessing to us" - Benjamin Rush, 1777

        by kovie on Sun Jul 07, 2013 at 10:10:12 PM PDT

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