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View Diary: U.S. Government Repeals Ban - Opens Floodgate to Mass Agitprop Meant for Domestic Consumption (104 comments)

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  •  remember the W Bush infomercials? (45+ / 0-)

    made by cabinet members and distributed to the media?

    can't wait for more of those!

    the people in the Soviet Union knew that the press was full of lies and learned how to read it

    the people in the US think that the press is full of truth and how they read it provides the way to maintain the push of the oligarchy to control all our commons

    should the name of PBS be changed now that corporations have ads that they can use for PR?

    it is no longer the Public Broadcasting System

    •  GBS? (24+ / 0-)

      It will be interesting though to watch the agitprop machine compete with the corporate media interests.

      But, like I said in the diary, this "reform" cannot bode well for independent media, the demise of which will eventually end investigative journalism in America once and for all.

      'Cuz freedom can't protect itself ~~ EFF ~ EPIC ~ ACLU

      by markthshark on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 04:55:06 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  A very troubling reality is Wall Street news... (18+ / 0-)

      ....which is, already, as much fiction as it is fact these days, would fall under this domain, since the Treasury Department (i.e.: the Treasury Secretary) is now fully represented on the National Security Council.

      "I always thought if you worked hard enough and tried hard enough, things would work out. I was wrong." --Katharine Graham

      by bobswern on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 06:26:17 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  +1 (9+ / 0-)

        Average Americans probably don't have any idea how dangerous this convergence will be.

        The propaganda isn't just for waging ground wars and military action.  The real power is in controlling economies.

        "If you can't take their money, eat their food, drink their booze and then vote against them, you have no business being in DC."

        by Betty Pinson on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 08:54:33 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  This law does not involve Treasury (5+ / 0-)

        Nor the Security Council

        It applies only to State and BBG (VOA, Radio Free Europe, etc.); and it only allows them to use content that they have always had for dissemination in foreign countries. The "lifting of the ban" simply means it's no longer illegal for us to listen to it. Be kind of interesting to know what we are saying to those countries, doncha think?

        “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

        by Catte Nappe on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 09:10:51 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Let me ask you this (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          aliasalias, 3goldens, markthshark

          If the USA is No 1 and so wonderful that all these folks immigrate and migrate and apply for asylum here... fleeing to the golden streets of America and its freedoms...

          Why then is the US afraid to let people who have already arrived here judge their surroundings for themselves as a comparison with what they hear on Russian News or other independent news?

          Why do we have to bring the propaganda that is piped to foreign audiences here?

          If it's so perfect in those immigrant communities... or elsewhere... why do we need the propaganda piped into our domestic homes?

          I'll tell you why... because there's rot. Putrid rot. The streets of America are hungry and dilapidated and corrupt. And they know it. They keep building walls as if they never learned a damn thing from the Berlin Wall.

          We've had a coup. Silent. But, still deadly to our democratic underpinnings.


          A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they know they shall never sit.

          by bronte17 on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 09:45:22 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Apparently you've answered your own question (3+ / 0-)

            To your own satisfaction. So you may not actually have any interest at all in my answer.

            Why is it now to be accessed domestically, when it couldn't be before?
            Because it was really stupid to continue the banm making it illegal for anyone in the US to see/hear it; it was easy enough to get to it online for anyone who wanted it.

            Because there are some immigrant communities that would still like to listen to the programming, in their native languages, that they listened to before they came here.

            Because it wouldn't hurt a bit for any of us who cared to or are able to understand, to listen to it, and know for ourselves what is being disseminated in those other countries.  As the ACLU said - it helps transparency.

            “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

            by Catte Nappe on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 09:52:03 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Like drones? (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              aliasalias, 3goldens, markthshark

              Because drones were sold to the public as a clean way to manage foreign terrorists and now the drones are domestic to control us.

              The propaganda is for a purpose that is at crossroads with a domestic audience.


              A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they know they shall never sit.

              by bronte17 on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 10:15:31 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

            •  You keep referencing the authority of the ACLU but (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              3goldens, markthshark

              they aren't seers and make mistakes too. Unintended consequences creep up.

              Just like the ACLU saw no problem with police license plate scanners... until the police abused that power. "At first, we (ACLU) didn't think it posed much of a privacy problem..."

              Police may know exactly where you were last Tuesday

              License plate scanners are the dark horse of the surveillance world. They've been around for a decade, but people rarely notice. They don't look much different from closed circuit cameras, perched over busy intersections. Or they're just another device mounted on a passing police car.

              But they notice you: A scanner can ID thousands of plates a day. And says the vast majority of police agencies now use them.

              --snip--

              "At first, we didn't think it posed much of a privacy problem," Crump said. The ACLU saw a system that triggered a real-time alert to the presence of a stolen vehicle, or a car linked to a fugitive, and that seemed acceptable. But then the group realized police were storing the license plate scans — whether or not there had been a "hit."

              The ACLU's public records requests show some departments have accumulated millions of scans, and the agencies store the data for years — even indefinitely. The scans are also being shared across departments, and with the federal government.


              A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they know they shall never sit.

              by bronte17 on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 10:45:57 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  I cite them because they have a good summary (3+ / 0-)

                You can certainly go to the exacct language of the bill.
                It pertains only to State and the BBG, and it covers only material intended for distribution overseas.

                Except as provided in paragraph (2), the Secretary and the Broadcasting Board of Governors may, upon request and reimbursement of the reasonable costs incurred in fulfilling such a request, make available, in the United States, motion pictures, films, video, audio, and other materials prepared for dissemination abroad or disseminated abroad
                No funds authorized to be appropriated to the Department of State or the Broadcasting Board of Governors shall be used to influence public opinion in the United States.
                The provisions of this section shall apply only to the Department of State and the Broadcasting Board of Governors and to no other department or agency of the Federal Government.’.
                http://www.govtrack.us/...

                “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

                by Catte Nappe on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 10:59:19 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  I think it's naive to think this... (0+ / 0-)

                  "lifting of the ban" on domestic propaganda as being innocuous.

                  You keep saying that it means they're just going to start piping in VoA and Radio Free Europe. While that may be true; what's to stop them from developing other programs?

                  I believe that propaganda will be come in any number of ways, shapes and forms. These guys are masters of agitprop. And our government just codified it for domestic consumption. It's unwise to give them the benefit of the doubt here. Our federal government deserves no such consideration at this point in time.

                  They'll develop radio/tv programming and with attractive spokespeople that deliver just the right amount of truth to make what they're selling seem credible -- while at the same time strategically injecting a proportionate amount of agitprop into the mix.

                  And it's bound to go beyond that to eventually include press releases and external memorandum from regulatory agencies, Congress and the White House. We already have enough of a problem squeezing the truth out of our government.

                  That arduous task has just become exponentially more difficult... and more complex.

                  'Cuz freedom can't protect itself ~~ EFF ~ EPIC ~ ACLU

                  by markthshark on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 06:59:16 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  So, who to trust as a source? (0+ / 0-)

                    And don't all of these government agencies already
                    issue press and news releases? Should we foot the bill
                    for commercial advertising and related marketing? Aren't
                    advertising costs included in the price of everything we buy?

                    Do I trust an anonymous blogger
                    or my own sheeple eyes and ears?

                    If my tinfoil blocks out corporate and government
                    frequencies, what can I use against agitprop internet
                    unicorn outrage glitterati? Will these rainbows work?

                    How can we address and solve global issues without
                    granting sovereignty to ourselves beyond the nation state?

                    Obviously, those who fear and distrust their own elected
                    leaders are not going to be a source for needed solutions
                    in the political and economic systems now extant.

                    Exactly where, and what, are your solutions?

                  •  Read the effing bill (0+ / 0-)
                    No funds authorized to be appropriated to the Department of State or the Broadcasting Board of Governors shall be used to influence public opinion in the United States.
                    The provisions of this section shall apply only to the Department of State and the Broadcasting Board of Governors and to no other department or agency of the Federal Government.’.
                    No ban on domestic propaganda was lifted. The only ban that was lifted was the one that prevented us from viewing/hearing what they were already disseminating in foreign countries.

                    “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

                    by Catte Nappe on Thu Jul 18, 2013 at 09:23:49 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

        •  Sorry, but your comment IS the definitive... (6+ / 0-)

          ...government response to the matter, virtually verbatim. It has little to do with the truth of the greater, over-arching result(s).

          Our government outright lied to us in 2008-2009, and then on an ongoing basis, as far as the solvency of the TBTFs were concerned. It was frequently stated in the blogs, and tacitly in the MSM, that this greater truth was a much about the security of the nation as it was anything else.

          Remember that the next time you hear Treasury Secretary Lew, Fed Chair Bernanke, or President Obama express their concerns about what effect any particular comment they might make or action they might support would have (whether it's a statement from them, or something they would argue they shouldn't allow to occur on Main Street, or elsewhere) in terms of its "effect upon the markets." That last phrase has also applied to making--and/or not making--reality-based, public statements regarding our nation's financial institutions, far more often than most, even in this community, would acknowledge.

          The results of those "Stress Tests" of our nation's largest banks, back in the first-half of 2009 come to mind as a clearcut example of this greater truth. (What a farce that was.) And, if that wasn't propaganda, nothing was or is.

          "I always thought if you worked hard enough and tried hard enough, things would work out. I was wrong." --Katharine Graham

          by bobswern on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 11:22:38 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  And that has what to do with this bill? (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Larsstephens

            Which is what my comment was referencing.

            “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

            by Catte Nappe on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 11:45:33 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Propaganda comes in many flavors, sanctioned... (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              3goldens, markthshark

              ...or otherwise. Domestically, it's been writ large even prior to it being officially sanctioned now. Now that it is officially sanctioned, or, as many in our government like to state it, "perfectly legal," the floodgates will open even wider than they (already) are, today. And, "you CAN take that to the bank."

              To posit that something that's already occurring on a virtually unrestrained basis up until now, will be constrained because of language in a piece of legislation that accomplishes exactly the opposite of that reality, is just pure parroting of government memes, IMHO. (I think most reading this would agree with that truth, too.)

              "I always thought if you worked hard enough and tried hard enough, things would work out. I was wrong." --Katharine Graham

              by bobswern on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 01:28:26 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

    •  PBS has been Petroleum BS for decades now. n/t (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      markthshark

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