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View Diary: U.S. Government Repeals Ban - Opens Floodgate to Mass Agitprop Meant for Domestic Consumption (104 comments)

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  •  How would this differ for NPR or the BBC (help) (9+ / 0-)

    I know I'll get frickin' murdered for being confused and asking for more clarification instead of simply joining the chorus but...

    I mean, "unleashed"? That implies a ton of Americans would be interested in listening in the first place. But corporate media has tricks like saturation advertising and cheap sleaze to reel people in. What the hell is VOA gonna have to reel people in, seriously? Why would any loyal fascist pick VOA over Fox News? Why would anybody looking for bread and circuses go here? Somali language programming is a threat? Is anyone else kinda getting why Drudge BIG GUB'MINT freaked out over this in the same way he flips about everything from Obamacare to "Obama Phones"?

    Matter of fact......wait.......

    ....

    yep, okay, I could already get EVERYTHING VOA has to offer on TuneIn Radio??? What? Would I get a "NO YOU CAN'T LISTEN TO THIS CITIZEN" message on my Kindle before this new law? If not, doesn't internet broadcasting basically render the old ban moot anyway?

    Very Confused.

    And wait the ban never applied to the freaking D....O....D!??! WHAT. DID I READ THAT RIGHT. BECAUSE IF THAT'S THE CASE, THAT OLD BAN WAS WORTH ITS WEIGHT IN DOG POO IMHO. YOU GOTTA BE KIDDING ME. THE HEAD OF THE FRICKIN DRAGON WAS EXEMPT???

    CONFUSED!

    I see the awful POTENTIAL there.....but I see awful POTENTIAL for lllllllllllllllots of things, like uhhh a fucking race war in our not-too-distant future but I digress.

    Look. I can easily see how this could ultimately turn out to be a total non-event instead of uhhh a major blow against American democracy. I mean I'm seeing this implication that these gov't outlets would be an equal competitor to the corporate media? Like, stop and think about the plausibility of that.

    ....

    i dunno, i'm starting to feel lonely as hell outside of Black Kos diaries nowdays....

    "See? I'm not a racist! I have a black friend!"

    by TheHalfrican on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 06:16:25 AM PDT

    •  I don't expect VoA to be coming stateside... (9+ / 0-)

      or Radio Free Europe. Those programs only make sense to international audiences.

      I mean, "unleashed"? That implies a ton of Americans would be interested in listening in the first place.
      But this "reform" opens up all sorts of opportunities for other venues for domestic propaganda.

      'Cuz freedom can't protect itself ~~ EFF ~ EPIC ~ ACLU

      by markthshark on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 06:26:34 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  oh okay, it is a potential thing (7+ / 0-)

        Thanks for answering. :)

        still, it would probably be our interests to game out a little more specifically how this would happen, what the likely plan of attack is, so to speak. Right now it all seems very abstract. The obvious scenario I suppose would be extensive collusion between gov't news and corporate news.....or just skipping the middleman and subsidizing Fox News.

        ........

        Excuse me, I pooped a little after typing "subsidizing Fox News".

        Dammit.

        I liked these cargo shorts. DX

        "See? I'm not a racist! I have a black friend!"

        by TheHalfrican on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 06:53:22 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Actually it doesn't open up new venues (7+ / 0-)

        The ban applied only to State Dept. and Broadcasting Board of Governors (BBG) (i.e. VOA and such). There may well be little interest in the content from other than international audiences - but we really haven't had a chance to know that since it has been illegal to hear it. However, one of the points of discussion has been that it is of interest to large immigrant communities who were able to access it in their native countries, but could not once in the US.

        “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

        by Catte Nappe on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 07:38:00 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  "There may well be little interest in the content" (5+ / 0-)

          Not so sure of that. I can imagine a lot of Americans listening VERY carefully to VoA, etc. to contrast their output with that of other sources and call them on their bullsh!t. Allowing them to be accessed here is a good thing in that sense since we have very little knowledge of what is being said in our names overseas.
          We may not be able to do anything about it, but then, we might if we had that knowledge.
          Where I would be interested would be to see the difference between USGov propaganda and US Corporate propaganda.

          If I ran this circus, things would be DIFFERENT!

          by CwV on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 08:02:05 AM PDT

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        •  What's disturbing is not VoA or Radio Free Europe. (7+ / 0-)

          It's the new ways the government will develop to disseminate.

          The government will concentrate of localizing their efforts at first -- aiming their programming towards small communities -- before taking it nationally.

          The bad thing is that the propaganda will be pernicious in nature. The majority of Americans will not know what's real and what's not. We've already reached the saturation level on propaganda in this country.

          But the government just codified it.

          'Cuz freedom can't protect itself ~~ EFF ~ EPIC ~ ACLU

          by markthshark on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 08:09:33 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  In the Google news (6+ / 0-)

        pages, Voice of America stories regularly appear in their search results.  I noticed that their stories started showing up maybe a year ago in the Google news.  Most of the stories that I come across are related to the wars.


        "Justice is a commodity"

        by joanneleon on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 08:16:23 AM PDT

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      •  Really? (3+ / 0-)

        Because when we lived in Turkey VOA was about the only  broadcast in ENGLISH, with news about the US, and other things like broadway shows and music that most Turks wouldn't have been interested in.

        But I sure as hell was.

        I also listened to BBC World Service, and occasionally we picked up some other stations in English, broadcast by other countries. None of them were on all the time, so you had to make an effort to find them and note when they were on.

        Which we all did, because there wasn't much English language news other than that.

        I heard about Nixon's resignation on VOA. I got updates on the Watergate hearings from them. They were the voice of HOME for a lot of military in remote areas and expats.

    •  You are not confused at all (9+ / 0-)
      doesn't internet broadcasting basically render the old ban moot anyway?
      ACLU agrees with you
      Much of the support for the Thornberry-Smith Amendment has focused on the fact that modern technology (and especially the Internet) renders the ban largely ineffective.  For instance, it’s a simple matter to download VOA material, even though doing so is technically a violation of the law.
      Furthermore, they think you should be able to listed to what the US is saying to the rest of the world.
      From a First Amendment perspective, however, the ban is both highly paternalistic and a nightmare for government transparency.  As noted, State- and BBG-produced material are exempt from the Freedom of Information Act.  
      http://www.aclu.org/...

      Feeling lonely - that I can't much help you with, other than to assure you you aren't totally alone around here.

      “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

      by Catte Nappe on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 07:32:16 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Wow, for the first time in my life (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        markthshark, shaharazade

        I disagree with the ACLU.

        There is a substantial segment of the population that only gets news through radio.

        Consolidation of media, combined with removal of the Fairness Doctrine, locked these people into only getting right-wing news.

        This is not fair to these people, nor is it in the best interests of the country.

        This occurred primary in rural areas (urban areas are harder to consolidate as there are more radio stations).

        ---

        We had finally started making some headway against RW radio by going after their sponsors. This lets them end-run around that, by outsourcing VOA programming. (Of course they'll do it in the name of "efficiency".) Like the MIC, those outsourcing contracts will go primarily to conservative outfits.

        End result: RW radio subsidized by your tax dollars, making up for all those lost sponsors. Limbaugh oinks all the way to the bank.

        And that, dear readers, is why Limbaugh never complained about this governmental intrusion.

        "What could BPossibly go wrong??" -RLMiller "God is just pretend." - eru

        by nosleep4u on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 08:40:08 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  You may not disagree with the ACLU (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          mmacdDE, Larsstephens

          Because the scenario you are outlining has nothing to do with the facts or intentions of the bill. You aren't going to see VOA as a subsidiary of Fox news. You aren't going to see a sudden surge of new programming on some Radio Free Europe (American version). All they are doing is allowing you to listen to what those outlets are already broadcasting overseas. And if you happen to be an immigrant who has limited English it would no longer be illegal for you to listen to the programming you enjoyed when you lived in your native country.

          “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

          by Catte Nappe on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 09:05:44 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  I'm guessing (5+ / 0-)

      that it would differ in that NPR and BBC admit to being partly govt funded, and public broadcasting.

      I don't know if this govt. propaganda content would be identified as such.  I think we're not talking about stations here, but content created by the US govt and sent out through all the private airwaves and channels.  And I don't know if they have to disclaim who wrote it.

      What I'm also wondering is if this will make it legal to plant CIA operatives inside the various US media outlets.  We know that it happened in the past, the Mighty Wurlitzer.  I believe it was an interview with a CBS executive who admitted that they took material from the CIA and broadcast it without telling the public that's where it came from.  I strongly believe that happens today as well, though I thought it was illegal, or it was.  Basically it means that we pay to be propagandized by our own govt. and it's done secretly. If it's all A-Okay, why don't they just disclose where the stories are coming from, or who in the news networks work for the CIA?

      http://www.youtube.com/...


      "Justice is a commodity"

      by joanneleon on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 08:14:50 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  An apparent weakness (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        SixSixSix, Larsstephens
        BBG- or State-produced material that is disseminated in the United States should be identified as government communications, and should provide the recipient the context needed to judge the impartiality and accuracy of the material in question.
        http://www.aclu.org/...

        “Texas is a so-called red state, but you’ve got 10 million Democrats here in Texas. And …, there are a whole lot of people here in Texas who need us, and who need us to fight for them.” President Obama

        by Catte Nappe on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 08:21:11 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  That's my thinking as well... (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        shaharazade, 3goldens
        I don't know if this govt. propaganda content would be identified as such.  I think we're not talking about stations here, but content created by the US govt and sent out through all the private airwaves and channels.  And I don't know if they have to disclaim who wrote it.
        And who knows where that agitprop shows up... and when.

        I'm a long-time card-carrying fan of the ACLU but I don't agree with them on this issue. If propaganda doesn't have to be labeled as such. It can show up anywhere... and anytime,

        'Cuz freedom can't protect itself ~~ EFF ~ EPIC ~ ACLU

        by markthshark on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 08:47:29 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  CIA operatives are already planted (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        markthshark

        throughout the media.  That's been the case since the height of the cold war.

        "When I was an alien, cultures weren't opinions" ~ Kurt Cobain, Territorial Pissings

        by Subterranean on Wed Jul 17, 2013 at 09:53:05 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I wish I could call this CT............. (0+ / 0-)

          But the Iraq War isn't even the best proof of this. No, that was mostly Pentagon.

          Gary Webb's Dark Alliance.

          Soon as that expose was published, every "liberal newspaper" in the country had this ready-made list of talking points to rebut the ridiculous, absurd, totally implausible accusation that Contra cocaine found its way to America.

          So implausible, that the CIA Director felt the need to rebut these ridiculous accusations, in person, at a town hall meeting in South Central Los Angeles.

          Where there's a GIANT PLUME OF SMOKE.........

          "See? I'm not a racist! I have a black friend!"

          by TheHalfrican on Thu Jul 18, 2013 at 03:08:01 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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