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View Diary: Pope Francis: Muddying doctrine, conservatives complain (141 comments)

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  •  No, they'll want to see proof of Baptism (8+ / 0-)

    Is the Pope REALLY Catholic?

    News at 11

    •  No, they won't. (4+ / 0-)

      I was baptized as a Protestant, though in the name of the Trinity. When I converted to my mother's religion, Roman Catholicism, I was not re-baptized because the Roman Catholic Church accepts Trinitarian Baptisms regardless and only accepts one Baptism, as does the Anglican/Episcopal Church. I was also confirmed.

      Later in life, I left the Church to return to my father's church's roots and become an Anglican. They acknowledged not only my Baptism, but my Confirmation. I was received into their communion accepting the rites done by both Protestant (my Baptism) and Roman (my Confirmation) background.

      These issues are squishy in Church circles. The Episcopal Church will accept those things as long as they are done in the correct way.

      Sadly, that doesn't work the other way around.

      •  When did you convert? (4+ / 0-)

        In the 1960s, the Catholic Church actually required my sister to be rebaptized to convert to Catholic from Lutheran. My mother was bugged by that for pretty much the rest of her life, even when my sister joined the ranks of the lapsed Catholics.

        There's only one rule that I know of, babies -- goddammit, you've got to be kind. -- Kurt Vonnegut

        by Cali Scribe on Fri Nov 22, 2013 at 11:24:50 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I became a Roman Catholic in 1983, and I was (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Dave in Northridge, sfbob, Khun David

          Baptized in 1969. I "reverted" to Anglicanism in 2003.

          I have been a practicing Episcopalian ever since, and am today.

        •  Baptism since Vatican II (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Dave in Northridge

          Today what happened to your sister is entirely against church law. Vatican II called for the return of the Catechumenate. It was not until the mid to late 70s that this was accomplished when all Parishes were required to have an RCIA program. Conversion was transformed from a parotting of dogma to a conversion process based upon faith within the local community. The responsibility of conversion was moved from the priest to the community.

          The understanding and importance of Baptism within the Catholic community was fundamentally changed. Baptism by church law is held so sacred that it cannot be repeated. In cases where there is some uncertainty of whether a valid Baptism had been previously performed, a conditional baptism is permitted, but it must be done in private and without ceremony.

          That being said, the church does have a formula for what baptisms it will accept as being valid. If the rite of a church that baptized a person does not meet the requirements, then in the eyes of the church, the person has not been validly baptized and should brought into the church through the RCIA process.

          For someone in which the baptism is recognized as a valid baptism, that person technically needs only to perform a profession of faith and be confirmed and receive eucharist if they have not already done so. In practice, most people in this situation participate in a modified RCIA process.

          So the reality is that the church places the highest importance on the baptisms of other Christian denominations. In practice most priests and lay members of the Church do not fully understand or appreciate that and this often causes much pain and suffering.

          •  I can NOT be a Roman Catholic. I rejected (0+ / 0-)

            Christianity as a teenager, because I was more convinced that it is somehow morally wrong to solemnly swear that you believe something that you find somewhere between unintelligible and incredible than I was in the existence of any of the three parts of the Christian trinity.  I finally ended up in a very liberal Jewish congregation, where I come closer to fitting in than I have anywhere else I have been including my own family of origin.

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