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View Diary: Let's take the "T" out of WATB...ok? (204 comments)

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  •  Nope (0+ / 0-)

    Doesn't work either with men (using man breast is just another way to insult women, since men don't lactate).  Can't you folks understand that we are so insulted by using our breasts and gender as an insult to men?  I mean, what are the worst insults to men but by calling them girls or women (and fag is the same thing)?  I'm sick of it!  It demeans women constantly as the lesser of the two sexes.  Just stop it.  It won't hurt you to stop it, and it will make women feel just a little bit better about themselves.  Who has a problem with that?  Are you sexist liberals or sexist conservatives?  Take your pick.  To me, I see no difference when women are demeaned this way.

    •  No it does not demean (6+ / 0-)

      women.  

      I'm glad my boos can be used to insult men.  

    •  Just a heads up (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      MTmofo, buddabelly, second gen, terrybuck

      you are talking to a homosexual man right now.

      So tell me again who is being offensive.

      Also, and WATB isn't just used against conservatives, men or women left or right it's against those that pout like a child when they don't get their way.

      Victim of the system~Bob Marley

      by LaEscapee on Sun Nov 24, 2013 at 05:57:51 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  So? (0+ / 0-)

        It is still using a woman's body part as an insult and it is not necessary at all.  You can change, I know you can!  You can change and decide NOT to insult women to insult men.  Or, if you are not able to do that, don't call yourself a liberal.  OK?  Because for sure you are not a feminist!

        •  BTW: (0+ / 0-)

          I am a lesbian, so I have no idea what your sexual orientation has to do with this discussion.

          •  Oh I'm straight as an arrow (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            terrybuck

            the comment I responded to of yours was to a gay man and yet you felt the need to use the term fag and point out calling men girls or women is an insult yet you are offended by the word tittie.

            Are there any mirrors in your house?

            Victim of the system~Bob Marley

            by LaEscapee on Sun Nov 24, 2013 at 06:53:46 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  So you lied.. (0+ / 0-)

              ...about me talking to a gay man.  That makes you a liar and your point even more worthless.

              I am a lesbian, not that it matters to this discussion.  Sexual orientation has nothing to do with this particular insult to women.

              •  You are exact;y correct (0+ / 0-)

                sexual orientation has nothing to do with anything.

                Why exactly did you bring it up?

                Victim of the system~Bob Marley

                by LaEscapee on Sun Nov 24, 2013 at 07:36:57 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  Because I was talking about sexism... (0+ / 0-)

                  ...and the perjorative "fag" is the same as "girly man" and such.  It references an insult to men who act like women (by having sex with other men), therefore, it is still using women to insult men.  

                  Clearly, a LOT of people here on dkos are NOT feminists in any way whatsoever!

                  •  I have a Mother (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    JeffW, ban nock

                    that worked two jobs to raise 4 kids, 2 daughters and four granddaughters yeah I have no interest in womens issues.

                    What I actually don't have any interest is is someone that considers a letter more important than the fact my government is not only killing people around the world they are doing everything in their power to make sure that my girls and grandson have less than me

                    Victim of the system~Bob Marley

                    by LaEscapee on Sun Nov 24, 2013 at 08:23:35 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  We all have mothers... (0+ / 0-)

                      What does that have to do with your justification for insulting women?  You are saying that is less important than other issues.  Ok, so those are your priorities, and respecting women (more than half of all human beings) is not on your list.  Got it.

                      •  You obviously need to be offended (2+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        terrybuck, doc2

                        Facts mean nothing to you so I'll exit this conversation and allow you to decide who does and does not care about your pet issue

                        Victim of the system~Bob Marley

                        by LaEscapee on Sun Nov 24, 2013 at 11:12:54 PM PST

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  Need to be offended? (0+ / 0-)

                          That is the most offensive comment, out of all the offensive comments, on this thread. What "facts" fit with that totally offensive slur?  None that don't involve absolute sexism, that is for sure!  Sounds more like "need a man to...".  How disgusting do you want to be?  Perhaps you need a good woman to teach you how to be a good person.  What, your mother didn't teach you good manners?  Your father?  If they did, you didn't learn a damn thing.

                          Would you say that to a black person who is offended by a racial slur?  Yea, probably.  Thanks for your comment, Rush.

          •  When I told my wife about this (0+ / 0-)

            diary, her first comment was "is she is lesbian"?

            Nailed it!

    •  maybe i'm dense but (6+ / 0-)

      what does this have to do with men?

      i've seen WATB applied to women as well, for as long as the term has been around.

      It's not a term I use, but I've never thought it was "using breasts and gender as an insult to men".

      I've never thought it was a way of insulting a man by calling him a girl or woman.  i don't even understand that part of your argument.

      the term compares a person (not a man, a person of either gender) to a baby crying incessantly for food from its mama, which can be annoying to bystanders who often wish there was a way to quiet the baby down.

      that is the only context I have ever seen it used.

      so i'm not connecting to your sexist definition of the term, and i have never felt demeaned by it

      Politics is like driving. To go backward put it in R. To go forward put it in D.
      Drop by The Grieving Room on Monday nights for support in dealing with grief.

      by TrueBlueMajority on Sun Nov 24, 2013 at 06:19:46 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Men and women are both called "bitches" (0+ / 0-)

        But as we all know, a bitch is a female dog.  Gay men call other gay men bitches... and we know exactly what that means.  Men call women bitches all the time (esp when they won't go out with those men.)  So, that's how that word demeans women.  Can you understand that?  Do you even care?

        What does it have to do with men?  Well, what does being a baby about politics have to do with women's breasts?  Nothing at all.  It's just a term used to further demean men using a perjorative for women's breasts.  It serves no other purpose.

        •  bitches is different (0+ / 0-)

          i understand the problem there.

          like men calling each other the C word

          i agree both those usages demean women and serve no other purpose.

          they only demean men if I agree that there is something wrong with being compared to a woman, but that is another argument altogether.

          Can you understand that?  Do you even care?
          Yes, and yes.

          but the T in WATB does not apply to the PERSON being called a WATB, and I still don't see how the T in WATB demeans men.

          i was annoyed by the word tits in another serious diary today that was only used for shock value.

          but you cannot persuade me that the term WATB demeans men or further demeans men or demeans men by using a pejorative for women's breasts.

          now, if you were saying that WATB demeaned women because you object to slang terms for breasts, I would take this more seriously.

          Politics is like driving. To go backward put it in R. To go forward put it in D.
          Drop by The Grieving Room on Monday nights for support in dealing with grief.

          by TrueBlueMajority on Sun Nov 24, 2013 at 07:08:17 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  That's exactly what I was saying (0+ / 0-)

            It is the fact that the word "titties" is used, and that's all.  That word adds nothing to the insult to (mostly men) but to demean women's bodies and our natural functions.  It isn't necessary.  It's just a little sexist add-on for no other purpose.  

            Thanks for (at least partially) understanding.

        •  My wife refers to herself as a... (0+ / 0-)

          ...mran, nasty vicious bitch.

          I don't think I want to get her to shift gears on that. I could earn five in the snotbox.

          •  Sure, and some black men... (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            TrueBlueMajority

            ...call themselves and other black men the n-word.  Does that make it ok for white people to use that word?  Nope.

             A whole different discussion, but the point is the same.  What we call ourselves doesn't make it ok to call others.  Just like I can complain about my mother, but you damn well better not!  

            •  Well, just to be clear... (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Calamity Jean, Cedwyn, Ahianne

              ...I've never used the N-word.

              I never referred to my wife as a bitch in public. Ask her via Kosmail. Her screen name is Calamity Jean.

              I think I may have used the acronym WATB a total of three times, but if you want to do a search and dispute it, knock yourself out.

              I have, several times, proferred the Yiddish terms Kvetch and Kvetchnik in your diary. I don't use the K-word (not kvetch, in that case), though you could say I'm not much of a Jew.

              In the world today, we face many daunting problems. Greed, climate change and global warming. People who would reshape what is the United States into a facist theocracy. A limping economy. A seriously screwed-up Congress. I could go on, but won't. Suffice that they are not trivial.

              You, madam, on the other hand, are incensed about an acronym, it's use, and the words it represents.

              Fine. That is your right as a US citizen. You are a member of Daily Kos, and a Trusted User, and that is more than enough to allow you a soapbox.

              But, you also have to remember that this is a two-way street, and people around here may not share your outrage over the words this acronym spell out. People will criticize you about your complaint, and have. That is the other direction on that two-way street. Your complaint, as framed, does seem trivial.

              So kvetch on, kevtchnik. I got bupkes...

              •  Hey! (3+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                JeffW, Cedwyn, Ahianne

                I AM a mean nasty vicious bitch.  And I expect you to back me up when I tell people that, buddy.  

                "My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right." -- Sen Carl Schurz 1872

                by Calamity Jean on Sun Nov 24, 2013 at 08:46:12 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

              •  There is a clear lack of empathy here... (0+ / 0-)

                ...for women.  Even by some women, which is really pathetic, but not unusual.  I get that a LOT of liberals aren't really feminists, they just pretend to be.  But this discussion has gotten nasty toward me, personally, and is as much an ad hominem attack on me as Rush did to Sandra Fluke.  Your attacks on me prove you have nothing substantive to offer to the issue.  (Look up logical fallacies, ok?)

                Jeff, I can see that you try, and at least you are mostly polite, an exception to some others.  But  calling my issue "trivial" is what men have said about women for centuries, so it doesn't work.

                Shame.

                •  Ad hominem (3+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  doc2, JeffW, Ahianne

                  I don't think that word means what you think it means.
                  An ad hom means someone attacks you personally, rather than addressing the argument at hand.
                  Really, if these snarky comments upset you so much, admit you're losing the argument and move on.

                  Your beliefs don't make you a better person. Your behavior does.

                  by skohayes on Mon Nov 25, 2013 at 04:02:54 AM PST

                  [ Parent ]

    •  How about 'nipple?' Or is that also offensive... (0+ / 0-)

      to women?

      If so, I'll have to call these two things on my chest something else.

      I'm trying to work with you, here.




      Somebody has to do something, and it's just incredibly pathetic that it has to be us. ~ J. Garcia

      by DeadHead on Sun Nov 24, 2013 at 06:47:34 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  WANB? (0+ / 0-)

        So, whiny ass nipple baby?  Still, what is the point of that?  It is still demeaning to women!  There is no purpose for using that term at all!  Anymore than there is a purpose to calling black folks the n-word and then saying that, well "they" use it too, so why not?  Well, why would you WANT to use it?  

    •  Who is this "We" you keep referring to. Because (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      JeffW, Cedwyn, skohayes

      it doesn't include me. And many other women here.

      Also, men CAN lactate.

      So, there.

      •  Sure... (0+ / 0-)

        ...they do it all the time!  Men have even had to demand the right to breast feed in public, or to have lactating rooms in their workplace!  

        Give me a break.  Not the same thing at all.

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