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View Diary: Why did Obama let this happen, and other questions on Ukraine (313 comments)

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  •  Obsession with hypocrisy (2+ / 0-)
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    valkyrry, rainmanjr

    Is what Kerry said less correct because he's a hypocrite?

    The rest of the world doesn't give a sh*t if Kerry voted for or against the Iraq war. He is an American and therefore, by default, hypocritical on this issue. All Americans carry the shame of the Iraq war, no matter how hard we fought against it.

    provoke legitimate responses of hypocricy from even the people defending this Russian invasion
    The funny thing is I don't see people using "hypocrisy" as a response to defend Russia's actions. I see people like Kos sniping (counter-productively, unless the goal is to encourage Russian aggression).

    The people actually defending the Russians want very very badly that no one draw the parallel between Russia's actions in Ukraine and the United States' actions in Iraq.

    "This is not an invasion," they say.
    "The people welcome the Russian military."
    "It's really Russian territory, anyways. And a very small piece. Ukraine probably wont notice if it's gone."
    "There are neo-nazis in Kiev and they might start making nuclear bombs any minute."

    The one thing they are explicitly not saying is, "This is just like how the United States invaded Iraq."

    •  Obama Didn't (1+ / 0-)
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      cany

      No, most people know Obama opposed Bush's war. But the main reaction to Kerry's statement to Russia about 19th Century invasions was to laugh at it because of Iraq. Not to stand with a strong and morally unambiguous US leadership.

      If Kerry - who ran against Bush in 2004 and so his Iraq position is also well known in the world - had opposed Iraq, the US would not be undermined by its hypocrisy. There is a very deep and powerful point to changing governments by elections. Unless the new government is the same old boss - as is Kerry on the subject of Iraq.

      Hypocrisy undermines the messenger, even if their later position is correct. It doesn't make Russia's invasion any more legitimate. It just delegitimizes the US moral ground.

      But you're denying that people heard Kerry and said "yeah, like you and Iraq, sure". They are indeed - both journalists and commenters in world news sites, and surely everyone else. And surely in Russia - and not just in the government. But it doesn't exist to you. Since you're impervious to those facts, my explanation isn't going to matter to you.

      So goodbye.

      "When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." - HST

      by DocGonzo on Mon Mar 03, 2014 at 07:24:42 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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