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View Diary: Louisiana Threatens To Sue MoveOn Over Billboard (257 comments)

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  •  please research fair use exceptions (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Duckman GR

    under Campbell.

    I think it's satire and fair use, see my prior comment.

    •  Not sure about fair use (0+ / 0-)

      That might apply to copyrights, but not trademarks, or registered slogans.

      Evolution IS Intelligent Design!

      by msirt on Sat Mar 08, 2014 at 07:11:38 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Interesting, but don't think so. (0+ / 0-)

      Imagine if the administration tried to use "Expect More, Pay less,"---Target's line for years---to sell Obamacare. Guarantee you Target would and could stop them in their tracks.

      I believe the judge would say political advertising is still considered advertising, not free speech and is subject to the laws of trademark.

      "A typical vice of American politics is the avoidance of saying anything real on real issues." Theodore Roosevelt.

      by StellaRay on Sat Mar 08, 2014 at 07:17:54 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  you would think so, but you would be wrong. (0+ / 0-)

        the administration doesn't want heat from a
        major company, but, politicians step all over
        trademark slogans

        such as "Where's the Beef", "What happens in Vegas",
        ,,,

        it's never litigated.

        •  And what happens in a speech (0+ / 0-)

          or on a political stage is usually fair use. But when it involves  an organization using another organization's trademarked line right down to the typeface, in a political advertising campaign, believe me, there's a case to be made by the state of LA.

          Another example might be if another breast cancer organization used Susan Komen's pink ribbon to take on Komen---you can darn bet Komen would be in court over it the next day, and they'd probably win, as they have won MANY such litigations so far.

          "A typical vice of American politics is the avoidance of saying anything real on real issues." Theodore Roosevelt.

          by StellaRay on Sat Mar 08, 2014 at 10:05:02 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  got any citations? (0+ / 0-)

            I'd defend the moveon types under Fair use
            and send them to either Campbell or
            Happy Haute Dog...

            •  If I were the lawyer (0+ / 0-)

              for MoveOn, I'd defend them on Fair Use too. But as I said above there's plenty for LA to argue with in the Fair Use citation you quoted, as to whether MoveOn's use of their line is fair use.

              In my career I have been involved in many copyright and trademark issues. This is my sense of things from that experience.

              I guess I don't quite understand the argument with the fact that copyright and trademark laws are complex and have many arms and applications, and that MoveOn does not have a slam dunk in court with this.

              Political advertising is not seen by the court in the way it sees free speech issues. There are rules.

              In any case, not meaning any of this to be unfriendly, just saying IMO, LA absolutely has a case worth pursuing if they choose to. And I would suspect they have already spoken with their lawyers and know that too, whether they're serious about pursuing it or not.

              Not saying who would win in court, like in all litigations that depends on the judge and the lawyers. Am saying MoveOn is not immune on the simple premise that they are exercising their free speech, or in this case, fair use.

              "A typical vice of American politics is the avoidance of saying anything real on real issues." Theodore Roosevelt.

              by StellaRay on Sat Mar 08, 2014 at 11:17:52 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  if it went up the chain. (0+ / 0-)

                i think the current SC would be friendly
                to free speech.

                •  Are you talking about (0+ / 0-)

                  the same SCOTUS I'm talking about? The right wing bench that just over turned the Voting rights act and instituted Citizens United?

                  Trademarks and copyrights are very largely about corporate and business rights, and any ruling on this would be a big precedent even though the organizations in question are non- profit and not corporations. I would not agree that this SCOTUS would be particularly friendly to free speech in this instance.

                  Anyway, interesting conversation. Thanks.

                  "A typical vice of American politics is the avoidance of saying anything real on real issues." Theodore Roosevelt.

                  by StellaRay on Sat Mar 08, 2014 at 11:53:25 AM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  if you look at CU, (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    StellaRay

                    which by the way I despise as a ruling,
                    it's a "Free-speech" ruling.

                    now it's money as speech and corporate speech,
                    but,

                    •  You're right, (0+ / 0-)

                      but it's a free speech ruling stretched beyond recognition to benefit the 1% and their power. A decision that protected an organization like MoveOn would set powerful precedent and NOT be in the favor of corporate needs, of which trademarks, registrations and copy rights are right up there. I dunno, hard to say in the end I guess. But I will be interested to see what happens with this story.

                      "A typical vice of American politics is the avoidance of saying anything real on real issues." Theodore Roosevelt.

                      by StellaRay on Sat Mar 08, 2014 at 01:12:38 PM PST

                      [ Parent ]

              •  the reason i'm asking for cites (0+ / 0-)

                and not to be an asshole is that i'm a law student,
                so it's interesting to me.

                but, if you have experience i'll take that.

                Sounds like a balancing test, one that LA would
                lose politically, even if they can prevail
                and with subtle questions of law.

            •  if you look at Falwell and Campbell. (0+ / 0-)

              The supremes were pretty friendly to
              satire.  Falwell was doing defamation
              and IIED,  Campbell was about the
              copyright lyrics.  

              I would think that the real push would
              rotate on Satire.

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