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View Diary: Katrina, Politics and Iraq (173 comments)

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  •  So why does it hurt you and doesn't hurt them? (none)
    They politicise everything, and lie about it.

    I want to point out political implications on this one thing while it's still news, and you say it will hurt democrats.

    Do you have an argument why it would hurt democrats?

    •  yes absolutely (none)
      Do you have an argument why it would hurt democrats?
      Many people around assume that because Bush's numbers are falling Democrats numbers are rising.

      This is not automatically true.  Sometimes it is, but often, well, very often, it is not.  

      This disaster is obviously worsened by Bush; and time will show that.  Going on TV and bitching about what a loser Bush only causes people to be defensive about the man.  Every democrat worth his/her salt in the country hate GWB already; the point is that the Republicans have to start to hate him as well to make any progress whatsoever, in anyway.

      •  I still don't get it. (none)
        It sounds like you're saying if we actually point out what Bush has done wrong, it will make "people" be "defensive".

        But if we don't point out the problems, people will eventually notice the problems for themselves.

        Why would you expect people would notice Bush's idiocy quicker with nobody replying to the spinmasters?

        When somebody starts a chain letter and a lot of idiots think they can each make hundreds of thousands of dollars from it, do you think the'd figure it out quicker if nobody told them?

        Would people understand about Scientology quicker if nobody exposed it?

        •  reponse (none)
          It sounds like you're saying if we actually point out what Bush has done wrong, it will make "people" be "defensive".
          Yes.

          But if we don't point out the problems, people will eventually notice the problems for themselves.
          Yes.

          Why would you expect people would notice Bush's idiocy quicker with nobody replying to the spinmasters?
          Why quicker?  Because when partisan hacks start yammering people shutdown.  The same cast of clowns protest everything Bush does, at all times, regardless of merit.  When these people are yammering people shutdown and become dogmatic.

          It's already happened.  It's too lote, this conversation is already over.  People choose your approach, and now, as predicted, people have shutdown.  Most people do not associate this disaster with Bush.  

          Partisnship is infectious.  Once the same old cast of clowns starts yelping it's over - the battle is lost.

          •  Partisanship doesn't have to be infectious. (none)
            "Partisnship is infectious.  Once the same old cast of clowns starts yelping it's over - the battle is lost."

            Suppose you're right. And suppose by some wondrous chance everybody on your side understood and agreed and stayed quiet while people listened to the propaganda and figured it out for themselves.

            If you're right, all the propagandists have to do is play both sides themselves. Some of them can pose as Bush supporters and others can pose as stupid Bush opponents, and that's enough to get regular people to shut down and ignore all the problems.

            So your solution was never a workable solution.

            Any other ideas? We need something that can work even when fanatics are yammering on two sides.

            •  no (none)
              If you're right, all the propagandists have to do is play both sides themselves. Some of them can pose as Bush supporters and others can pose as stupid Bush opponents, and that's enough to get regular people to shut down and ignore all the problems.
              Except that if the liberal/progressive voices shut down, and let bush pretend to be a leader, and hey, even get a bounce for some short period of time, Bush wont want to stick his puppets all over the place yammering.

              It was workable, it happened after 9/11 to great effect.

              Bush was an idiot to failed to prevent 9/11.  Fool.  Moron.  Yet criticism was bit for a few weeks, and it was for the greater good of the country.

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