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View Diary: Yes, agreeing to the GOP tax cut plan would be caving (366 comments)

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  •  "By playing his hand too recklessly, he loses. " (4+ / 0-)

    Funny how that never seems to stop GOPers from doing it. Ever.

    •  You know why it doesn't stop them? (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      scorinaldi, raincrow

      Because they have the media and big money on their side.

      You guys can't get around this point.

      "I'm measuring everything the Democrats and President Obama do, not against what I WANT, but against the status quo." --RASalvatore 9/16/10

      by smoothnmellow on Thu Nov 11, 2010 at 01:08:04 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Thanks for the common sense (0+ / 0-)
        •  I just don't get why people (0+ / 0-)

          can't see the obvious.  We are outspent by the corps.  We are outmessaged by the corp media.

          How many progressive corps are there?

          How many of them own media?

          When Clinton, yes Bill Clinton changed FCC rules, that was really the beginning of the end for us.  The media with competitively controlled markets was the only equalizer we had going.

          Conservative corporations control corporation media.  They support their message with infotainment designed to confuse and distract the masses.

          This whole Obama is caving meme is yet another distraction from Obama's Asian trip designed to create more JOBS for the American people.

          You know, those people who just kicked a whole bunch of Democrats out because they didn't do enough to create more JOBS?

          Progressives cannot get on point.  This is why we fail all of the time.

          "I'm measuring everything the Democrats and President Obama do, not against what I WANT, but against the status quo." --RASalvatore 9/16/10

          by smoothnmellow on Thu Nov 11, 2010 at 01:33:56 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  Oh, I can get around it. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        NearlyNormal

        GOPers play long ball. They'll say the most ridiculous shit because they're moving the discourse. They're ruthless, they're crazy, they've got no interest in governing, and---here's where you need to take notes---Democrats don't call them on any of it.

        If Democrats only did one thing well---like defending an economy built on a prospering middle class---90% of the shit GOPers throw wouldn't stick. And that would go miles in fixing what's ailing Obama and Democrats right now.

        The idea that the media and big money are allied against us isn't why we're not winning. Like everything else, we don't have any alternative narrative to the media or big money. We don't explain how the country gets better with simple progressive ideas, and we don't explain how corporate money works directly against the general welfare of the people. We had two immense majorities in the House and Senate and the White House, and we couldn't even get Dems to put forward an argument against Citizens United? If Dems had done nothing but talk about THAT for two months before the election--regardless of passage of any legislation--we would have done much better in this election.

        We're fucked because we don't have a party that believes in its message. That's terminal unless we do something about it.

        •  And do you know why the GOP can get away (0+ / 0-)

          with it?

          See answer above.

          "I'm measuring everything the Democrats and President Obama do, not against what I WANT, but against the status quo." --RASalvatore 9/16/10

          by smoothnmellow on Thu Nov 11, 2010 at 01:34:49 PM PST

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          •  You don't go to elections with the media you want (0+ / 0-)

            You go with the media you've got. That our media is slanted isn't a news flash. That Democrats can't see beyond these problems is fatal.

            Republicans didn't have the media noise machine 30 years ago. These things are only changed with conscious, overt, and well-planned and executed political moves. We've got none of that right now. And your fatalism about it is why. DC Dems talk the very same way.

    •  Playing their hand too (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      smoothnmellow

      Recklessly would be to insist on a permanent extension and risk a shutdown over it.  But look, there are no votes for this.  So what are we doing?  Make the deal everyone knows has to be made and start focusing on jobs, healthcare.  That is unless Obama thinks he can get something done but we all know that's probably not the case.  It takes a lot out of people to fhgt these wars.  At the end of the day, you need something to show for it.  Otherwise, what's the point?  We are putting him in a position of where we are mad at him for not fighting but well be furious when he loses.  It's too much, we need perspective.   As to republican behavior, it must be nice to control all the media and be run by all the corporate interests.  It does have it's advantages.  Acting like a fool is one of them.  

      •  Sorry, I won't be furious when he loses. (0+ / 0-)

        Because losing is part of changing the political narrative. The party has to get ideas out into circulation and act on them through legislation. It's the difference between policy and politics, and the Obama White House has been terrible at the latter. So much so that 2012 is seriously at risk, IMHO.

        •  And what narrative would that be? (0+ / 0-)

          "I'm measuring everything the Democrats and President Obama do, not against what I WANT, but against the status quo." --RASalvatore 9/16/10

          by smoothnmellow on Thu Nov 11, 2010 at 01:47:43 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

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