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Let's hear it for Martha Raddatz, the brilliantly skillful moderator of the vice-presidential debate.She got a clear yes from Rep. Paul Ryan to this question:  "If the Romney-Ryan ticket is elected, should those who believe that abortion should remain legal be worried?"

But first, the wind up, and the pitch:

"This debate is, indeed, historic. We have two Catholic candidates, first time, on a stage such as this. And I would like to ask you both to tell me what role your religion has played in your own personal views on abortion.

"Please talk about how you came to that decision. Talk about how your religion played a part in that. And, please, this is such an emotional issue for so many people in this country, please talk personally about this, if you could.."

The vice presidential candidates, both Catholics, were both entirely candid.

Vice President Joe Biden: "I do not believe that we have a right to tell women that they can't control their body." As an elected official, he would not impose his own personal religious beliefs on others.

Rep. Paul Ryan stated he believes that life begins at conception, and referred to his wife's pregnancy of 7 weeks as an example. He stated that he opposes abortion under any circumstances.  

He said that the policy of the Romney administration would be "to oppose abortions with the exceptions for rape, incest and life of the mother."He did not say that they would oppose federal funding for abortion, which is present law.  He said the policy would be "to oppose abortions."

"Exceptions" do not make care accessible. They serve mostly to stigmatize reproductive health care.  

The Hyde amendment currently does not allow any federal funds to be used to pay for an abortion except in the case of rape, incest, or threats to the life of mother

There are about 32,000 pregnancies a year as a result of rape.

In 2006 only 85 abortions were paid for with federal funds.

However, Rep. Ryan does not support coverage even in the cases of the exceptions he mentioned.  He was a co-sponsor of HR 3, which would not use federal funds for abortion even in the case of rape, incest or a threat to the life of the mother.

Again. Martha
RADDATZ: I want to go back to the abortion question here. If the Romney-Ryan ticket is elected, should those who believe that abortion should remain legal be worried?

RYAN: We don't think that unelected judges should make this decision; that people through their elected representatives in reaching a consensus in society through the democratic process should make this determination.

Ryan means to suggests that the decisions about abortion should not be made by unelected judges, but should be decided at state level.  During 2011 and 2012, state legislatures have dramatically ramped up cutbacks on access to all forms of reproductive health care, including birth control and abortion. In fact, though, the Supreme Court did and will make decisions about abortion.  And the President appoints the Justices.

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Comment Preferences

  •  that bullshit was to cover his tracks (9+ / 0-)

    I think it was scripted to sound so abstract that women would think he is not a threat this way, when as you say, in FACT:

    In fact, though, the Supreme Court did and will make decisions about abortion.  And the President appoints the Justices.
    As different than another's position elsewhere that this was  talk about a constitutional convention to decide this.

    No, it was flimflammery at it's pettifogging best to make women think Ry/Ro would be reasonably following legal precedent rather than creating new legal precedent with the judges they most certainly will appoint.

    And there certainly will be litmus tests and the country will be paralyzed politically for months over the judges. As it should be more or less..the radical fringe will do this if given their chance.

    This machine kills Fascists.

    by KenBee on Fri Oct 12, 2012 at 01:00:09 AM PDT

    •  we saw gridlock during Clinton's term (7+ / 0-)

      when he was unable to appoint judges due to GOP obstruction.  I forget how many judgeships went unfilled, but the GOP whined about the increase of crime in the country and then blocked judges, whose appointments could have broken the logjam.

      The GOP reminds me of "Not Me" in Family Circus who does bad things and then blames everyone else for the mess

  •  Ryan is an ideologue (12+ / 0-)

    which means he is dedicated to ideas but not so much to how these ideas play out in real life.  In the play, "Hamlet" Horatio is chided for his idealism or ideaism.  Ryan would do well to understand that "there are things not dreamt of in your philosophy"

    In real world terms, this means  reality based assessment of the effect of your proposals.  For example, he would turn Medicare into a voucher system.  This would double the net worth of the major insurance carriers without increasing the amount of healthcare or quality of healthcare.  Management already consumes some 30% of each dollar spent for healthcare.  This would increase under a voucher system.

    We have already seen the failure of MC+ programs where private carriers opined that they could deliver comparable care for less money than the government.  Instead these costly plans actually decreased access to healthcare (example: MC+ refused to pay RHCs and FQHCs their enhanced rates; the difference was claimed as being cost effective when they were in effect violating the contracts these clinics had and a good many closed due to the revenue loss) and actually cost more than classic MC.  Wonder why Ryan does not want to discuss the failure of MC+.

    The answer is he is a big idea guy; like Newt, he cannot be bothered with minutiae.  This means he has little idea of how MC works or even what the program is.  His ideology is like a religion, in that he has to follow its precepts, regardless of what the real world data tells him      

  •  Good diary. (5+ / 0-)

    I wish you'd posted it in the morning when more folks would be likely to read it, rather than so late at night.

    An Fhirinn an aghaidh an t'Saoghail. (The truth against the world.) Is treasa tuath na tighearna. (The common people are mightier than the lords.)

    by OllieGarkey on Fri Oct 12, 2012 at 01:15:42 AM PDT

    •  Actually this is good timing. There aren't (5+ / 0-)

      enough diaries published at this hour that it will be pushed far down. So people who visit first thing in the morning will see it. If it moves too far down, the diaries can unpublish it  and then publish it again to move it back to the top of the recent diary list.

      “Mitt Romney is the only person in America who looked at the way this Congress is behaving and said, ‘I want the brains behind THAT operation.’ ” — Tom Perriello

      by hungrycoyote on Fri Oct 12, 2012 at 01:37:57 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Did you see the discussion with Rachel Maddow (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Seneca Doane, Creosote, missLotus, fumie

    on MSNBC after the debate? Chris Matthews interviewed Congresswoman Marsha Blackburn (R-TN) and you know it was not good when Republican Steve Schmidt said afterwards:

    In politics there's no bad questions; only bad answers. And there you had a clinic on a bunch of bad answers.

    Visit for breaking news, world news, and news about the economy

    “Mitt Romney is the only person in America who looked at the way this Congress is behaving and said, ‘I want the brains behind THAT operation.’ ” — Tom Perriello

    by hungrycoyote on Fri Oct 12, 2012 at 01:35:08 AM PDT

    •  Blackburn is right on the R playbook: (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Seneca Doane, hungrycoyote, Creosote

      1. Wreck the economy, 2001-8
      2. Lose the 2008 election
      3. Drum up the Tea Party and ALEC. win elections in 2010 promising to work on creating jobs
      4, Spend 2 years talking predominantly about - and eliminating access to - abortions.
      5. In the 2012 election, claim that the real issue is jobs.

      Thanks for posting the clip!

    •  I would like to see it but you didn't link (0+ / 0-)

      This embed is not viewable on iOS devices.  And the link below is generic msnbc not to the clip you provided.

      In capitalist America, bank robs you!

      by madhaus on Sun Oct 14, 2012 at 12:48:24 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Good diary. (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Creosote, missLotus, ybruti, greenbird

    This should be one of the main points hit by Obama/Biden for the remainder of the campaign. A lot of people do not know that Romney wants to overturn Roe vs. Wade. They finally copped to it. Ending Planned Parenthood should also be discussed.

  •  I think the Dems should focus more on the fact (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    4mygirls, celdd, fumie, DeminNewJ

    that actual access to basic birth control itself is under attack.

    Birth Control is preventive healthcare. Birth control prevents abortion. The Repubs are trying to manipulate health insurance so that it doesn't pay for birth control if it violates the moral imperatives of their employer. (Just one more MAJOR reason why healthcare needs to be de-coupled from employment) Even the majority of Catholics use some form of birth control.

    If birth control is taken out of healthcare plans AND the Republicans are successful in their attempts to shut down low cost healthcare clinics for women, which is actually what Planned Parenthood is, then who will suffer the most? Who will have unwanted pregnancies and back alley abortions becuase they have been denied access to cheap and affordable birth control? THE POOR.

    “Human kindness has never weakened the stamina or softened the fiber of a free people. A nation does not have to be cruel to be tough.” FDR

    by Phoebe Loosinhouse on Fri Oct 12, 2012 at 04:39:10 AM PDT

  •  Guess I'll just have to repeat myself . . . (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    4mygirls, fumie

    When someone walks into a KFC and orders fried chicken the kid behind the counter doesn’t ask “you want that easy over or sunny side up?”.

    That’s because the kid, the customer, and pretty much everyone in creation knows the difference between a chicken and an egg.

    Well, Mr. Ryan, don’t you know the difference between a person and an egg ? ? ?

    Fake Left, Drive Right . . . not my idea of a Democrat . . .

    by Deward Hastings on Fri Oct 12, 2012 at 04:56:32 AM PDT

  •  Define "rape". (0+ / 0-)

    Now define "abortion".  If a woman is not "legitimately" raped will she be able to get (from the hospital or her doctor) the "abortion pill" most refer to as the "morning after pill"?  

    I don't see any of this ending well.  It's like Biden said.  Are we going to trust the people who want to get rid of in this case abortion in the first place with matters relating to abortion?

  •  it seems to me that Raddatz (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    framed the question in such a way that many people could see that Ryan's positions (which I am sure she knew when she decided on that particular question) would essentially be a disqualfier for high office.

    His religious views, peculiar to his religion and not necessarily shared by all persons or religions, would become the law in a secular nation.  Despite a guarantee by the Consitution of freedom of religion, including freedom from religion,  he would fully support imposing his religious views by law on the rest of us.

    It is unconstitutional and undemocratic.   And I agree with another diarist who felt he was implying the amendment to the constitution route, not just passing a law in Congress.   Undoubtedly, those would be written similarly to the personhood amendments already tried in many states, and which outlaw most forms of common birth control.

    I think many women, and many men, probably saw the truth last night.  On reproductive rights, women's rights, a Romney-Ryan ticket is a reason to be very afraid.

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