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By now, most of you have probably seen the Tumblr page entirely dedicated to pictures of white people mourning the Republican defeat last Tuesday.

I realize how easy it is to make fun of those people (our those people), but for me the images posted there call up -- somewhat to my surprise -- decidedly mixed emotions. Spite and sympathy, it seems, can co-exist, and even lay the groundwork for something that begins to resemble empathy.

It's an involuntary reflex, to be sure, after the bile, racism, and sheer deranged hatred those people have flung at us these past four years -- not to mention their cocksure arrogance (up until about 10:00 pm Tuesday night) that "real" Americans were going to rise as one and send the Kenyan usurper packing.

But looking at those woeful faces -- hopes smashed, the awful truth finally revealed -- it's hard not to remember election night 2004, when it became clear that lies and war crimes notwithstanding, President Cheney and his sidekick were going to be reelected despite our best efforts.

It's devastating to believe that your country has looked evil full in the face and decided to embrace it, and feel completely helpless to stop it. And if even one-twentieth of the things those people believe about President Obama, and about us, were true, they would be right to despair, just as we did eight years ago.

In the end, though, what really makes it hard for me to dine with gusto at the schadenfreude buffet is that the grieving faces on the other side of the partisan divide aren't those people, they're my people -- the middle-class neighbors of my Southern childhood, the kids I went to school with, my redneck uncles and cousins, my own mother and father.

The sagging chins and pot bellies, the crew cuts and blue hair, the bad make up and worse fashion sense -- these are all as familiar to me as the lines on my own face. I know these people too intimately, their pasts are too intertwined with mine, for me to look at them and see only the despised Other, even though I have no doubt that's how many, if not most, of them would look at me.

I also know that they have been lied to, with ferocious intensity and relentless dedication, by the conservative propaganda machine and its political masters. If we must have demons to hate, better to seek them among the con artists who have turned Rwandan-style hate speech into an industry profitable enough to rival the porn business.

I know it's customary at times such as these for victors to speak of reconciliation -- to remind the defeated, as President Obama never seems to get tired of repeating, that there are no red states, no blue states, just the United States of America. But that's not what I'm trying to do here. I have no particular interest in offering any olive branches. We've gone too far, traveling in opposite directions, to meet halfway now. One side must rule and the other must grind its teeth in rage. That being the case, I'd much rather it was them than us wearing down the enamel.

All that said, though, there is still something poignant, even tragic, about those faces of red America, something worthy of a eulogy. Their America -- Bill O'Reilly's "traditional America" -- is fading away. Whatever the future holds, it's not likely to look like them, or think like them, or live like them.

And in a way I can't quite explain, that fact lends a measure of dignity to their grief -- to the point where their faces almost begin to resemble old photos of Geronimo in captivity, his sad eyes looking past the camera to a vanished world that no white man can conquer.

And so, in that same spirit, let me offer this semi-affectionate and almost respectful tribute to our defeated enemies and their blasted hopes:

Mourning in America

Originally posted to billmon on Sat Nov 10, 2012 at 10:49 PM PST.

Also republished by Daily Kos.

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  •  Tip Jar (214+ / 2-)
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  •  Great diary except for the Geronimo analogy at the (113+ / 0-)

    end. There are light years of grief and legitimate grievances that set Geronimo apart from the dead enders of Anglo supremacism.

    •  roger that (25+ / 0-)
      Jeff Houser, chairman of Geronimo's Fort Sill Apache Tribe wrote a letter to President Obama saying "We are quite certain that the use of the name Geronimo as a code for Osama bin Laden was based on misunderstood and misconceived historical perspectives of Geronimo and his armed struggle against the United States and Mexican governments

      yksitoista ulotteinen presidentin shakki. / tappaa kaikki natsit "Nous sommes un groupuscule" (-9.50; -7.03) 政治委员, 政委‽ Warning - some snark above ‽

      by annieli on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:30:11 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Yup. (36+ / 0-)

      I'm usually right with billmon on any issue. And -- to a degree -- I could see how it's possible for gringos like myself to look with recognition at the images from the tumblr, recognizing people like our own friends and family.

      But when one looks at what they are actually mourning, empathy ceases. As you say, there is absolutely nothing that could be more distant from the Romney mourners than the symbolic figure of a dying Native American culture, his forebears eradicated through systematic genocide and white supremacist imperialism.

      On the contrary, the "traditional America" of figures like Bill O'Reilly is a fiction -- utterly divorced from reality. The conservative arcadia of 1950s America was only sustained by racist laws and customs that artificially preserved white privilege, and by a generous postwar welfare state that people like O'Reilly are actually trying to destroy.

      In my mind, the most visible symbol of that "traditional America" has been the hateful bile of Fox News, which has nothing halfway traditional about it: the garish, tasteless graphics; the utterly fictional moral panics popping up from the news crawl at the bottom of the page; the overpaid douchebags in their power suits, jabbing their index fingers at the camera and telling us all what they want to do to any traditions or institutions that would sustain us: defund planned Parenthood, gut Social Security, eviscerate the New Deal. There is nothing remotely "traditional" about a culture that wants nothing other than to rip the social safety net out from under every living American.

      So with respect, billmon, I must kindly suggest that the crying white people in those sad, sad photos can and should go screw themselves.

      Nothing requires a greater effort of thought than arguments to justify the rule of non-thought. -- Milan Kundera

      by Dale on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:16:52 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  No one (6+ / 0-)

        could be more relieved that "these people" were defeated in their hopes and especially, fears.

        But how does it make us better human beings if we can't empathize with such abject terror and misery. Save the vitriol for the manipulators. I want to see hundreds of perp walks for the crimes against society they've committed. Although I know I won't.

        But in this, I agree with Billmon. These people have been gulled and deluded. I can add some of my own family members to the list.  They were weak, they were wrong and they even hated irrationally because they were lied to relentlessly! FOR DECADES!

         But I still feel sorry for the collapse of their fantastical world. Perhaps, as an atheist, I'm more "Christian" than most of them, and many here. I'm not saying forgive them. But have some pity,if you can.

        •  I sort of get where you're coming from, I do. (17+ / 0-)

          But what I can't get away from is this: yes, they were deluded. Yes, they were badgered into near-terror by one of the more effective propaganda efforts in history.

          But they also are a group of people that have historically believed that their happiness must come at someone else's expense. So: black people can't be permitted to vote; women shouldn't have control over their own bodies; gay and lesbian people can't be permitted to benefit from the same social rituals and civic protections as straight people.

          And now, the social dystopia that so terrifies them... is the thought that somewhere in the world, people not like them are enjoying the same privileges that they are.

          I know that's not the sum total of conservative thought -- that some people really do believe that prosperity should be left to "trickle down," that "abortion stops a beating heart," that a vengeful God will punish a wicked people for allowing the wrong naughty bits to touch one another, etc.

          But I'm still convinced that the animus that drives even the most committed, ideologically sincere conservatives is one grounded in a very small-minded notion of how the social "Other" should be treated. The true conservative won't be happy until people are placed in a pecking order, with themselves at the top. Because of that, any empathy I feel for the defeated conservative runs up against severe limits.

          Nothing requires a greater effort of thought than arguments to justify the rule of non-thought. -- Milan Kundera

          by Dale on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:30:57 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Just out of curiosity: (0+ / 0-)

            What would you call people who believe that those at the top should be some other group (to which they belong, of course)?  It's hard for me to imagine that there aren't people like that out there.  I suspect you could even put some hippies and liberals into that category--well, maybe.

            The '60s were simply an attempt to get the 21st Century started early....Well, what are we waiting for? There's no deadline on a dream!

            by Panurge on Tue Nov 13, 2012 at 11:39:08 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

        •  We could all be gulled (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          US Blues

          and deluded, but some of us choose to gather information and evaluate it.   Why do those who do not get a pass for their ignorance.  It is their responsibility as much as it is everyone's to know of what we speak.  They practice ignorance and pass it on to their children.  We shouldn't be praised for educating ourselves, but neither should others be pitied for refusing - and that's the point, refusing to do the same.

        •  It's easy to UNDERSTAND (8+ / 0-)

          the  feelings of the people in the Tumblr show.  It is even important to understand their feelings.  But in large measure these are people that  believed the most foul of lies about African Americans and the President.  If they didn't embrace it explicitly, they turned to look the other way as politicians exploited the bigotry.  In either case, they helped to grow the  spirit of bigotry in the country.  And the vast majority of them are in deep denial about the death and destruction 8 years of Bush has given the US and the world.

          We look at a photo and see a tearful person and its easy to get caught up in sympathy for that person.  NO!  Save your sympathy for the victims of their misguided fears and hate.  Or if you must, find some sympathy for those on the right beginning to admit they were deeply in error.

          If you want to feel sympathy, remind yourself of what Ali Abbas has been through and remind yourself that he is only one of 10s  of thousands of children maimed by the Iraq War.  That is what "abject terror and misery" is.  I know it's hard because our frail US media doesn't do global views so well.  Still, we as progressives should know better and we should seek out the info sources that keep our priorities focused.

          Most of these  people on the right have embraced their delusions.  They have had ample evidence to wonder about the bubble they live in, but most constantly reject facts.

          Here's the best I can do for them:  I can understand their feelings.  But I must remember their actions and their delusions not only for  past destruction but because they continue to put our entire society and planet in danger.  My mindset is closest to a clinician.  These are people living in complex fantasy worlds that are difficult to break out of.  I can't help them, if they are not willing to help themselves.  It's a tragic loss of human potential, but then only they can break out of it by "taking personal responsibility for their lives."

          I'm not liberal. I'm actually just anti-evil, OK? - Elon James White

          by Satya1 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:07:21 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Nice! (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Satya1
            "taking personal responsibility for their lives."
            Wouldn't that be novel! But no, this as everything, is the fault of the Other.

            How many divisions does OWS have?

            by Diebold Hacker on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:28:34 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  they are distraught because of lies they believed (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Satya1, US Blues

            so i am not worried about them.

            either they will find out the the lies about Obamacare and taxes aren't true, and then they will feel a little better

            or they believed the lies because of racism that is their chosen folly, in which case I'm with Satya1:  "These are people living in complex fantasy worlds that are difficult to break out of.  I can't help them, if they are not willing to help themselves. "

            "Politics is like driving. To go backward put it in R. To go forward put it in D."
            Four More Years! How sweet it is!!!

            by TrueBlueMajority on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 04:51:28 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

      •  It's easy (0+ / 0-)

        to look at those photos and feel the sentiment expressed in this diary. But, in order to do that, you have to ignore the words. I can't ignore the words.

      •  In many cases, (9+ / 0-)

        they were misled, mainly by a compliant media that has been reluctant (or has outright refused) to call out the Republicans on their bullshit tactics for the last 3+ years. They haven't reported that the Republicans expressly stated that their goal was not to help this country recover from 8 years of mismanagement, but rather to make Obama a one-term President. We had a well-paid radio talk host say openly of Obama, "I hope he fails." If any Democrat had come out and said that early in 2001, they would have been branded a traitor or worse.

        I hold out hope that some of the younger folks in the pictures (I could only stand to go through about two pages) might actually have a wake-up moment and realize they've been hoodwinked. But they'd probably still be weeping if it was Hillary Clinton or John Edwards (assuming he kept his zipper closed) or any other Democrat being re-elected -- they've been fed a steady diet of FAUX Snooze "The Democrat Party is evil" without that being challenged by other news outlets except for a few rare exceptions on MSNBC.

        "If we ever needed to vote we sure do need to vote now" -- Rev. William Barber, NAACP

        by Cali Scribe on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:53:50 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  What I honestly don't get, looking at that site .. (9+ / 0-)
          they were misled, mainly by a compliant media that has been reluctant (or has outright refused) to call out the Republicans on their bullshit tactics for the last 3+ years.
          ... are the many comments from the distraught Romney followers alluding to Obama's "tyranny," and to how our "freedom" and "liberty" is in "jeopardy."

          I can only think, "What the heck are they talking about?"  

          What possible real-life examples can they point to that might even vaguely be interpreted as Obama acting in a "tyrannical" manner?

          What has he actually done to warrant this kind of talk?

          What real-life examples could they possibly give to point to our "freedoms" and "liberties" being curtailed in the last four years?  

          We had a democratic election -- which even they seem to acknowledge Obama fairly won.  They are still free to post all these anti-Obama messages, and Obama is not stopping them.  Despite all the hysteria from the NRA, there has been no move toward more gun control whatsoever.  Fox News and Rush are still on the air and they can watch and listen all they want, and no on is censoring them.

          Really ... what are they talking about, and what are they seeing that no one else is?

          •  They're talking about aesthetics. (13+ / 0-)

            They have a particular aesthetic conception of what tyranny looks like, or what freedom looks like, and when they see images that somehow corroborate their notion of tyranny or conflict with their image of freedom, they come to the conclusion that tyranny is afoot.

            So they're bombarded with images of an "angry" (photoshopped) Obama jabbing his finger into the air, and it becomes that much easier to believe Dinesh D'Sousa when he claims that Obama is speaking from a bottomless well of barely constrained rage. The fact that you haven't seen any such "Obama rage" on TV is all the more insidious proof of its secret existence.

            Or, freedom: "freedom" is now linked metonymically, through countless Pavlovian associations, with wheat fields with American flags fluttering overhead. For better or for worse, the prevailing iconography of Democratic politics is urban: tightly clustered buildings, busy streets, immigrants and people of color heading hither and yon. Their inability to reconcile the images of the latter with the imagery of the former leads them to assume that some menacing, alien force is meddling with their unsullied fruited plains.

            I think that's pretty much all it comes down to. They never actually experience any of this "tyranny" in their lives -- or if they do, they badly misconstrue its actual source. So, for example, they attribute the massive debt they're trying to crawl out from not to packagers of collateralized debt obligations or Wall street investment bankers, but rather to whatever the Right has been telling them about Obama handing free mortgages to the beneficiaries of some Carter-passed legislation from the groovy 1970s. They look everywhere for a tangible villain that can be linked to their abstract financial difficulties, and the right helpfully points them in Obama's direction.

            Nothing requires a greater effort of thought than arguments to justify the rule of non-thought. -- Milan Kundera

            by Dale on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:29:34 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Thanks for the thoughtful reply. (4+ / 0-)

              I think that is a large part of it.  

              This part especially struck me:

              it becomes that much easier to believe Dinesh D'Sousa when he claims that Obama is speaking from a bottomless well of barely constrained rage. The fact that you haven't seen any such "Obama rage" on TV is all the more insidious proof of its secret existence.
              Yes, even the complete lack of evidence for their position is taken as proof of the position -- as shown by the NRA chairman arguing, in all seriousness, that the fact that Obama has so far done absolutely nothing toward greater gun control is PROOF that he IS going to take all our guns away in the future.

              They are clearly coming from an irrational place of the basest emotions, because they can provide no rational examples of this "tyranny" or any personal experience of it.

              They are simply scared, anxiety-filled people in general ... and like Goebbels with all his propaganda showing cartoon caricatures of evil, rat-looking Jews, the GOP is expert at providing a welcome packaged image for scared, anxiety-filled people to focus all that fear and anxiety on;  and further, to blame for their fear and anxiety.

              And that fear and anxiety then becomes HATE.

            •  And once that's established... (0+ / 0-)

              ...they "know" how to approach the ACA.

              Why do you think they called them "Hillarycare" and "Obamacare"??  It's because these names evoked an image of one person imposing his or her will upon the nation, which of course is the very definition of "tyranny".

              The '60s were simply an attempt to get the 21st Century started early....Well, what are we waiting for? There's no deadline on a dream!

              by Panurge on Tue Nov 13, 2012 at 11:46:52 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

          •  It's obvious! The Tyrant is going to (5+ / 0-)

            take away our guns and lock us all up in gay abortion FEMA centers.

            Just like he did four years ago!!

            Wake up sheeple.

            How many divisions does OWS have?

            by Diebold Hacker on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:32:27 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  Fasicism is equated in their minds with (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Thorby Baslim, FloraLine

            any challenge to Christian supremacy.  It's tyranny if they can't impose their anti-abortion, homophobic, patriarchal vision of America on the rest of us.

        •  Particularly the young girl who wrote (3+ / 0-)
          "I wonder who would've won if you had to take an IQ test before voting ...? Romney. Romney would have won."
          Think again, dear.

          What about my Daughter's future?

          by koNko on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 07:24:29 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  I agree completely, Dale, and (7+ / 0-)

        watching the Tparty press conference today on CSPAN, believe me, 'those people' are not chastised one little bit.  They are still spitting fire and discussing President Obama's penchant for killing living aborted babies.  'Those people' are still spouting venom and revenge.  It is my tendency to always feel sorry for the loser, but I have steeled myself this time around that whenever that threatens to occur, I think of the relentless hatefulness against this President, and the moment passes.  I will not feel sorry for them.  

      •  I think mourning is not the right word (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Thorby Baslim, FloraLine

        because mourning is for persons, you love and lose.

        What is happening here is that people are frustrated, angry, disappointed and confused that they were losing the beloved hatred incorporated in their ideology. The hatred is all they got to cling to. This is not only disgusting and awful, but something to worry about in the depth of their self-deception and denial and consciousness. You are in denial if you think it couldn't happen to your closest friend, family member or child, parent (or to yourself).

        I don't think it's mourning. It's bitterness and confusion that their ideas didn't prevail, ideas, they thought were so reasonable and correct.  The question is how did they get  to believe in those ideas to the point the are voting against their own interest, while engaging in prolesytlism of hate and greed.

        •  Maybe grieving is the more correct word. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Thorby Baslim

          Grieving is about any sense of loss, whether about a person or not, whether real or imagined.

          "Okay, until next time. Keep sending me your questions, and I will make fun of you... I mean, answer them." - Strong Bad

          by AaronInSanDiego on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 08:57:03 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I think all these words have a too positive (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            FloraLine

            connotation. To think that one can "grieve" about the loss of something that is evil and hurts other people is not feeling right, I would want another word for that process.

            I am still searching for how to call what one is seeing.

    •  petitions to secede from US after election defeat (8+ / 0-)

      indicate some may be mourning, and i do empathize with most anyone who suffers a loss even when i do not share their views,  but others are just pissed because their own arrogance and entitlement did not prevail, their racism and hatred and bigotry of all but them did not prevail.

      The petitions to secede, starting first with southern states, and now including some in north, are filed at the White House site. What utter offensive BS.  

      Here's one secession advocate who wants a "divorce" from us "maggots:"

      Among the chorus of outrageous comments coming from the right, one Texas GOP official is now advocating for a secession.

      According to the Huffington Post, Hardin County Republican treasurer Peter Morrison thinks things would be better off if Texas just separated from the country.

      “Why should Vermont and Texas live under the same government?” he wrote in his Tea Party newsletter this week.

      He demanded an “amicable divorce” from the “maggots” who re-elected President Obama. More specifically, he doesn’t want to be associated with the non-white voters whom he said only voted for the president on an “ethnic basis.”

      Earth provides enough to satisfy every man's need, but not every man's greed. Mohandas K. Gandhi

      by Patriot Daily News Clearinghouse on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:20:04 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  You are way too kind, billmon. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Thorby Baslim

      They haven't lost anything real.

    •  I HR'd this diary... (7+ / 0-)

      * [new] Racist Bullshit on many fronts HR'd (0+ / 0-)

      Did you know Gernimo was Americas longest held POW until present day Leonard Peltier passed him up in years held? Geronimo DIED in captivity so your analogy reeks of both racism and ignorance. His immediate family were murdered in their homes, wife and kids. It caused him to fight back forever. His people were also murdered and the survivors spent their final years in captivity in Oklahoma at the concentration camp at Ft. Sill.

      They still are among Americas poorest people but you DARE compare them to some fucking fatcat teabaggers being sad over a black man being elected? Fuck that shit. That certainly deserves and HR and makes the rest of your diary pure bullshit.

      You would not use a slave in your analogy because you can plainly see how ignorant and racist it would be. But like many Americans you can refer to Indian humans without thinking nor guilt because of your vast ignorance and that of your audience.

      There isn't a fucking thing wrong with those pictured except they lost an election. There is no MOURNING going on so you're also insulting people who actually have reason to mourn.Tomorrow these same fuckers will be working hard to deny we minorities, gays and women our rights and they'll be smiling for the camera as they do.

      America could have chosen to be the worlds doctor, or grocer. We choose instead to be her policeman. pity

      by cacamp on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 02:24:02 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Bullshit. (33+ / 0-)

    Those are not the racist Tea Baggers who have been whipped into a frenzy of racist fear and loathing by Faux.  Those are the entitled elites, the rootless cosmopolitans sipping champagne and eating canapes while draining our nation of blood and treasure while buying themselves another puppet on the backs of the "poor white trash".  Spare me.  

    •  I agree with you, but... (37+ / 0-)

      Consider 2014. Where do they go now? This is the big story that I think we're missing. I DO have empathy for those in mourning right now. They have a tough choice to make: Either stay willfully ignorant that they are being lied to or seek the truth. Remember, the results of the election aren't over. They will be staring those people "in the fact" day-in and day-out for the next four years.

      So, the question is, do they decide to just live with their painful cognitive dissonance? Or do they seek relief in reality?

      It is ignorance which is hopeless.

      by IdeaTipper on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 03:29:23 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Where do they go? (22+ / 0-)

        Preferably, away.

        "If you are still playing for Team Republican and want to have any honor whatsoever, you need to leave the Republican Party now, apologize to America, and work to remove it from our political system." - Brad DeLong

        by radabush on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:25:32 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  They're "trying" (5+ / 0-)

          ...there are apparently 15 petitions on the White House site asking for permission for red states to secede.  Talk about unclear on the fucking concept...

          America, we can do better than this...

          by Randomfactor on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:59:49 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  States should have to prove they DESERVE to stay (4+ / 0-)

            in the union every 10 years. Texas and most of the South would fail this test on every measure. They have the highest poverty, the worst healthcare and education systems, and receive the most handouts from the federal government. So, I'd say:

            "Buh-bye, South. Get your act together and we might consider taking you back someday...if Mexico hasn't taken you over first."

            Just doing my part to piss off right wing nuts, one smart ass comment at a time.

            by tekno2600 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:06:03 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  What is it about "one nation, indivisible" (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              TexasTom

              that you don't get? I mean, I have never recited the Pledge and never will. But I am guessing you did.

              For if there is a sin against life, it consists perhaps not so much in despairing of life as in hoping for another life and in eluding the implacable grandeur of this life. - Albert Camus

              by Anne Elk on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:15:43 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  I used to think preserving the union was the right (3+ / 0-)

                thing to do and certainly the South wanted to start the Civil War and got thumped for it. But, I now think (only semi-joking here), that most of the Southern states have continued 150 years of unbroken warfare against the rest of the country and against the modern world. I think they are a drag on the rest of the country, and I have to wonder if Chuck Thompson got it right in his new book Better Off Without 'Em.

                Just doing my part to piss off right wing nuts, one smart ass comment at a time.

                by tekno2600 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:31:40 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  They signed onto the New Deal in a pretty big way. (0+ / 0-)

                  For if there is a sin against life, it consists perhaps not so much in despairing of life as in hoping for another life and in eluding the implacable grandeur of this life. - Albert Camus

                  by Anne Elk on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:58:16 AM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Johnson also did some good things, and bad things, (0+ / 0-)

                    not to mention the circumstances which brought him to office. But remember I was responding to a comment about how 15 states had petitions to secede (who knows how serious they are). I simply said that they were welcome to and perhaps we should turn this around and say do certain states even deserve (or want) to be in the union, giving their continued actions to removed themselves from the rest of the country. I'm not going to apologize for that.

                    Just doing my part to piss off right wing nuts, one smart ass comment at a time.

                    by tekno2600 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:10:18 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                •  Black population... (10+ / 0-)

                  ...in Mississippi: 37%
                  Alabama: 26%
                  Georgia: 31%
                  Louisiana: 32%
                  Texas: 12% (Latino: 38%)
                  Arkansas: 16%
                  Florida: 16%

                  Total: 13 million African Americans.

                  What do you suppose secession will mean for them?

                  Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

                  by Meteor Blades on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:25:42 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I think Blacks and Latinos will finally seize (0+ / 0-)

                    permanent power in the Southern states. It's amazing that the shrinking White population has managed to keep control for so long. I did not realize until you mentioned it that the Blacks and Hispanics in Texas now make up 50%. This election is the beginning of the end for White privilege in the South, and thankfully, all this talk about secession will finally come to an end as well.

                    Just doing my part to piss off right wing nuts, one smart ass comment at a time.

                    by tekno2600 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 02:37:31 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                  •  When I checked (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Meteor Blades, a gilas girl

                    the Alabama petition it only had 56 signatures.   And most of them were from out of state.  Please don't ax us off just yet.  Some 40% of us voted for Obama...twice.  It's not our fault the "lied to" folks are so goddamn loud.

                    “Nice country you got here. Shame if something were to happen to it” --the GOP philosophy to governing as described by Paul Krugman

                    by dwayne on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 01:53:38 AM PST

                    [ Parent ]

              •  Here in the south (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                a gilas girl

                so damn many of my friends and neighbors are so hung up on the words "one nation under God" that they almost forget there are words after that.  "Indivisible" is  a word they'd laugh at, even if it's part of the same pledge.

                “Nice country you got here. Shame if something were to happen to it” --the GOP philosophy to governing as described by Paul Krugman

                by dwayne on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 01:51:12 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

            •  Your attitude is sickening... (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              diggerspop, a gilas girl

              ...and, in the end, it isn't very different from the folks on the right that you'd like to think you're so different from.

              Political Compass: -6.75, -3.08

              by TexasTom on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:22:37 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  I was semi-joking. It was in response to the (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Aquarius40, a gilas girl

                millionth request for secession by an elected official in Texas. The latest one to get attention is this jackhole named Peter Morrison, a Hardin Country Treasurer, who is asking for the state to get a divorce from America because of the "maggots" who voted for Obama: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...

                I know it's natural to get defense about one's state. I have relatives there and even lived there briefly as a kid. But, there is a grain of truth in saying that there are some attitudes down there that do not lend themselves to people acting like they are part of the rest of the country. So, if they want to go...

                Just doing my part to piss off right wing nuts, one smart ass comment at a time.

                by tekno2600 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:44:44 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

            •  worst education system? (4+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              diggerspop, IM, Meteor Blades, Eric Nelson

              Once again, beat up on Texas and the south.  According to a chart posted here in a diary, Texas WAS NOT one of the ten worst states for education.  Of course it was not one of the ten best either.  Keep in mind, as you look at the states that went for Romney not all were the South.  

              What about some of the Kossacks that live in the South or even Texas?  What would you do with them?  

            •  Couldn't disagree more. (0+ / 0-)

              While I'm starting to think maybe a few states seceding wouldn't be so bad, I am horrified at your suggestion of a test for continued membership in the Union.

              My late mother used to quote the Frost poem "The Death of the Hired Man":

              Home is the place where, when you have to go there,
              They have to take you in.
              The next line, which she didn't quote, is
              I should have called it
              Something you somehow haven’t to deserve
              Those quotes are how I feel about this country. The states are members of this family. If they want to leave, maybe we should let them, but if they want to be here, they don't have to prove anything. They belong by right of birth.

              "These are not candidates. These are the empty stand-ins for lobbyists' policies to be legislated later." - Chimpy, 9/24/10

              by NWTerriD on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:04:44 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  I responded to secession petitions in 15 states (0+ / 0-)

                and simply said that they were welcome to do that. And, I jokingly added, that perhaps we should turn this constant threat of secession around and ask: Do certain states even deserve (or want) to be in the union, giving their continued actions to removed themselves from the rest of the country? I don't think that's such an unfair thing to say, so I'm done apologizing to any thin-skinned Southerner on this tread who has no sense of humor.  

                Just doing my part to piss off right wing nuts, one smart ass comment at a time.

                by tekno2600 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:18:49 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

          •  Yea Texans love to talk about seceding. (3+ / 0-)

            Would immediately become a third world country!

            All, I ask, is let me out first, before the wall goes up.

            WE NEVER FORGET Our Labor Martyrs: a project to honor the men, women and children who lost their lives in Freedom's Cause. For Nov: Voting Rights Martyrs

            by JayRaye on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:41:51 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  We'll protect the People's Republic of Austin with (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              JayRaye

              a Berlin-style airlift. The rest of Texas can join the Confederate States of Jesubamas if they want.

              Just doing my part to piss off right wing nuts, one smart ass comment at a time.

              by tekno2600 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:13:28 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

          •  Not just red states. Colorado, Oregon and... (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            KenBee

            ...New Jersey are among them.

            Don't tell me what you believe, show me what you do and I will tell you what you believe.

            by Meteor Blades on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:12:40 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

        •  I'm slightly on the unsympathetic side simply (9+ / 0-)

          because of the on-going threat to democracy posed by these people who believe what they hear from Fox "News." As the diarist said:

          I also know that they have been lied to, with ferocious intensity and relentless dedication, by the conservative propaganda machine and its political masters.
          Now how do we cure the mental viruses these people carry around, i.e. "Cutting taxes raises revenue," and "Government doesn't create jobs."

          Reaganomics noun pl: belief that unregulated capitalism can produce unlimited goods for unlimited people on a planet with finite resources and we the people can increase revenue by decreasing revenue.

          by FrY10cK on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:08:35 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I'm not (4+ / 0-)

            terribly sympathetic toward them either.  I actually don't think that the argument that they're victims because they were lied to is a valid one, as most of these people had access to other sources of information than just Fox.  There is no excuse for a lack of intellectual curiosity.

            •  Many of those "other sources" (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              socindemsclothing, FloraLine

              in the traditional media were complicit in their silence, not calling out the GOP on their bullshit. Remember how surprised many of us were when, in the second debate, Candy Crowley actually called out Romney on his lies about Obama's reaction to Benghazi?

              Far too often, the traditional media tries to be so "balanced" that if they had someone on talking about how blue the sky is, they'd feel obligated to bring on someone else to say it's really purple with pink polka dots.

              "If we ever needed to vote we sure do need to vote now" -- Rev. William Barber, NAACP

              by Cali Scribe on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:05:51 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

            •  Agreed (0+ / 0-)

              They've embraced delusions of all sorts and never acknowledged gross errors of the past.  It is THEY who must decide to break out of their delusions.

              I'm not liberal. I'm actually just anti-evil, OK? - Elon James White

              by Satya1 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:12:05 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

        •  Ah, here see CHARLOTTE NC KKK and Neo-Nazi rally.. (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          annieli, diggerspop, vicki, Eric Nelson

          held just yesterday! THIS WAS ANTIIMMIGRATION! A very effective counter rally also held.

          CHARLOTTE NC: Saturday’s neo-Nazi and KKK rally

          CHARLOTTE NC Anti-Immigration Rally!

          “Charlotte-Mecklenburg Police say no one was arrested during a loud – and very colorful – KKK rally and counter-protest in uptown Charlotte Saturday afternoon. Members of the National Socialist Movement joined the Ku Klux Klan for an anti-immigration rally at Old City Hall on West Trade Street, but the counter-protesters outnumbered them at least five to one. Instead of shouting, the protesters used squeaky toys, whistles, and noisemakers to drown out the amplified speeches. Many dressed as clowns.”
          There is more pics/coverage at article site.

          Proud to be part of the 21st Century Democratic Majority Party of the 3M's.. Multiracial,Multigender and MiddleClass

          by LOrion on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:24:06 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  Fuck them. (34+ / 0-)

        Consider 2014?  No, I'll consider 2000 when they were lied too and they willfully voted for bush, and then in 2004 after it was shown conclusively that bush is a WAR CRIMINAL and that the country was worse off following his "leadership" they still voted for him!

        Fuck them.  They have chosen to stay willfully ignorant for the past 10-15-hell 20 goddamn years.

        I do not mourn them.  

        They can go to hell.

        "I'm not scared of anyone or anything, Angie. Isn't that the way life should be?" Jack Hawksmoor

        by skyounkin on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:25:48 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Except for that cute little boy. (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          NealB, skyounkin, Eric Nelson, ivorybill

          I'm sorry I feel no sympathy for these people at all.

          They can go where ever they want to go, just go away.

          Leave the cupcakes and wine though, and all our military bases. And no NFL for you.

          "Is that your vegetarian leather jacket?" George Harrison

          by nellgwen on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:08:03 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I agree, his parents will undoubtably (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            skyounkin, nellgwen, FloraLine

            double down on their efforts to complete his indoctrination into the rightwing fantasyland.

            “When you're in jail, a good friend will be trying to bail you out. A best friend will be in the cell next to you saying, 'Damn, that was fun'.” ― Groucho Marx

            by Sam Sara on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:30:09 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  Cute little boys grow up (0+ / 0-)

            and some of them become Democrats.  Hey, I volunteered for Nixon as a 12 year old; made me love politics, even when I grew up and my politics changed.

            I don't feel sorry for the kids in those pics; I feel sorrier for the adults who are caught up in the hate and can't change.

            “If the misery of the poor be caused not by the laws of nature, but by our institutions, great is our sin.” Charles Darwin

            by ivorybill on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 03:31:33 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

        •  Hmmm.... (5+ / 0-)
          They have chosen to stay willfully ignorant for the past 10-15-hell 20 goddamn years.
          More like 30-40 years....Nixon was elected first in 1968, that's 44 years ago, and that whole fiasco, and the 'St Ronnie' years....
          They're mourning for their own gullibility (after 40 years is it still gullibility or stupidity?), falling for lies by the repubs....
          Every. Single. Time.
          What's the definition of crazy????

          I think, therefore I am........................... Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose....AKA Engine Nighthawk - don't even ask!

          by Lilyvt on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:10:10 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  And when they won they told us (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          jds1978, skyounkin, Eric Nelson

          "get over it we won".

          Politics is like sports, it doesn't build character it reveals character.

          by Sassy on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:57:24 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  I have no doubt that by 2014, some fake populist (4+ / 0-)

        pseudo-movement will have been propped up like a Potemkin village, promising succor to the alienated mouthbreathers who believe themselves to be living in the United States of Kenyakistan.

        Every time there's a Democratic victory, we imagine that the Republicans will disappear into irrelevance. We believe this because reason would seem to confront them with a dilemna: their positions are becoming increasingly unpopular; our positions seem to be working (to the degree that they're implemented).

        But the Tea Party movement should remind us that the Republican party does not reckon with reason, and has not done so for some time. Their appeal is to the amygdala, the lizard brain, and there is no such thing as a political environment that renders irrelevant the appeal to naked, irrational fear.

        If people can lock themselves in ever-more-militarized gated communities some multiple decades after violent crime statistics have begun to diminish; if they can convince themselves that gay people have an "agenda" (complete with committee meetings and Roberts rules of order) that they are secretly implementing to make "gays" out of every child in the nation; if they can convince themselves that a secular crypto-Stalinist old-line Arab dictator could be in league with a coterie of Wahabi Islamic fundamentalists to terrorize the U.S. --

        -- if they can believe all this shit, then they can believe a whole lot more.

        Nothing requires a greater effort of thought than arguments to justify the rule of non-thought. -- Milan Kundera

        by Dale on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:29:10 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  I get the analogy in the broadest sense. (32+ / 0-)

      They are people who realize their world as they know it is going or gone, and they are grieving.

      The fact that these white people who are grieving are blinded by tradition, or racism, or choosing to get all their information from bigots, or just really unaware, misinformed, ignorant by choice, they are still human beings who are grieving, and I know  them. They are not monsters.  

      There but for the grace of God go I. I escaped this burden somehow, but if, while growing up in South Carolina, my Dad had allowed us to say the "N" word around the house (he did not) and trained me to be a racist instead of rooting for the underdog, it might be a picture of me with mascara running down my face.

      In a previous life, I listened to Rush Limbaugh, along with many others in my small town, South Carolina world. I saw the light, but others may not be so lucky.

      These are my people, too, Bilmon. I choose to have compassion and empathy for them. I think it is best not to demonize and maybe, just maybe, I can reach some of them  and win them over by example.

      •  And I might add... (21+ / 0-)

        I have seen signs of a change of heart for some of my right wing friends since the election, with some minds opening up to some change of heart, It was a major wake-up call, and some are paying attention. Really.

        •  I'm glad to hear this. (0+ / 0-)
          It was a major wake-up call, and some are paying attention. Really.
          I really do hope that many of these mourners will continue to question what actually happened? Why was fox so wrong?

          But I don't feel the slightest sympathy for them. Fascists and dictators have always had their ardent supporters and I'm sure many of them cried when the regime fell.

          How many divisions does OWS have?

          by Diebold Hacker on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 02:04:20 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  I'm glad to see this, and glad for the compassion (19+ / 0-)

        of my fellow lefties. I'm guessing that you guys weren't shut out by the folks who are grieving now. It's good to reach out a hand, really it's the best we can do as humans, I think.

        But please remember that these folks built their castles on the dreams of other human beings, people who they thought they could stomp on for the crime of not fitting in the conformist picture. They thought they were better than millions of their fellow Americans. I hope they find a way to feel shame about that someday.

        Poverty = politics.

        by Renee on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:55:50 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  asdf (10+ / 0-)

        I agree with you. A small % of the republican voters (not the politicians, for whom I have little respect) are sociopaths. So is a small $ of dem voters (and a substantial, I suspect proportion of dem and republican politicians - though I think the % is higher on repub side).

        I cannot reject 47% of American population as "other"...Americans are angry, suspicious and desperate with crazy terribly unfair economic changes - some people respond by becoming more tribal, insular and willing to demonize - that is normal - and doesnt make them evil.

        Doesnt mean we don't respond strategically, outreach where we can. But I don't believe I should hate them. They are still ours. Even Rep Walter Jones of freedom fry fame redeemed himself eventually.

        $ to DFA, none to DSCC/DCCC/DNC

        by grrr on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:59:13 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  My heroes are those who inspire by righteous (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          NWTerriD, grrr

          acts of love, and reject the easier path of hate and fear. It is way more easy and more human to react with hatred and anger. It is most of the times HARD and dangerous and thankless in the short term to show compassion; most of the leaders throughout history who have been the most inspirational have also been martyred for their compassion.

          It is still worthy to strive for, I do believe.

        •  Rep Jones posted the pictures of the Iraq fallen (6+ / 0-)

          Our group, Military Families Speak Out, met with Walter Jones, and he told us of his conversion against the war.  Then he posted the pictures of the fallen through out the Congressional office buildings. He also espouses things I can not stand- but- he is a fellow citizen, and the only way we can reconcile is to look for common ground and treat even our opponents with respect.  It is what each of us has wanted, and when we have been insulted and hurt, its because our opponents have denied our humanity.  We, the progressive left, have to be bigger people.  We all still live on the same planet, we have a duty to try to act with loving persistence to create a better World

      •  I have mixed feelings (17+ / 0-)

        In the past, it might have been compassion and empathy, but these same people, friends and family, inundated me with their lying and dog whistle laden racist emails back in 2008.  Even after President Obama won, some of them refused to accept the legitimacy of his Presidency.  The "N" word was often used freely in my presence until I spoke out and told them that it was extremely offensive.  But I am very sure it is still being used, just not when I am around.

        These people need a reality check in life.  Many of them are 47%'ers and others are barely making it as it is.  And most profess to be so called "good Christians," though not fundamentalists.  They still hold very unchristian beliefs about non-whites, minorities, gays, liberals, and anyone else who is not like them.  Who do they think is keeping them down?  Not surprisingly, they think it is unions and minorities.  

        All the factual information in the world would not sway them.  They did not care if they p*ssed away their own futures and the futures of their children.  All they cared about was marking the spot next to Romney's name because that meant that they were voting against Obama.

        The day Rick Scott won in Florida, I had to be around some of them.  I asked that no one discuss the election, to which one proudly said, "I just want to say one thing.  I voted for the crook."  And then she laughed with glee.  

        No, I might feel sorry for their ignorance, but the part I cannot forgive is how willful it was.  And I do not feel sorry for anyone who has consistently chosen the road of racism and hatred.  Letting them wallow for a while might just be the thing to wake them up as to how badly they have been lied to and duped for years.  And only then, perhaps they might start that we are all in this boat together.

        "Growing up is for those who don't have the guts not to. Grow wise, grow loving, grow compassionate, but why grow up?" - Fiddlegirl

        by gulfgal98 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:12:59 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  asdf (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          gulfgal98

          The ignorance does have a willful component in many. I also think if the narcissitic injury of high economic instability was not present, they would be more self-reflective, and less eager to buy snake oil.

          Dems in swing districts: INSIST your republican rep incr tax on the wealthy -.gerrymandering makes rep vulnerable

          by grrr on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 05:37:22 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  There world isn't going anywhere. They will still (0+ / 0-)

        live in Fantasyland or realize that the real world is okay.

      •  Or maybe not -- but you'll feel better. (0+ / 0-)
    •  Um, no. (0+ / 0-)

      Your attitude is as much a danger to the future political prospects of the Left as the Tea Party was to that of the Right, and for similar reasons.

      -- (defun :-> () (format t "abolish corporate personhood~%")) (:->)

      by Bill Evans at Mariposa on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:51:20 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  2 different things? (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        StrayCat, StellaRay, Ellen Columbo

        I think Hunter is talking about people and how they feel, not Republicans and their policies. When it comes to politics, as in "the assholes on the other side of the aisle" and the whole RW Wurlitzer apparatus, I don't think anyone here is suggesting empathy for those particular "people". We are talking about actual human beings.

        I have been saying for a long time that I truly pity the authoritarian follower people who have to wake up every morning with all that fear and hate inside of them. That doesn't mean I won't fight back against what their fear and hate produce in our society. Love the "sinner", hate the sin, which in this case is asshattery. Just because I won't condemn them to hell doesn't mean I won't fight them tooth and nail.

    •  Did you look at those pics? (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      IM, Ed in Montana

      Those are not moneyed elites. I agree with billmon -- those are my lower-middle class, sparsely educated relatives in the Deep South, whom I love dearly. They are the neighbors who lived down the street during my Oklahoma childhood -- practical "common sense" types who are often in error but never in doubt.

      These are the faces you will see by the millions if you start a bit NNW of Mt. Rushmore, travel down the Great Plains, take a left at the Texas School Book Depository, and head to Disney World.

      "These are not candidates. These are the empty stand-ins for lobbyists' policies to be legislated later." - Chimpy, 9/24/10

      by NWTerriD on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:55:53 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Seems to me one of Nancy Pelosi's daughters (81+ / 0-)

    did a documentary right after the '08 election with a lot of similar faces featured. I've dealt with quite a few people who just know Obama is going to take their guns & trucks & send them off to socialist/communist/nazi reeducation camps.
    Yeah, the sadness is authentic, but their delusion is obvious as well. I've not the time to explain things to the woman in Delaware with her birth certificate in a baggie who wants her country back. You know what they told me when I questioned them about integration in Augusta, Ga in 1966?
    "If you don't like the way we do things down here, why don't you move to Africa!" & I've been invited to move by these same people every wrongheaded war & bigotry I've challenged for over 40 years. So no sympathy from me.
    Always good to see you posting here, I miss Whiskey Bar.

    Who cares what banks may fail in Yonkers. Long as you've got a kiss that conquers.

    by rasbobbo on Sat Nov 10, 2012 at 11:38:34 PM PST

  •  Humble requiem for sure... (43+ / 0-)

    But you do realize that if the results were reversed they'd be serving all us Obama voters self-deportation papers 'bout now.

    Sorry, I just can't seem to get all weepy-eyed over 'em and all their delusional despair.

    "That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history." ~ Aldous Huxley

    by markthshark on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:11:38 AM PST

  •  You're a nicer person (118+ / 0-)

    than I am.  I can't drum up any sympathy for people who are mourning the loss of white supremacy in America.  And I won't let them off the hook because they were lied to- they're not children, they chose to believe the lies, they chose to demonize a good man because he doesn't look like them.

    We were upset about Bush's re-election because of what he did.  They're upset about Obama's re-election because of who he is.  

    I didn't grow up in the South, but I did grow up in a Republican family with a lot of "soft" racism.  I told all of them years ago that I would not tolerate any of it- if they didn't clean up their act they would not see me or my kids and they would have to cook their own damn holiday dinners.  They stopped- at least in front of me- but they're still Republicans and they voted for Romney even though they all hated him.
    If they're sad this week they deserve to be.

  •  They Subject Themselves To FOX News..... (28+ / 0-)

    & Rush Limbaugh every day.  No wonder, they are sad looking.  Buck up, people.  It's also a little late for crocodile tears.  It seems disingenuous.  Where were your tears when the Obama girls were being mocked on FB & Twitter?  

    You would really have had something to cry about if Mitt Romney had won & repealed Obamacare.  

  •  I have no sympathy for my GOP relatives...n/t (25+ / 0-)

    "We are a Plutocracy, we ought to face it. We need, desperately, to find new ways to hear independent voices & points of view" Ramsey Clark, U.S. Attorney General.

    by Mr SeeMore on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:02:00 AM PST

  •  Okay, did anyone else notice Stefan (10+ / 0-)

    (I think that's the character name) from SNL in the middle of the room in one of the shots?  He appears at roughly 1:06 into the video facing the camera with his hands over his mouth just like on Weekend with Seth Myers.

    Boy, did someone had them some fun ;-)

    Live so that when your children think of fairness, caring and integrity, they think of you. H. Jackson Brown, Jr.

    by Ellen Columbo on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:11:02 AM PST

  •  On being a radical, not a partisan (37+ / 0-)

    I suppose it's easier being a partisan.  It doesn't matter to a partisan who your fellow partisans are, what their social role is, etc.  If they vote for your guys, they're good guys, and if they vote for the other guys, they're bad guys.

    It's a lot more complicated being a radical.  Because when you're a radical, you have to become attunedf to what people's role in society is, where they stnd in the relations of power, what's the likelihood that they may be among "the least of these."  A lot of times the people the people you as a radical fight for can't even imagine that someone like me exists, never mind is fighting for them.  And a whiole lot of them think they wouldn't want the likes of me fighting for them, or even to have that fight fought.  But the battle for justice is strange that way.

    Now reading the comments here, I gather that the overwhelming majority here have nothing but seething contempt for this couple, but I could never hate them, I've spent my life fighting for people like them, and they may not know it, and might not like it if they did, but so be it, that's the nature of the struggle.

    Photobucket

    Ever get the feeling you've been cheated?

    by ActivistGuy on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 03:01:50 AM PST

  •  Yeah, the 2004 parallels make it tough (12+ / 0-)

    I enjoy the epic wrongness of elites like George Will and Dick Morris, but some regular person who donated $100 and volunteered b/c they were sincerely concerned about the country and thought this candidate would help---I don't enjoy their misery.  

  •  I'm sure slave owners felt the same way in 1865. (42+ / 0-)

    But this diary is just an echo of, and minor variation on the theme of, "Gone with the Wind" and its racist nostalgia.  

    Here's my alternative reaction:  FUCK 'EM.  They've been standing in the courthouse door for my entire adult life going back to opposing JFK because he was Catholic & killing Medgar Evers.  So, to quote Pete Townshend out of context, "Fuck 'em, fuck 'em, fuck 'em, fuck 'em. Fuck 'em to Hell & back.".  You choose injustice & to resist the obvious tide of history, you deserve what you get.  Reap the whirlwind, assholes.  

    •  I agree about the Civil War (12+ / 0-)

      The last time I listened to the short film at that battle of Lexington in Missouri it began with the lament of a white woman who experienced the battle and had lost the gentile society she knew.

      I went ballistic.  After it was over, I went to one of the people and said this HAS TO be balanced with what the real nature of that society she lamented really was: human beings were just property.

      I hate the Lost Cause shit, but this is slightly different.  Most of these people are voting against their own self-interest because of their unacknowledged racism.  "They (and we all know who they are) are getting free stuff."

      Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens.

      by MoDem on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:42:09 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Saw this posted this morning. (5+ / 0-)
      "We are not enemies, but friends. We must not be enemies. Though passion may have strained it must not break our bonds of affection. The mystic chords of memory, stretching from every battlefield and patriot grave to every living heart and hearthstone all over this broad land, will yet swell the chorus of the Union, when again touched, as surely they will be, by the better angels of our nature.

      President Abraham Lincoln

      We can be vengeful, but I think our world will improve for the better if we aim a little higher.
      •  But, the better angels have not yet prevailed (6+ / 0-)

        Jim Crow and both de facto and de jure discrimination and repression lasted for more than 100 years after the Union won the Civil War.

        Please help to fight hunger with a donation to Feeding America.

        by MJB on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:11:33 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I think Jim Crow was born many years before, (0+ / 0-)

          from the more vengeful path the North took in punishing the South after Lincoln was assassinated. Lincoln was in the process of attempting to bring the Union back together as quickly and painlessly as possible after Lee's surrender, and if he had lived to implement his plan, the South would be a different place today.

          The worst thing that could have happened to the South after the war was John Wilkes Booth killing Lincoln. It sealed the fate of the South and Southerners for generations; it set in motion forces that we still see today.

          •  Sorry Susan (7+ / 0-)

            but you're reciting "lost cause" propaganda.

            Federal Reconstruction wasn't implemented out of revenge or a desire to punish but because the reconstituted Southern State governments attempted to condemn emancipated African Americans to the status of a permanent, politically neutered, underclass. That is precisely what did happen once Federal support for reconstruction was withdrawn. What ensued was nearly a century of American Apartheid enforced by a reign of racist murder, bloodshed and terror.

            Were some folks hankering for revenge? No doubt but the fact is that not a single rebel military or political leader was ever tried for treason, much less executed. If revenge had driven the Federal policy in the South I'd expect there would have been rebels dangling from every tree.

            I was told this same fable as a boy growing up in Georgia but that is all it is. A fable spun to allow Southern white folks to turn a blind eye to the ugliness and brutality that are the facts of our history.

            It's long past time that we woke up from such cozy, self serving lies.

            Nothing human is alien to me.

            by WB Reeves on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:25:06 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  This could be argued, and I guess we will (0+ / 0-)

              know. The question is still asked, how would the South be different if Lincoln had lived, and discussed not only by white supremacists, but by Doris Kearns Goodwin and other biographers and historians.

              I would not have thought to bring this up, except I have just read Ulysses S Grant's autobiography, and Team of Rivals by Doris Kearns Goodwin, and it was a point brought out in both of these books....Interestingly, in both of these books, the tone of the politician's arguments between those from the North and South have not changed a whole lot from the Civil War era..

      •  Of course, then the South gave him the finger (2+ / 0-)

        I prefer the malice towards none; charity for all speech. Making nice is always better when you're winning.

        •  Nice, but firm? (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          indubitably

          One of the nicest things you can do when someone is really wrong (and let's define that as talking complete nonsense that goes against their own interests) is to respectfully disagree and not coddle them too much.

          Asking difficult questions is fair game.

          What about my Daughter's future?

          by koNko on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 07:30:09 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  Too bad the South did not heed Lincoln's words (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        indubitably, gramofsam1, FloraLine

        Instead they were hunting down and terrorizing the newly free people.

        Is that really who we want as friends?

        Lovely sounding phrases should always be remembered within the context of history.

        WE NEVER FORGET Our Labor Martyrs: a project to honor the men, women and children who lost their lives in Freedom's Cause. For Nov: Voting Rights Martyrs

        by JayRaye on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:35:45 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  And for a little more historical context (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        WB Reeves, gramofsam1

        Your quote is from Lincoln's first inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861.

        The South wasn't listening. They started the Civil War the next month.

        WE NEVER FORGET Our Labor Martyrs: a project to honor the men, women and children who lost their lives in Freedom's Cause. For Nov: Voting Rights Martyrs

        by JayRaye on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:09:16 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  Why 2004 is still different (14+ / 0-)

    We were sad in 2004, and Bush-Bots certainly reveled in our disappointment, but we entered that night without any absolute certainty of Kerry's win. That election was tight, and we knew it. I think it was 2AM before Ohio, again the linchpin state, was called for Bush. I was in Copley Square waiting for Kerry, and I remember being angry that so many people affirmed a false war and a destructive economic policy, but I also remember being over it the next day, and it mobilized us for 2006.

    What message will conservatives mobilize around now?

  •  We were right in '04, they're wrong now (33+ / 0-)

    In 2004...

    We thought Bush was going to continue his onslaught against the Bill of Rights. We were right, he did. We thought he was going to continue to stack the courts with anti-choice judges. We were right, he did. We thought he would be useless in the event of a natural disaster that required governmental assistance to thousands of Americans in its aftermath. We were wrong - it was millions of Americans who went without. We thought he would continue his war against women, GLBTs, Social Security and the safety net in general. We were right, he did. We thought he would continue to allow the slide towards Gilded Age levels of inequality and just wink at the bizarre claims that anyone who tried to stop it was a communist. We were right, he did. We thought he would continue to subtly encourage the extremists of his party to question the patriotism of anyone to the left of John Ashcroft. We were right, he did.

    In 2012...

    They think Obama will bring about an economic apocalypse no matter what he does. They're wrong; he has already thwarted one and his veto may be the only thing to stop another. They think he's a socialist, a fascist, a communist, a dictator, not only a non-Christian but an anti-Christian, etc. They're wrong, though they'll never, ever see it. They think he's going to destroy the American way of life. They're wrong, he's going to continue to break down the walls of racism, sexism, homophobia, xenophobia and religious bigotry, although there's a limit to how much one person can do. They think he's going to open the floodgates of immigration and pay unregulated welfare for all immigrants. They're wrong, his policies aren't all that different from Bush's. They think he's going to force business leaders to lay off their workers with his tax increases. They're wrong, the only thing "forcing" anyone to lay anyone off is greed. They think he wants to turn the USA into Denmark. They're wrong - we should be so lucky.

    So I'm sorry, but I must disagree with your well-written diary. The only thing striking fear into those people's hearts is willful ignorance. That's the exact opposite of what had us all so depressed eight years ago.

    Certaines personnes disent qu'il y a une femme à blâmer, Mais je sais que c'est ma faute sacrément.

    by RamblinDave on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 04:41:54 AM PST

  •  Schadenfreude Buffet (16+ / 0-)

    That right there is a classic Billmon nugget!

    Having been raised in the West by a liberal mother who herself was raised by a liberal mother, who nevertheless were both steeped in the Southern Way, I believe those attitudes are not easily reconciled due to their persistence, and must agree that defeat is a proper way to view what has taken place.

    I also believe we will again taste the defeat we all felt in 2004, because of human nature's tendency to cling to bad ideas. In other words, we should not rest on laurels or gloat at that buffet, but work hard with this time we have. It won't last as long as we'd like, of that I'm fairly certain.

    “Democracy is not just the right to vote, it is the right to live in dignity.”  ― Naomi Klein

    by cosmic debris on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 04:49:54 AM PST

  •  Same as it ever was (36+ / 0-)
    "Why reasonable people go stark raving mad when anything involving a Negro comes up, is something I don’t pretend to understand."
     ~ Atticus Finch

    White-collar conservatives flashing down the street, pointing their plastic finger at me..

    by BOHICA on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 05:22:48 AM PST

    •  This brings to mind the danger of their mourning. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      a2nite, BOHICA

      Reading their messages of depression and despair for the future, and seeing all the fear and anxiety in their faces, I can't help but think that all that can easily turn into... rage.

      And I mean white-hot irrational rage of the revengeful "we've already lost, so we don't have anything to lose" variety.

      Of the hopeless, suicidal "I'm already lost, so I'm going to take out a lot of them with me" variety.

      For all the pent-up and rising (and occasionally spilling out) right-wing violence we've seen hints of for the last four years, at least they still had the restraining influence of hope that in four years Americans would come to their senses, Obama would be gone, "it" would all be over, and they would "get their country back."  

      Now they've lost that last restraining hope.  They're seeing that it's not just a case of this particular president being popular or unpopular, and that we'll all come to our senses and elect one of them again in another few years.  They are realizing that it's a case of America clearly changing and actively rejecting all that they have been hoping for.  It's a case of dawning realization that they are NEVER going to get their country "back."

      They honestly think now that over half of the American people have willfully, knowingly turned to evil -- or even, literally, to the devil.  To them, evil has WON.

      I fully expect some incidents of major right-wing violence and domestic terrorism in the near future.

  •  Fuck them!! (17+ / 0-)

    When I think about the policies these motherfucking assholes advocate, I'm VERY happy to see their sad faces.

    Fuck them all!

  •  A setback (30+ / 0-)

    Good to  have your here once again Billmon. I miss your great writing and still miss Whiskey Bar.  

    I get a few fleeting moments of sympathy as well, remembering the devastation we all felt in 2004.

    However.  Here's where it is different. The people in your video -- and it's a fine one, love the music -- are grieving the setback of white supremacy, of the angry white male patriarchy. They are not mourning the death of America. They are grieving the setback of their entitled place in America.

    You know, they have sought out the opportunity to be deluded as they are by their own media. They sit there on their couches day after day drinking in that addictive hate that Fox and Limbaugh shovel their way hour after hour day after day. They like it, they need it.

    I and my family are from the South as well. I get it. I get where they are coming from too. And you are very generous in declining to mention the deep-seated racism and the seething anger and the underlying resentment that drives these folks to seek out the venues which so profitably feed that need to be validated.

    This is a setback for what is essentially the more civilized, more entitled Ku Klux Klan dressed up, not in sheets, but in red white and blue. But it's coming from the same place.

    Geronimo has nothing to do with it.

  •  I do feel sympathy for (15+ / 0-)

    people who have been sucked in to widescale brainwashing. It's consuming people with rage and fear for the benefit of the propagandists' political goals, it's abusive, and it pisses me off, especially as it has damaged people I know. Plus, we have to live with all these damaged people around us!

    I confess to having mixed feelings viewing the tumblr, because sad humans make me sad. Can't help that, I react to the sight of sad people, whatever the cause. And, you know, I don't think they should be sad that a good president was re-elected. Not perfect, mind you, I have my gripes, but damn, it's not the end of the world, not even the end of the country.

    I also remember how 2004 felt. Man that sucked.

    Remember the "I'm sorry.com" site with people holding hand-written  messages apologizing to the rest of the world after the election? And then there was an "it's ok" site (they knew we tried) from the rest of the world responding to it? That was a kick.

  •  You're one of my favorites, billmon (14+ / 0-)

    And one reason you've always been a favorite of mine is your willingness to speak your own truths.

    I can't agree, however, and the post below that I sniped from a private forum this morning explains why:

    Here is some of the breakdown of the election

    I'm sure there have been other breakdowns, but this is the first I have seen.

    < snip >

    The significance is that the GOP appeal is counter to some key demographic trends that are taking place in America. Younger, minority, non-white groups will in the coming years become a higher percentage of the overall population as the size of the white population shrinks in comparison. In a couple of decades, whites will be a minority group, largely due to the rapid growth of the Hispanic population.

    If you looked at the makeup of audiences and participants for the two party conventions, you would have seen these demographics clearly on display. The same was true for party rallies and other events.

    Only a few years ago, a presidential candidate who garnered nearly 60 percent of the white vote — as Romney did this time — would have easily won an election. But with a shrinking white electorate, a party that cannot attract other racial and ethnic groups will find it hard to win in a “rainbow” nation, at least in a presidential election.

    < snip >
    _______
     Post subject: Re: Here is some of the breakdown of the election

    < snip >

    I see this as indication that we are going to become a socialist country regardless of what party leads the way. The have-not losers are going to take from the successful haves. The USA will get poorer and poorer and become a ghetto.

    I've long said that only property owners and stakeholders should vote. I'd bet the 47% government tit suckers voters elected Obama.

    Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

    I removed most of the postings to eliminate any identifying info and to make it easier to read.

    The bolded text, however, is specifically in response to demographic stats showing a declining white majority.

    The extent of my sympathy for them can be summed up this way: boo fucking hoo.

  •  If they hadn't insulted & taunted me so much (33+ / 0-)

    then I wouldn't take such discreet joy at their (perhaps temporary) comeuppance.

    I didn't go around for 4 years boasting to them that Obama had kicked their ass, and that Republicans would never win, blah blah blah.

    Yet my friends and coworkers and people I encountered had no restriction on mocking Obama, how stupid he was, how America wouldn't put up with his shit, etc.

    So, they can fucking eat crow for a while, and cry into their soup, and sniffle into their Teddy Bear named "Benghazi" for however many months they need.

  •  Bah your youtube made me tear up despite (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    UniC

    myself. Something about people in pain and empathy I guess. Bleah.

  •  Geronimo ????? (22+ / 0-)

    I was with you right up until you compared the political defeat of Republicans in one particular election to the wholesale slaughter of the indigenous Noth Americans whose lands we stole. Really think about it. Hard. Maybe you want to edit that line.

    •  yep, that line was way out there (11+ / 0-)

      Most of the people mourning Romney's loss have never been hungry a day in their lives, or homeless, or without medical care, or dental care, or standing in the food stamp line, or seen their little children in patched up clothes going to school. And yet they vote for someone who has put whole American towns into that kind of poverty.

      And they certainly have never seen their people massacred and then shipped away to Florida in cattle cars. Never to see their homes again.

      I suggest you save your sympathy for these folks:

      http://www.dailykos.com/...

      or for these people:

      http://www.let.rug.nl/...

      WE NEVER FORGET Our Labor Martyrs: a project to honor the men, women and children who lost their lives in Freedom's Cause. For Nov: Voting Rights Martyrs

      by JayRaye on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:48:54 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  PS and that line was why I didn't rec or tip (0+ / 0-)

        this diary.

        Even tho I have NO sympathy for those who voted for this vile candidate who ran a blatantly racist campaign, I thot the diarist made some good points and would have rec'd it were it not for equating Geronimo's terrible suffering with these spoiled and petulant people.

        That might even deserves an HR.

        WE NEVER FORGET Our Labor Martyrs: a project to honor the men, women and children who lost their lives in Freedom's Cause. For Nov: Voting Rights Martyrs

        by JayRaye on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 04:34:41 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  It will get harder to be enraged (5+ / 0-)

    when everybody has good healthcare in a year from now and the economy has strengthened considerably.

  •  Just Win, Baby (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Killer of Sacred Cows

    yksitoista ulotteinen presidentin shakki. / tappaa kaikki natsit "Nous sommes un groupuscule" (-9.50; -7.03) 政治委员, 政委‽ Warning - some snark above ‽

    by annieli on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:26:26 AM PST

  •  I've got no sympathy for them. (33+ / 0-)

    Being white is no excuse to be stupid, greedy, and mendacious.  FDR was white, Kennedy was white, Joe Biden is white, I'm white - people are people, and Romney voters are just plain defective as citizens.

    "They fear this man. They know he will see farther than they, and he will bind them with ancient logics." -The stoner guy in The Cabin in the Woods

    by Troubadour on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:26:36 AM PST

  •  Goodness, these people are such drama queens (20+ / 0-)

    That's really all I have to say and no, I don't feel sorry for them.

  •  Mourning Republicans (5+ / 0-)

    Some people feel that in the wake of our smashing victory, we ought to reach out to the other side and try to find some common ground.  The problem is that the Right is too fucking stupid--  they aren't worth the colossal investment of time it would take to change their attitudes on a variety of issues.  The racial demographics of this this country in the coming decades are terrible for the Republicans, so I think the best approach is for us to work at expanding our ranks with newly registered voters, and just make the GOP politically irrelevant.

    How can we have a third party when we don't even have a second party?

    by Eagleye on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:27:59 AM PST

  •  I still hear... (9+ / 0-)

    "Obama is a socialist and now that he is not bound by seeking reelection any more he will do things really bad for the country" and "they voted for Obama because he is going to give them things for free" -  these apparently are opinions of people who work around Wall Street, not southern, white, rural, non-college, religionists.

    I think that Obama is governing from a position that is to the right of Richard Nixon.  Therefore, where these people's angst comes from, I do not understand.  It may be the flood of bad information and commentary that is out there.

    I think we need to develop "explainers" to fill the role that Bill Clinton played in the Democratic National Convention.  

    I think that there is no need to demonize people, simply pull apart the bad information that they are exposed to; and provide them some antidote to the poisonous stuff that is broadcast.

    •  asdf (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      WB Reeves, Arun

      The thing I don't understand is why people seem to think the reason that, for example, president Obama hasn't abolished the Constitution, or started taking everyone's guns, is that he was simply waiting for his second term.  If he was really such an authoritarian wannabe-dictator, he would've started doing these things once he took office.  That way he wouldn't HAVE to worry about re-election.

  •  Most of them (except for those in constume) (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Killer of Sacred Cows, UniC

    look just like I did in 2004 when this country, much to my dismay and that of the entire world, the US reelected George W. Bush.  The only difference is that my group had a whole bunch of brown and black faces in it.

  •  I know it's unkind, but (25+ / 0-)

    about halfway through the photo compilation, I started laughing. Out loud. By the time it ended, I was guffawing. Out loud.

    I am reminded of the headline from the London paper when Junior Dubya was "elected" for the first time, in 2004, that said, "How can 59 million people be so stupid?"

    Clearly, it is imperataive that we begin at once to reform our national educational system so that people learn about government and international relations and geography and history and all those things that have such a lib'rul bias.

    Because, right now, we have a country where nearly half the population is ignorant, stupid and a danger to humankind at large.

    Good diary.

    Yesterday's weirdness is tomorrow's reason why. -- Hunter S. Thompson

    by Mnemosyne on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:31:04 AM PST

    •  I had the same reaction, Mnemosyne. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Mnemosyne, stridergambit

      And most of them look like my family!

      No, it isn't about hating them.  But they get no sympathy from me either.

      I tell my family members, "You aren't rich enuf to be Republicans." And laugh as I say it.

      They never have an answer for that.

      I give them a figurative slap upside the head and tell them to get over it.

      Nope no sympathy, none at all.

      Our loss in 2004 lead to an unnecessary war with much death and destruction. To compare what we were grieving for to what they are grieving for is a false equivalence.

      WE NEVER FORGET Our Labor Martyrs: a project to honor the men, women and children who lost their lives in Freedom's Cause. For Nov: Voting Rights Martyrs

      by JayRaye on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:21:03 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Let's pity George Zimmerman while we're at it (14+ / 0-)

    I mean hey, it's not like they're BAD people, spreading hate, lies, racism, and wishing death on others for the crime of not being like them - right?

    You don't know me, but I'm your brother. I was raised here in this living Hell - you don't know my kind in your world, but fairly soon the time will tell.

    by Fordmandalay on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:32:19 AM PST

  •  I was trying to resist any sort of gloating (23+ / 0-)

    Because I generally do try to "take the high road." (Probably to my detriment sometimes.) Then came yesterday.

    While out running errands and doing my grocery shopping, I had four scowling drivers give me a "thumbs down" to my Obama sticker (it's the only one on my car), and one guy full on screaming about "socialism" and the "end of America" out his passenger side window while we waited at a stop light. Called me a few choice names as well.

    So I decided, screw it. I already felt far less magnanimous than I did after '08, so I'm just going to let it show. By the third "thumbs down" I just pointed and laughed. I may even make myself a bumper sticker to really rub salt in their wounds. If they want to call me a communist or a n****r-lover, fine. But I'll get my shot in too.

  •  Nah Still Funny (13+ / 0-)

    I'm not going to feel any sorrier for them than the disappointed Germans when Allied tanks were running thru their country.  Those people are the worst kind of ignorant losers and their lesson in humility is well earned and desperately needed.

    Take care of all humanity as if they were your brothers and sisters.

    by skidrow on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:33:26 AM PST

  •  Wow. I hadn't seen that. (3+ / 0-)

    They really are the Mad Men party.

  •  The White House (12+ / 0-)

    "Mitt Romney and his wife have expressed relief that he did not win the election. It would have required them to move into a smaller house."

    * Jon Stewart

    How can we have a third party when we don't even have a second party?

    by Eagleye on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:34:40 AM PST

  •  Remember in November 2013 (14+ / 0-)

    We still need to take back the House.  These people gerrymandered it as much as possible.  We should start at least a year before November 2014.

    We still need to turn out the secretaries of state in Ohio and Florida and Virginia that are standing in the poll-house door.

    The next step is redirect this mighty ground game machine to the House and to State races to give our future a firm foundation for Obama and for his successor.

    Revenge? How about justice rolling down like waters, at long, long last.

    Medicare for All: the cleanest slogan and the best way forward.

    by furiouschads on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:36:01 AM PST

  •  It's a good thing I don't believe in Hell, (4+ / 0-)

    otherwise I'd be going there 'cause that video made me smile.

  •  zero sympathy (17+ / 0-)

    let them wallow in their misery

    many of them KNOW full well that their votes for Romney or politicians like Mourdock and Akin are simply endorsements of hate and intolerance.  While many on the right may truly believe in smaller government and financial conservatism - they vote for that stuff and get all the other bullshit and hate the GOP brings along.  It is that transparent.  if they truly want "old time republicanism" then nominate candidates that bring that - and not nominate candidates that need the Rush Limbaugh and Ann COulter seal of approval

    i hope the next 4 years is  4 years of misery for those - self induced misery.  for most of them - their misery would have been worse under Romney/Ryan - all externally furnished.  lets their demoralized demeanor makes them grow up (wishful thinking).

    He may talk like an idiot, and look like an idiot, but don't let that fool you: he really is an idiot...Groucho Marx

    by distributorcap on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:38:22 AM PST

  •  More to be pitied than censured? Perhaps (6+ / 0-)

    but at the same time, there's been plenty to censure.  

    I just sent an ultra righty cousin in Iowa (his FB page is full of photos of him and every republican candidate who ever stumped his town - which is all of them) a note which promised it wouldn't be as bad as he feared and made this challenge:  He should list his five greatest fears about executive action.  

    If they were all realized in the next two years, I'd make a donation to the charity of his choice (and it happens not to be one with political overtones).  Then, as I thought, I promised to make the donation if they weren't realized, too.

    If you think you're too small to be effective, you've never been in the dark with a mosquito.

    by marykk on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:38:27 AM PST

  •  Ach, to come on Kos this AM and see Billmon (9+ / 0-)

    just made the victory all the sweeter.  

    It is mourning in America for these fools, they'll cling to their gerrymandered House victories until 2022 when the demographics will be irrevocably ag'in them and the wonder how in the Hell It All Went So Wrong.

    They've learned nothing, and won't until it's too late.  All good as far as I'm concerned.

    I miss Whiskey Bar!  

    A celibate clergy is an especially good idea, because it tends to suppress any hereditary propensity toward fanaticism. -Carl Sagan

    by jo fish on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:38:27 AM PST

  •  Not me (11+ / 0-)

    I can get behind your sentiment, Billmon, but I think those folks are not nearly as forgiving and magnanimous as you are.   They were not kind to the losers in 2004 and I think many of them don't deserve our pity.

    How much of their sadness is based on delusion?  How many of them are grieving for a country that never was and if it had been would be hostile to most of the people who live there?

    I am uncomfortable with the pictures as well, but we dodged a bullet and those folks were holding the gun.

  •  I respect them as fellow humans (9+ / 0-)

    but that's all.

    These people adhere to a political ideology (and often a religious outlook) based on repression and fear.  They support a party that has systematically worked to deny women, gays, and ethnic minorities basic civil rights, drive wedges between Americans, and spread the most scurrilous lies about Obama and other Democrats, a GOP tradition dating back to the 1950's (Tricky Dick Nixon destroying the career of Helen Gahagan Douglas)

    No, I don't feel sorry for them.    If they were decent, compassionate people, they wouldn't support the GOP.

    I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones. (John Cage)

    by dotalbon on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:39:30 AM PST

  •  Perfect billmon! (4+ / 0-)

    I had a lot of the same emotions flavoring my gloating id. You captured it all, especially the slow (too slow for my taste) dawning that the old America is sliding into history and for better or worse time does march on. hu

    "The scientific nature of the ordinary man is to go on out and do the best you can." John Prine

    by high uintas on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:41:06 AM PST

    •  Every time I look at photos like these, (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      MikeyB33

      especially the older women dissolving into tears, and I feel a sudden urge to sympathize with their anger and grief, I stop and remind myself of a three-word phrase:

      Purple. Heart. Band-aids.

      And I remember the smug, malicious, ignorant smile on the woman bearing such an symbol, and what it was supposed to signify.

      Somehow my empathy goes poof! after that.

      Me, I hope their grief and pain last a loooooong time.

      They had it coming.

      "The truth will set you free...but first it'll piss you off." - Gloria Steinem

      by Sharoney on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:37:47 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  I don't hate these (those) people (12+ / 0-)

    I too, have relatives, colleagues, and friends who mourned on Tuesday.  But they need to let go of their delusions.

    I had what my daughter describes as a 'Dick and Jane' a childhood in a small Michigan town.  Loving extended family, rode my bike everywhere, penny candy at the corner store, roller skated to a public school that the community supported and paid to keep in the vanguard.  I wish every kid in the world could have those things.

    But as I grew older I began to look at to look more closely at my life compared to other people.  And I realized the cost of my life was paid for by injustice and racism.  I looked at my life and realized that it had flaws as well:  the gym teachers who abused girls for years and were never punished, the woman I worked with at the bank who was groped by the bank president on a regular basis (and was afraid to protest because she needed to feed her kids) the overt racism of the local Birchers. As a female, I ran smack into pay discrimination on the basis of gender; I sued my employer and won.

    I could have been one of 'those people' but I opened my eyes.  The world changes and if you refuse to accept that you end up bitter and frightened.  They have a choice; I hope they see that.

  •  so basically, sounds like blogger believes (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    exiledfromTN, COBALT1928, JayRaye

    a warmongering killer (george bush) and a well-meaning black man (President Obama) are pretty much the same thing? And, feels sorry for them to boot? Hum! Not feelin' it. Don't care. Don't feel sorry for them. But then again, I'm not white.

    Hopefully, the stench of the rotting carcass that is the Republican party will dissipate into the back pages of history only to be adored by fringe kooks who will shave elephants into their raggedy hair while screaming GO BACK TO AFRICA!!! and GO TO THE MAILBOX TO PICK UP YOUR WELFARE CHECK!!! at black women like Oprah, Michelle Obama and her daughters, Maxine Waters and college educated entrepreneurs like me intermittently before being forced to take their pills by their local social worker. Kinda like their counterparts in Germany circa WWII (hint).

    Check out this story in HuffPo. Gives my black self hope!

    My name is X. I'm a semi-military black woman and I voted for Barack Obama.

    by tha puddin on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:42:12 AM PST

  •  Nope. No sale. (13+ / 0-)

    To hell with them all. Venal, ignorant, hate-filled dupes and fools. I hope this sticks in their gut for years.

    If Romney won they'd be pissing on our grief.

    Fuck them.

  •  I can't help but wonder how many of those sad (9+ / 0-)

    faces from Tuesday night were part of the gloating, hyper-confident hoards that overran DC on Jan 20, 2001, proud that they had  just stolen an election and got away with it and eager to rule as if they had just won in a landslide.

  •  I hopes this leads (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    COBALT1928

    ...to an inescapable conclusion by the Republican Party: They have a damaged brand, associated with a damaged ideology. It's as obsolete as the Whigs.

    If it were a business (and who's to say it isn't) the best thing to do would be to close up shop and liquidate the remaining assets.

    As to a replacement, who says we need to replace it with anything?

    "If you are still playing for Team Republican and want to have any honor whatsoever, you need to leave the Republican Party now, apologize to America, and work to remove it from our political system." - Brad DeLong

    by radabush on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:43:00 AM PST

  •  That's how many Progressives felt in 2004... (6+ / 0-)

    We had decided Bush/Cheney/Rove etc were the essence of all that was wrong for America. We used terms such as 'end of an era', or 'death of democracy'.

    I remember attending a town hall in a local Progressive church the Saturday after the election. A big group of us commiserated and pathetically tried to strategize to 'take back America'. Or at least endure the situation.

    The point: In 2006 we (or at least Dems) had record gains in Congress.  

    Next point: They (the Repugs) could again have record gains in 2014.

    Stay on point, don't lapse into indifference post-election.

  •  I get sick and offended on this site.... (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Aunt Pat, Kansas Born, niemann

    ....when people rail against "Old white males". Seriously? You don't see the racism there. I am an older, mostly white male (I don't look it, but that's another story -- Native Am). But I have a LOT of older white male friends. Not all of them are Republicans. The reverse racism on this site  can be disturbing.

    It is not okay to sneer about older white males here.

    If you hate government, don't run for office in that government.

    by Bensdad on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:43:24 AM PST

    •  yes it is until government represents population (0+ / 0-)

      yksitoista ulotteinen presidentin shakki. / tappaa kaikki natsit "Nous sommes un groupuscule" (-9.50; -7.03) 政治委员, 政委‽ Warning - some snark above ‽

      by annieli on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:11:25 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Can't agree (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      socindemsclothing

      I've lived all of my adult life ashamed to admit where I was born and raised (Alabama) and now I'm part of the age group that most heavily voted for Romney (they, especially, have no f'ing excuse).  Instead of taking the stereotyping  personally, I view itas giving me far better standing to criticize those two groups - and I'm not offended in the least to hear them criticized because I agree with virtually every word.  

      Don't take it personally, Bensdad.  I suspect you live your life in such a way that people know you're the exception to the stereotype.  We "exceptions" are all that keep many of us from completely despairing about these demographics.

      To stand in silence when they should be protesting makes cowards out of men. -Abraham Lincoln

      by Eyesbright on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 02:07:43 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  THEY will lose if Romney wins (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    COBALT1928, UniC, jds1978, niemann

    They just don't seem to understand that they are being played for fools. It makes all the more humiliating.

    Conservatism = greed, hate, fear and ignorance

    by Joe B on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:44:04 AM PST

  •  Red America has always held itself up (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    exiledfromTN, UniC

    as a paragon of mainstream, normal, common-sense, and above all thought of itself as the majority.

    First off, anyone who thinks of himself or herself as "normal", is someone who deserves to be knocked down a peg or two, just on general principle. If there's one thing I have learned in my 50 years on this planet, it's that there are no normal people.

    Secondly, the fact is if Romney had managed somehow to win the election, these are the same people who would be preparing to march over the corpses of the opposition, triumphantly, and there would be no reflection about "empathy" anywhere... it's hard for me to cry genuine tears about their loss.

    That being said, it's not in Democrats' natures to rub peoples' noses in their defeats, especially not Republicans, because they thrive on the perception that they are always being ridiculed, ever since the 1960s, and earlier.

    Let's not give them more grist for their mills.

    "The press just doesn’t know how to handle flat-out untruths," ~Paul Krugman

    by Nimbus on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:44:16 AM PST

  •  Great, Billmon, just great (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Randy, Sharoney

    You did a fine job with the Randy Newman tune. Esp like the sync'd lyrics with "the fat man".

    Resist much, obey little. ~~Edward Abbey, via Walt Whitman

    by willyr on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:44:21 AM PST

  •  Yes, I feel compassion for (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Aunt Pat, rhauenstein

    defeated Republicans, too. I remember how I felt in November and December, 2004. Feeling the grief and dashed hopes of my redneck family members today isn't difficult.

    As you point out, they are not merely grieving the outcome of the presidential election. They are mourning the passing of a whole era. As you point out, too, a whole industry has thrived by deluding them. Maybe this has extended even to RW pollsters and various talking heads on the RW payroll before the defeat.

    Despite their best efforts they were defeated, resoundingly. These days, when Dems suffer a setback or defeat (and the failed Wisconsin recall from last summer comes to mind), we look forward. We grieve, but we eventually want to come to understand our mistakes, and to see a way forward. The Republicans, they realize the best is probably behind them. They've enjoyed quite a run. Now all they can do is look back.

    It's here they got the range/ and the machinery for change/ and it's here they got the spiritual thirst. --Leonard Cohen

    by karmsy on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:45:21 AM PST

  •  I don't see these people as hurting (8+ / 0-)

    They are sad, weepy and  whining because they didn't get their way.  That's all.  Any suffering  they have going  is of their own doing.

    These are supposedly ADULTS, not little five-year-olds that were told there is no Santa Claus.

    No sympathy.  You don't have to gloat over them, but no sympathy.

    I'm not crazy, I've just been in a very bad mood for 40 years!

    by liberalagogo on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:45:40 AM PST

  •  Chris Hayes spoke eloquently on this yesterday (15+ / 0-)

    On his show UP. Well worth watching.

    He made the point that the Republicans are being ill-served by Fox, Limbaugh and the rest of the right-wing media. By pandering to white resentment, they are insuring the electoral decline of the party.

    Money quote: "The beating heart of modern conservatism is its visceral appeal to anxieties and fears of white Christians."

    And: "the Republican Party's problems are deeper than, say, opposition to comprehensive immigration reform, or even the far less controversial DREAM Act. That policy opposition is a symptom of the problem, not the cause. The deeper issue is that for conservative politicians, and conservative networks, and conservative websites, there is simply too much to be gained by feeding the sense of persecution and siege that many white Christians feel down to their toes. "

    And: "the only way our politics avoids the increasingly ugly spectacle of a revanchist party attempting desperately to strengthen its appeal to a shrinking pool of white voters, is if the movement's leaders show some genuine leadership and stop cultivating their base's worst instincts."

    Powerful stuff.

    What is valued is practiced. What is not valued is not practiced. -- Plato

    by RobLewis on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:45:59 AM PST

  •  Empathy is the hallmark of the better person. (5+ / 0-)

    I, however, am not that person.

    Fuck them, and everyone who thinks like them.

    The real enemy of the good is not the perfect, but the mediocre.

    by Orange County Liberal on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:46:17 AM PST

  •  I agree with you: It's why we're us (3+ / 0-)

    The us that we are -- the segment within the Democratic Party that is motivated by compassion, empathy, and the desire to see peace over conflict -- cannot even gloat over the misery of the miserable. For the Christians among us, and especially those who are progressives because of their faith, we are compelled by Jesus Christ to love our enemies.

    I know how wickedly these people would behave toward us, because they did in 2010. More importantly, Bush's claim in 2004 that he had "political capital" and he was "gonna spend it" by partisan measures is seared into memory.

    I'm still who I am, though, and I won't become them.

    If money is the root of all evil, then what is Mitt Romney?

    by The Geogre on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:47:15 AM PST

  •  I was kind of with you (11+ / 0-)

    until I watched the video.  Then I just got disgusted.

    Sure, these people have been duped and lied to, but they choose to believe it.  They choose to insulate themselves in their Fox bubble.  They choose not to ask questions when something patently doesn't make sense, or see Romney on tape saying one thing one week and the exact opposite the next.

    Their racism and hatred of the other blinds them to reality, and it is hurting our country.

    I don't wish them ill, but I certainly don't mind exercising some tough love.  Once we have same sex marriage and Obamacare, and they realize that they weren't raptured up, Iran doesn't nuke us, and the economy fully recovers, it's going to be a lot harder for them to peddle their lies.

    Suck it up.  It gets better.

    "Mediocrity cannot know excellence." -- Sherlock Holmes

    by La Gitane on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:47:38 AM PST

  •  And, who do those sickos think they are (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    COBALT1928, UniC

    calling Obama's coalition stupid? I mean really. They're a despicable lot!

    My name is X. I'm a semi-military black woman and I voted for Barack Obama.

    by tha puddin on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:48:05 AM PST

  •  I consider them Darwin Award nominees (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Eyesbright

    NOW SHOWING
    Progressive Candidate Obama (now - Nov 6, 2012)
    Bipartisan Obama returns (Nov 7, 2012)

    by The Dead Man on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:48:09 AM PST

  •  I see a lot of folks wrapped in American flags (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    GTPinNJ, UniC, Eyesbright

    They sure seem to love the trappings of patriotism. I wonder if they understand what it means.

    I feel sorry for the kids in the video, it's like mom and dad coming home and telling them they've lost a job, will have to move out of the house into a trailer park, and start feeding them rice and beans. The kids grieve, legitimately, for the awful news, but it's a lie. Mom and dad are lying to them. To themselves, as well, but don't they have a larger responsibility to their own kids? It's cruel, that's all.

    "The problems of incompetent, corrupt, corporatist government are incompetence, corruption and corporatism, not government." Jerome a Paris

    by Orinoco on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:48:13 AM PST

  •  Still Guzzling Republican Tears: (15+ / 0-)

    No, the level of vitriol and disrespect for President Obama from these entitled ignoramuses leaves me bereft of any sympathy whatsoever.

    "We have facts on our side. They have propaganda on their side."

    by rlharry on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:49:00 AM PST

  •  Billmon, I have also been a fan (10+ / 0-)

    Of yours for several years. However, I only made it halfway through the video. I cannot feel sympathy for people who quite obviously, despite real-time evidence of Romney lying through his teeth, decided that he was the candidate for them.

    They can protest all they want, but they hate Obama because he is black. I am a white woman from the south who moved away from the south (hence my handle) and managed to not become a hateful bigot. If I could do it, so could they, so no sympathy from me.

    One last thing: I had to put just about all my online associates on ice for a week because they simply do not know how to act. I was insulted on FB (not directly, I suppose, but certainly passively) for voting for Obama. So I told all them to fuck off until they calmed down.

    Ironically, the WORST offenders emailed me to tell me they hoped I was ok! I'm thinking, "you moron, YOU were the one hurling the insults and you STILL can't figure out why I am upset."

    So, IMO, not only do they hate, fail to understand, don't WANT to understand, but they also have no desire to understand who it is that they are hurting, and it ain't just the mythical welfare queen (I feel dirty just typing that.) It's me, someone they claim to respect, and perhaps most stupidly, they hurt themselves.

    No sympathy.

  •  President Obama (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Gay In Maine, UniC, tha puddin, JayRaye

    Understands the importance of making all Americans feel a part of the community. He will speak in a way that reaches out to the people Billmon's talking about. He did it on Election night. He's been reaching out to these "culturally anxious whites" (as I've written

    •  Sorry, hit wrong button-comment continued (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Kansas Born, Gay In Maine, JayRaye

      President Obama understands the importance of making all Americans feel a part of the community. He will speak in a way that reaches out to the people Billmon's talking about, as he did on Election night, and he'll keep reaching out to members of non-white communities as well. He's been reaching out to these "culturally anxious whites" (as I've written about) for years. He'll keep doing it. And that's to the good of our country. "Those people" are part of our American family, and we need to see them as such, just as they need to do the same in our direction. That is an incredibly hard task, and Obama is exactly the right President to lead us toward achieving it.

  •  I disagree that they are not going to have a (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Scott Wooledge, Kansas Born, UniC

    president that they want ever again.  What if Romney had never said let Detroit Go Bankrupt, what if the 47% video never was found, and what if Romney had shouted down Akin and others like him?  Well it just might be President elect Romney right now.  

    Will the black voters come out in force for to elect a white women or man for president?

    I think education is what we must do and reach out to sane republicans.

  •  Actually, I totally hadn't... (24+ / 0-)
    By now, most of you have probably seen the Tumblr page entirely dedicated to pictures of white people mourning the Republican defeat last Tuesday.
    I had seen this.

    Photobucket

    Supporter: "Senator, you have the vote of every thinking person!" Adlai Stevenson: "That's not enough, madam, we need a majority!"

    by Scott Wooledge on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:51:22 AM PST

    •  I hadn't seen this yet. Nice! (6+ / 0-)

      I'm seeking to organize DKos members in SE Michigan--roughly, from the Ohio line at Lake Erie NE to Port Huron, W to Flint and back S from there. If you'd like to join our new group, Motor City Kossacks (working title), please Kosmail me.

      by peregrine kate on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:52:15 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I alternate between (12+ / 0-)

        disgust, schadenfreude, and pity at their teeth gnashing and garment rending.

        Mostly I wish they'd just STFU and move on with it.

        I did have a fairly deep thought on what separates me, an unthreatened white guy, from say, Bill O'Reilly, a white guy in meltdown.

        I do not ASSUME the black people, women and Latinos who are ascending to power do not have MY best interests at heart. From Obama on down, yes, I trust that the choices they make will not disadvantage me, at least not because of my race. I think that's insane.

        Bill and that crowd absolutely do. And that's probably again, projection at work. They know that the white straight males they hang out with don't give a shit about minorities. So they assume minorities will behave the same apathy and lack of empathy.

        Supporter: "Senator, you have the vote of every thinking person!" Adlai Stevenson: "That's not enough, madam, we need a majority!"

        by Scott Wooledge on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:59:27 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  I don't feel much pity. They aren't obliged (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          COBALT1928, Scott Wooledge

          to choose to emphasize their racial identity, nor then to feel somehow aggrieved that white domination of U.S. politics is more and more challenged every year. We have a long way to go to dismantle the infrastructure of white racism, and in the meantime these folks will still be gaining the unfair benefits they have accrued from it. And I say this as a middle-aged white woman who has absolutely had white skin privilege to insulate me from most socioeconomic challenges that people of color have to face regularly.

          I agree about the projection, except that I think that O'Reilly et al. are far more fearful of being treated with hostility and revenge than they are of possible apathy and lack of empathy.  (Just to be very clear, that trope of the vengeful black person seeking to turn the tables is both very racist and also an indication of how much white people who fear getting their comeuppance do, on some level, understand the severity of the harms that have been perpetrated against black people in this country.) If apathy were the worst that people of color and white women had to face....

          I'm seeking to organize DKos members in SE Michigan--roughly, from the Ohio line at Lake Erie NE to Port Huron, W to Flint and back S from there. If you'd like to join our new group, Motor City Kossacks (working title), please Kosmail me.

          by peregrine kate on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:14:44 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Yeah, you're probably right (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            peregrine kate

            the only way to avert vengeance is to continue oppression.

            It doesn't occur to them vengeance may not actually be the agenda. Which I am sure it isn't for the overwhelming majority.

            Supporter: "Senator, you have the vote of every thinking person!" Adlai Stevenson: "That's not enough, madam, we need a majority!"

            by Scott Wooledge on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:24:17 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  Lack of need for revenge I can empathize with (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            peregrine kate

            as a gay American who has made peace there will never be restitution for the LGBT lives and careers destroyed by gov't witch hunts in the military, state dept and elsewhere.

            Course correction for the future with have to suffice.

            Supporter: "Senator, you have the vote of every thinking person!" Adlai Stevenson: "That's not enough, madam, we need a majority!"

            by Scott Wooledge on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:27:59 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Right. It's pointless in the end, b/c can't regain (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Scott Wooledge

              what was lost. Still painful to have to absorb that reality sometimes. I wish there were genuine means of gaining restitution, but perhaps the method of Truth and Reconciliation, as was implemented in S. Africa by Bishop Tutu and other wise and humane people, is really the only way to go. (I hasten to add--not that there isn't still injustice in S. Africa. But perhaps not as relentlessly cyclical as it might have been without that effort.)

              I'm seeking to organize DKos members in SE Michigan--roughly, from the Ohio line at Lake Erie NE to Port Huron, W to Flint and back S from there. If you'd like to join our new group, Motor City Kossacks (working title), please Kosmail me.

              by peregrine kate on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:37:54 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

  •  I am impressed that you (9+ / 0-)

    got the lyric:  "little fat man with a note pad in his hand" over a shot of Rove on Fox News Tuesday.

  •  Why I Feel Empathy (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    General Hubbub

    Thank you for putting this together.

    I'm surprised by the heartlessness of some of the comments on here, to be honest.  "Fuck Them"?  "Nope, No Sympathy Here"?  I think some people are missing the point - it's a reminder that while we are on different sides of the political spectrum, they are human beings with emotions.

    I'm particularly surprised by the attempts to put thoughts into the minds of these particular individuals, such as they are all mourning the death of white supremacy, etc.  Are some of them?  Yeah, probably.  But some of them may just be lifelong Republicans that do their best to volunteer when they can and write a $50 check if they can.

    When you give of yourself, your time and your money, in politics, you are bound to become emotional on election night.

    I've worked as a paid staffmember for Democrats, mostly Congressional candidates, since 1997.  I have had volunteers in our offices that think they understand politics and "the issues" when in reality they have no clue as to the specific race.  I hate to say it, but many of the comments on here so far sound much like some of these volunteers.  Sweeping generalizations, a refusal to see another view - even one that isn't bringing into question strongly held world views, and a tendency to handpick past wrongs to justify it all.

    Why do I feel empathy?  Because I have worked in politics for so long.  I still remember my first election night as a staffmember - November of 1998.  I was working for Christine Kehoe for Congress in San Diego, a lesbian city councilwoman who was challenging a 2 term incumbent.   We lost by just over 4,000 votes in what turned out to be the closest Congressional race in that cycle.  I had given all I had to give, often working 18 hour days.  While I "knew" we probably would not win, I and many others believed - maybe had to believe to keep going - that we might, just might, pull it off.  And the closer you get to election day, the more you "drink the kool-aid" as they say.

    When the finality comes on election day, you are physically and mentally drained, and your emotions are raw.  I see in your video the same thing.  I hope that others see the humanity beyond the politics in this.

    "You must do the thing that you think you cannot do" - Eleanor Roosevelt

    by Gay In Maine on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:52:03 AM PST

    •  Well, Karen Hughes, unquestionably a (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      COBALT1928

      life long Republican ain't crying!

      My name is X. I'm a semi-military black woman and I voted for Barack Obama.

      by tha puddin on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:55:52 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Karen Hughes (0+ / 0-)

        Is a political professional that has been around for a very long time.

        If I go back to what I said before and jump ahead 14 years, I have grown a lot as well.  This cycle I worked for Val Demings for Congress in Florida 10.  We lost 52-48.  Yet I was not an emotional mess on election night.  Why?  Because I'm senior staff now.  I've worked 8 election cycles.  I had a responsibility to the campaign and candidate to keep perspective.  Karen Hughes is looking at the bigger picture as she should.

        On the other hand, two of my staffmembers were on their first race.  Election night was not easy for them and there were many tears shed and unexplainable emotions.

        I don't have sympathy for the Romney staffers that were so shocked in Boston.  They should have know better if they've been around at all.  But for the volunteers and field staffers on their first race?  Yeah, I get it.

        "You must do the thing that you think you cannot do" - Eleanor Roosevelt

        by Gay In Maine on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:34:35 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  They deserve their despair. (3+ / 0-)

      It's scant enough punishment for their fight to make things worse for the country.

  •  Good riddance! (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    COBALT1928

    "Their America -- Bill O'Reilly's "traditional America" -- is fading away. Whatever the future holds, it's not likely to look like them, or think like them, or live like them"

    That is the point. The sorrow on their faces is not worthy of sympathy, much less acknowledgement.  I hope some of (our) those people decide to learn and respect true facts. Turn off Fox News FOREVER! They choose ignorance. They choose to deny reality. They are dangerous.

    The world is a big place with a lot of different people. People that look different. People that worship differently, or choose not to worship. The facts are not different. We are a better nation and world when we respect each other. When we work toward common goals together. When science is not ignored. Climate change is real.

    Brainwashed Tea Party Fox News Zombies are not needed in the real, modern world. Maybe when taxes go up for O'Reilly he will create a new nation with these puppets. O'Reilly Utopia. That utopia better not count on tourist revenue or clean water.

  •  just as clueless, dashes writer's credibility (5+ / 0-)

    "And in a way I can't quite explain, that fact lends a measure of dignity to their grief -- to the point where their faces almost begin to resemble old photos of Geronimo in captivity, his sad eyes looking past the camera to a vanished world that no white man can conquer."

    Obama didn't murder anybody. All he did was ask people to vote for him. It was totally optional and people made a choice. How's that the same thing as watching your whole family get slaughtered??????????

    My name is X. I'm a semi-military black woman and I voted for Barack Obama.

    by tha puddin on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:53:15 AM PST

  •  why i have no compassion (6+ / 0-)

    for the romney supporters, they don't look like america, act like america, care about america, practice the american creed, at least the america i know and fought for, which treats all americans with respect and  compassion, you can already hear the hate and anger those romney supporters are screaming at the obama supporters and obama himself, let them stew in their own juice, the same juice they will be yelling at the opposition for the foreseeable future.

    the obama admin & supporters will give them the respect they deserve because they are americans, and i can guarantee you thats a hell of a lot more then they would have given if victorious, sympathy, they don't even know what the word means unless you are of the same narrow minded ilk.

  •  I love the comment (5+ / 0-)

    from one of these pathetic weepers to the effect that Obama is a clelebrity President. What was Saint Reagan?

    No, these people can't eat enough humble pie.

    All those multi millionaires who threaten to quite working on "building it" should take their marbles and go home. There are plenty of talented people who will "build it" and take home $500,000 after they pay a higher tax. They did it before and will do it again.

    “The quality of owning freezes you forever in "I," and cuts you off forever from the "we.” ― John Steinbeck, The Grapes of Wrath

    by Miss Pip on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:54:18 AM PST

  •  Hear hear (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Gay In Maine

    It's easy to laugh at them for seeing this election result as the "end of America", as if it will ruin their lives forever…and yet if the result had been reversed, I would have felt exactly the same way.  Our positions are widely disparate but the emotions are the same.  What are the racists and the homophobes afraid of, after all, but that everything they are comfortable with and love will disappear, and they will end up living in a world that they don't understand, with no familiar touchstones?  Maybe they're afraid that they will be treated like second-class citizens the way minorities are now…well, who wouldn't be afraid of that?  I certainly would be.  Heck, the religious folks are probably afraid that their family and friends will be tempted by the "evils" of new America, and will spend all eternity in Hell because of it.  If I believed that, I would be scared for my family too.

    Fear isn't an adequate excuse: everyone is expected to face their fears to do what is right.  But I have sympathy for them, regardless.  I hope that the next four years brings unbridled prosperity for America, and that they will see it and think "Hey, maybe this wasn't so bad as we thought." I wish them peace.

  •  The concept that "their" Media Machine (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    COBALT1928, Sychotic1, Eric Nelson

    has been lying to "them" for a long, long time isn't going to register completely but even the most propagandized can't avoid some small smidge of reality chipping away at "their" psyche.

    I also know that they have been lied to, with ferocious intensity and relentless dedication, by the conservative propaganda machine and its political masters. If we must have demons to hate, better to seek them among the con artists who have turned Rwandan-style hate speech into an industry profitable enough to rival the porn business.

    When someone is impatient and says, "I haven't got all day," I always wonder, How can that be? How can you not have all day? George Carlin

    by msmacgyver on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:54:25 AM PST

    •  This is the crux of the problem: (7+ / 0-)
      the con artists who have turned Rwandan-style hate speech into an industry profitable enough to rival the porn business
      It's a very profitable business model (ask Karl Rove) to stoke hatred of the "other", and more importantly, to faux justify the hatred in order to keep the cash registers ringing.

      However, those who buy the snake oil must, at some level, also be held accountable for enabling the snake oil salesmen.  If there was no one to buy the flawed product, selling it wouldn't be a profitable enterprise.

      •  Oh, no question that those who want and (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        annieli

        need a "fix" of vitriol any hour of the day or night can have it--free of charge.

        I've contended for a long time that the RW Noise Machine is addictive.  RW messaging is built around the same concept as soap opera staging.  There are plots and sub-plots and arcs of stories, i.e. ACORN, etc.

        FoxNoise specifically is propaganda and subliminal suggestion all tied up in exciting entertainment.  

        When someone is impatient and says, "I haven't got all day," I always wonder, How can that be? How can you not have all day? George Carlin

        by msmacgyver on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:15:21 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  This may seem trite, but..Germany 1933. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    UniC

    "It's devastating to believe that your country has looked evil full in the face and decided to embrace it, and feel completely helpless to stop it."

    "I also know that they have been lied to, with ferocious intensity and relentless dedication, by the conservative propaganda machine and its political masters. If we must have demons to hate, better to seek them among the con artists who have turned Rwandan-style hate speech into an industry profitable enough to rival the porn business."

    I am certainly not equating Republicanism to Nazism, but, as they like to preach, there has to be acceptance of responsibility in all people in all times. It's what they wanted that counts above all else.
    If, as you said, we must have demons to hate, in my mind it is better to seek them in the hearts and minds of men and women.  Only in that fertile ground will propoganda such as the Right's take hold.

    Fuck Big Brother...from now on, WE'RE watching.

    by franklyn on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:54:25 AM PST

  •  What are we really (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    UniC, Dixiedemocrat

    supposed to do with such people?  What is a rational response to those who try to strip you of your civil rights, and want to deny all but the wealthiest the essentials?  

    It's not unreasonable to respond to them as enemies.  

    "until the philosophy which holds one race superior
    and another inferior
    is finally
    and permanently
    discredited
    and abandoned
    everywhere is war...."

    Justice For Will Will spent his brief, courageous life fighting for the rights we all take for granted. Please share his story to support the fight!

    by KibbutzAmiad on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:55:15 AM PST

  •  Enough mourning and gloating... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    UniC

    There is a country to govern and decisions to make.

    It has been five days now. Lets move on.

    I have never been able to figure out if Fox is the propaganda arm of the Republican party or is the Republican Party the political subsidiary of Fox.

    by Dave from Oregon on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:55:22 AM PST

  •  No sympathy (6+ / 0-)

    While I understand the beautiful feelings behind this piece, there is no one in that video who resembles anyone in my world, especially my Jewish one. No black people, no Latinos, nothing I see that resembles anything other than the mourning of a way of life, where people perceived everything to be so simple, before we elected an African-American to the White House. But these red-staters to me are leeches -- they soak up a disproportionate amount of federal dollars and scorn at the vibrancy of cities. They will always seek someone to blame, refusing to take responsibility for their place in a changing world.

    Life is a shipwreck. But we must not forget to sing in the lifeboats. — Voltaire

    by agrenadier on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:55:25 AM PST

  •  I'm still with whoever said the other day... (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    annieli, agrenadier, COBALT1928, Sychotic1

    ...that he wanted to make lube with their tears.

    You know, I sometimes think if I could see, I'd be kicking a lot of ass. -Stevie Wonder at the Glastonbury Festival, 2010

    by Rich in PA on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:55:33 AM PST

    •  unfortunately tear lube can always become Santorum (0+ / 0-)

      Santorum/Ryan in 2016: Young Sticky Guns

      yksitoista ulotteinen presidentin shakki. / tappaa kaikki natsit "Nous sommes un groupuscule" (-9.50; -7.03) 政治委员, 政委‽ Warning - some snark above ‽

      by annieli on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:59:58 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  that's like feeling sorry for an armed robber (6+ / 0-)

    who bungled his crime and was tackled before pulling the trigger aimed at the hostages.  poor guy, hands behind your head.  it's enough that we would pursue humane justice instead of doing to him what he would've done to us.

  •  . (5+ / 0-)

    "It strikes me as gruesome and comical that in our culture we have an expectation that a man can always solve his problems" - Kurt Vonnegut

    by jazzence on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:56:30 AM PST

  •  Dear billmon, how you remember them is not (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    COBALT1928, Ishmaelbychoice, UniC, Matt Z

    how they are.  I am beginning to wonder if they ever were.  I can remember the hate on the farm 50 miles from anything.  I was told a black person might have touched the TP so I need to throw away the outer paper.  Because they never touched the Sears catalog which was also there for emergencies.  I mean really, think about it auntie.

    There are good people in there somewhere.  But they need to find it, we can't find it for them.  And, they are only beginning to realize they buried the good a long time ago.

    Hey, GOP - Get In, Sit Down, Shut up, & Hang On!

    by 88kathy on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:56:31 AM PST

  •  I have no sympathy for irrational people (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Anak, COBALT1928, UniC, tha puddin, Matt Z

    They look sad that they are not going to get their policies implemented to benefit the few at their expense.  Um .. no, not feeling any emotion for them.

  •  I feel more empathy for revolutionary socialists.. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    UniC

    ...like Enver Hoxha, who killed and oppressed in the name of ending class rule, that I do for these folks, who (at least in our country, at least recently) haven't killed and haven't even particularly oppressed, in the name of reinforcing class rule.  This probably speaks to some deep depravity in me, but that's probably not the stuff of diaries, at least not front page ones.

    You know, I sometimes think if I could see, I'd be kicking a lot of ass. -Stevie Wonder at the Glastonbury Festival, 2010

    by Rich in PA on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:57:48 AM PST

  •  Tips for sneaking the photoshop of Stefon... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    annieli, jck

    ...into the montage. Well played.

    Connecticut, Iowa, Maine, Maryland, Massachusets, New Hampshire, New York, Vermont, Washington, Washington D.C. and California (pending)

    by cooper888 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:58:10 AM PST

  •  Some small percentage (0+ / 0-)

    of the people in these pictures is going to realize they were lied to. Now is the optimal time to break through the wall they've built, protecting themselves from the facts - while they are still questioning the party line.  But if we're denigrating them at every turn, that won't happen. We just look like a bunch of jerks.

  •  Republican tears are delicious & nutritious, so I (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    annieli, COBALT1928, UniC, vicki

    was not planning to stop dinning on them any time soon. It is not so much that I want to mean. That actually goes against my instincts. But, like you say, the majority must rule and the vanquished will end up grinding their teeth (or fangs as the case may be).

    However, the bigger issue for me is that I think we have to avoid feeling guilty and acting like we need to ask for reconciliation. If they want reconciliation (which I strongly suspect many of them do not), I think they should ask for it...and do it nicely, if they still know how. Instead, I hear them saying that Obama doesn't really have a mandate, he didn't win by enough, we're "evenly divided," and that Obama had better reach out to the other side and do it pronto. The most asinine thing I have heard is, no surprise, from Charles Krauthammer, who said that Obama should offer Romney a cabinet position, like Treasury Secretary. This isn't just idiotic in the sense that freshmen PoliSci students know more about politics than Krauthammer, but it's galling just in terms of the arrogant sense of entitlement that these a-holes have that even when they lose, they think you owe them an apology.

    So, my bottom line is that reconciliation is earned, not granted; it is asked for, not demanded; and it should be predicated on not doing the exact same thing one minute later. Let's remember that the core Republican message has long been and still is about fear and hate: Calling Obama, and by extension all of his supporters Socialists (as if that's a bad thing); calling us un-American; saying we want death panels if we believe in Obamacare; saying we are murders if we believe someone should choose whether to carry a zygote to term or not; and hatred for gays, secularists, atheists, scientists, intellectuals, city dwellers, and anything else they can tar with the hated word "Liberal." So, I would like to see evidence that the hate and shrill rhetoric will change. Then, I'm all for having a civil conversation.

    Just doing my part to piss off right wing nuts, one smart ass comment at a time.

    by tekno2600 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:58:54 AM PST

  •  Thanks you so much for this post. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    annieli, jck, Ishmaelbychoice

    Especially White People Mourning Romney LINK

    Thank all that is good Romney lost this election... We were saved from the plutocrats and the crazies even if it is for a little while. Let us hope the sad white faces will someday learn that there is no room for Bigotry in a Democracy and realize that this Bigotry, they hold so dear, will be the ruin of our nation. This Thom Hartman video about what is happening in Greece speaks volumes of how close we got to it happening here if Romney had won.

    Then watch Rachael Maddow tell us we do not have to fear the indignation of a Romney win, any longer. WHEW!

    No More Fear, Obama Has Won Election 2012! from thinkingblue on Vimeo.

    A search for truth will find injustice!

    by thinkingblue on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 10:59:38 AM PST

  •  What the hell are we supposed to do, ya moron? (0+ / 0-)

    What? Over? Did you say "over"? Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!

    So very hard to feel sorry for these folk. After all, its looks like there was plenty of cake and other goodies to go around.

    What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof. - C. Hitchens

    by sizzzzlerz on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:03:46 AM PST

  •  Well said, billmon. No bile, or hate. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    UniC

    That's half the Country, at least for now.  We can't ignore them.   This was a good start, showing some human faces.  

    Also, in that last frame, the flag was at half staff.  They haven't struck their colors yet.   Maybe it's time to fight less, and cooperate more.  Call me a crazy optimist, but I think the fact that things ain't changing until the mid-term, combined with the state of the Nation, will cause us to see some cooperation in Washington - to break the gridlock.   A Great Compromise, if you, without which things can only get worse.  

    Intolerance betrays want of faith in one's cause. - Gandhi

    by SpamNunn on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:03:53 AM PST

  •  Remember when Dems fired employees after Bush won (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    COBALT1928, UniC

    Oops.

    "It strikes me as gruesome and comical that in our culture we have an expectation that a man can always solve his problems" - Kurt Vonnegut

    by jazzence on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:04:02 AM PST

  •  Chris Hayes showed the guy on U-Tube (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    annieli, COBALT1928

    From the Heritage Foundation, talking about the usually post=mortem Obama insanity.  The guy was all wide eyed, did not blink and looked like the crazy person from the movie, "The Manchurian Candidate",

  •  Very toughtful diary (0+ / 0-)

    I'll look for this author in the future.

  •  I have no empathy for people who have enabled... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Anak, COBALT1928

    Incompetent leadership:1-Bush,house repugs,2-Failed foreign policy,9-11,yes i blame W ,Iraq, Afganistan,3-Propaganda Networks FOX. I have tried numerous times over the years to explain facts to these RWers for example the debt.... They all refuse to acknowledge the truth, facts....Maybe that will change ?????

    America, We blow stuff up!!

    by IndyinDelaware on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:06:01 AM PST

  •  This diary is a product of a bad memory (6+ / 0-)

    We were in two wars and a global financial crisis when Obama took office.  The first instinct of Republicans was not to help in any way but to have a big meeting and pledge to make denying Obama a second term their supreme goal.

    My first instincts of sympathy are reserved for the millions of Americans who suffered more than they needed to because a group of rich white men want to continue to lord it over the rest of us.  The party these people stand with are the ones that led the charge into Iraq.  They have a lot of blood on their hands and there has never been an acknowledgment or recognition of that tragic error of judgment.

    I can understand the loss that the people on that Tumblr page are feeling.  But I can never forget the harm their greed, ignorance and outright racism caused to millions in this country.  I can never forget the words their candidate uttered in a private moment about his CT laced foolishness and disrespect for the retired and the working poor.

    I DO hope some of them wake up.  I'm open to talking with them.  But they have to take responsibility for their own education - we can't do it for them.  Any that want to kling to Fox and want to disrespect people of color:  to hell with them!

    And finally, this use of Geronimo, is about the most foolish, disrespectful and obtuse thing I've seen written in a front page diary.  To compare a host of  eluded white people of a privileged class to a leader of a people that was hunted down in an operation arguably based on genocide..

    It made me want to puke.  Seriously, fuck you for that.

    I'm not liberal. I'm actually just anti-evil, OK? - Elon James White

    by Satya1 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:06:17 AM PST

    •  I don't understand why anybody would recomend this (0+ / 0-)

      particular rant.  Interesting that someone can write 5 paragraphs but can't read.

      •  billmon "talks" about some of the evil of the (0+ / 0-)

        right, but it is still mostly a gloss.  They left a huge path of death and destruction in the US and elsewhere AND THEY ARE STILL IN COMPLETE DENIAL ABOUT IT.

        Are they capable of feeling sad, of experiencing loss?  Are they still part of us?  Of course they are.  And we can understand how they feel.  And for better or worse there will be  dialogs of sorts.

        But we must never forget what these racist, ignorant warmongers have done.  We must never gloss or minimize it.

        In the end billmon shows his feelings by using the image of Geronimo by comparison.  That is WAY too much weak minded sympathy to give these fools.

        So again for those of you solid lefties and compassionate liberals who DON'T GET that bit about Geronimo, fuck you too.

        I'm not liberal. I'm actually just anti-evil, OK? - Elon James White

        by Satya1 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:50:05 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  My lament (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Debflyer, COBALT1928, vicki

    I don't want to gloat in front of those working white people who really think something is fundamentally wrong in America with the election of Obama.  

    Next to our campaign headquarters in my town is a local bar that a lot of the locals hang out in.  

    After Ohio was declared, I went out and about a half a dozen white males from their 20s to their 40s were smoking.  (One can't smoke in bars any more.)

    I went over and told them Obama had been re-elected and this was good for all of us.  I'm the core of the Republican support: a white married male over 60.  (Of course, all of that is irrelevant because I'm a liberal arts college professor.)

    Someone said he hated all government and didn't think anything would change.  I tried to point out that wasn't true, but then asked "Who are the largest employers in our county?"  No one answered so I told them: the air force base that is the home of the B-2 bomber and the regional university. I observed without big government our county would be nothing.  Our county is much better off because of government.

    These are the guys that watch Fox and listen to hate radio.  These are the guys who I try to reach in the classes I teach at that regional university.  I would love for them to begin to think and actually examine the kind of arguments they hear.

    If we can get them to think and reject the fear and hate they get from Fox and hate radio, we will have an unbeatable majority.  (One of my white male students told me that Romney was going to win in a landslide on Tuesday.  I told him he needed to stop watch Fox and told my classes (everyone said it would be close) that we would know relatively early on Tuesday.

    Racism has always been used in our country to divide working people.  It is one of the reasons America is exceptional.   It is not as in blatant as it used to be, but it still very much exists.  

    White working people and their children I teach are not to be shamed.  

    However, I have no problem in gloating in front of my colleagues at the university who voted for Romney and support Republicans.  They are supposed to be educated and I have no problem in reminding them how odious today's Republican Party is.  

    Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens.

    by MoDem on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:06:28 AM PST

  •  well said (0+ / 0-)

    so long and thanks for all the fish

    by Anton Bursch on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:07:08 AM PST

  •  Man.... (0+ / 0-)

    I couldn't have said it better myself....

    Irony is the ultimate cop-out way of turning something you didn't mean into something you did...the last refuge of the scoundrel.-- Julian Cope

    by Thunderthief on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:08:09 AM PST

  •  I'm trying, but I can't work up empathy for (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    COBALT1928, Dixiedemocrat

    these folks.  This is the last bastion of the bigots and the soulless rich and middle class.  These are the people who've got theirs, and fuck everybody else.  They have no Christian values, as whatever else Christ might have said, he was clear about how to treat the poor and the weak.

    No, these people have been coddled for too damn long.  Time to stop.  Time for them to feel threatened, time for them to feel like they are a minority (even though whites still make up about 70% of the fucking electorate, this just goes to show how fucking entitled they really are.)

    I want them to feel the shame of opposing the civil rights movement, the equal rights amendment and gay marriage.  If they are Christians, I want them to beg for god's forgiveness for their sins against the poor and disenfranchised.

    I want these people to serve as a warning to the younger folks who are growing up--

    This is what happens to you if you are on the wrong side of history.

    "Empty vessels make the loudest sound, they have the least wit and are the greatest blabbers" Plato

    by Empty Vessel on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:08:33 AM PST

    •  Let me add (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Dixiedemocrat, COBALT1928

      Are all republicans racist, sexist, homophobes...no.  But there is a special room in hell for those people who allied themselves with racists, sexists and homophobes because they wanted 5% lower taxes.

      Seriously, think about that.  The fiscal conservative sold out social equaltiy for 5% of their income...there is no excuse.

      "Empty vessels make the loudest sound, they have the least wit and are the greatest blabbers" Plato

      by Empty Vessel on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:16:27 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Spare your sympathy… (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Sychotic1, COBALT1928

    as one of them (demographically), I have very little sympathy to extend. Trust me, I would if as a rule they didn't let their politics rule the rest of their lives and how they treat others. My own life is so much easier, and happier, when I avoid association with my own "kind" – old white dudes. And the older I get the less I hold back my disdain, incurring a great deal of anger against one of them gone bad, a traitor. And now I can say everything that needs to be said with a gigantic SMILE.

    I voted for the UPPITY ONE

    by qua on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:08:52 AM PST

  •  You forget (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Sychotic1, COBALT1928
    All that said, though, there is still something poignant, even tragic, about those faces of red America, something worthy of a eulogy. Their America -- Bill O'Reilly's "traditional America" -- is fading away. Whatever the future holds, it's not likely to look like them, or think like them, or live like them.
    The simple fact is that it NEVER really looked that way, that bill oreilly's target audience is conservative white over the age of 65.

    They have been losing 15,000 viewers a month simply due to mortality over the last 4 years.  They were always irrelevant to reality.  They are sucked into racist, pious, self-righteous, nationalist propaganda that NEVER had anything to do with actual reality.

    how many times has Fox news said the word bengazi in the last 2 months??

  •  So many of the people in those photographs (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Sychotic1, vicki, Fixed Point Theorem

    are people who were in a position to oppose Obama's policies only because their parents, grandparents and great grandparents benefitted from FDR's policies.  Generations before, they were the other, the poor, the dispossessed, the despised.  Now they are in a position to despise others.  They need to understand that those they despise have political clout they did not imagine, and it's only going to get worse for them as time passes.

    Of course one should regard those people with a measure of empathy, but I still have a hard time looking at those photos without laughing at some of them, not because of what they look like or what they're wearing.  I, too, come from the lower middle class, so a lot of those people look like my relatives, too.  But it is always entertaining to see the powerful and deluded get deflated.  I'm sure at some point the tables will turn and they'll be laughing at me in despair, and I'll have my comeuppance.

    -5.13,-5.64; If you gave [Jerry Falwell] an enema, you could bury him in a matchbox. -- Christopher Hitchens

    by gizmo59 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:09:31 AM PST

  •  I appreciate the empathy myself. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Gay In Maine, Debflyer

    I don't have the energy to continue to hate people who have been deluded. I don't intend to spend a bunch of time trying to bring them around, but I do remember 2004, after I spent weekends in Youngstown and Pittsburgh knocking on doors for Kerry, and what that felt like. And I don't live in the south, but I know plenty of people in Blue Jersey that now think their country is doomed the way I did in 2004, and yeah I feel for them. Most of them, incidentally, are not horrible, racist people, none are entitled. Idiots? Yeah ok. But I've got some space in my heart for them and don't see any point in hating them now.

  •  One election can't undo the 236 years (5+ / 0-)

    of inequality otherwise known ads American history.

    I have no pity for these fools. They are going to have to suffer much worse in their own minds if they're to continue living in this country. I've lost all hope for them. They've been given a complete alternate reality that we on the outside cannot penetrate. Maybe their children can emerge from their shadows, but I have my doubts.

    Please take down the Geronimo reference. Native Americans were victims of genocide. White Republicans are just a bunch of goddamn fools with self-inflicted intellectual deficiencies.

  •  I would feel sorrier for them if (4+ / 0-)

    they would at least >listen to facts.

    They don't.  Many of the people in these pictures did not suffer one bit during the recession.  

    They know the recession was caused by Bush.

    They know that the President is not a socialist, or a communist.

    They know that he is an American Citizen, born in these United States.  

    They preferred Romney, and they believed the poles that lied to them because they didn't want to believe the truth--that they were losing.  

    We need to find a way to bring them back to some sense of citizenship and cooperation, but I surely don't feel sorry for them.  I hope that they will learn to be reality based people again.  I am not counting on it.  

    How do I know this?  

    My Romney relatives refuse to speak to us.  

    When I led prayers in Church last night for "our newly elected leaders, that they may find a way to work together to lead our country"  people in the congregation groaned audibly in disagreement.  During a prayer they can't let it go!!!

    Neighbors haven't waived hello to us in weeks.  We were the only ones on the block with an Obama yard sign.  

    White Romney voters are pissed.  They need to take a time out, calm down.  I only hope they will.  

    Feminism is the radical notion that women are people. ~Cheris Kramarae and Paula Treichler

    by Tchrldy on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:12:09 AM PST

  •  world's tiniest violin is tuning up (5+ / 0-)

    for those who drank the romney kool-aid and tried to force it down the throats of all of us.

  •  Pleeze (7+ / 0-)

    We've been trying to put a stake through the heart of the Confederate undead for 150 years now.  The aristocracy's con game of using race to enlist poor whites to support the oligarchs has run out its string.  Boo Fucking Hoo.  

  •  These people have subscribed to racism and (7+ / 0-)

    disenfranchisement of all who are different from them, and you ascribe Geronimo's status to them?

    This is a good example of the sappiness that led to liberal's demise, and what makes me sad is that any of us would express this again. This is truly the weakness conservative ascribe to us.  I hope it is not widely shared.

    Old Hippies Never Give Up!

    by ravenrdr on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:15:45 AM PST

  •  The coming economic recovery (0+ / 0-)

    and the obvious advantages of the ACA will soon be apparent to every American. Poor whites will likely be some of the biggest beneficiaries of subsidies to help pay for coverage.

    That is what folks like Rove and the Koch bros didn't want to happen on a Democratic watch.

    "Work for something because it is good, not just because it stands a chance to succeed." -- Vaclav Havel

    by greendem on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:18:34 AM PST

  •  The Scorpion and the Frog (5+ / 0-)

    The Scorpion asks the Frog to carry him across the river. The Frog at first refuses because he is afraid the Scorpion will sting him during the crossing.  But the Scorpion convinces the Frog by arguing that if he stings the Frog they will both drown.  Midway across the river the Scorpion stings the Frog.  As they slowly sink into the river, the Frog asks the Scorpion why he condemned them both to die.  The Scorpion replies:  I could not help it, it is my nature.

    If we sympathize too much with the rethugs, we're going to get stung, folks.

  •  Sorry, but I have no sympathy for racist (7+ / 0-)

    white folk, even if they are your relatives.

    It almost seems as if you too mourn that whites will soon be a minority, esp. with your clueless Geronimo reference. What a pathetic diary.

  •  Phooey (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Anak, COBALT1928, Fixed Point Theorem

    I'm all for seeing everyone as a person.  These folks cheered racism, homophobia, the destruction of the commonweal, and authoritarian family values.   Unless we're lucky, optimistic prognostications about demographics notwithstanding, we'll see 'em again.   Any single one of them could read, learn, talk to others,and gain a wider view of the world.  As a group, they are simply murderous, deeply unkind, and utterly thoughtless.  

    Phooey.  One might as well mourn the aspirations of Pinochet loyalists.

    ...j'ai découvert que tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos dans une chambre.

    by jessical on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:19:42 AM PST

  •  I weigh in on the side of the unsympathetic. Many (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jessical, COBALT1928

    of these people will double down on their hatred.  However, what Rush Limbaugh and Karl Rove and Rupert Murdoch and their kind do, in my opinion is evil, real evil.  My answer has been and will continue to be the only thing in this world that can overcome evil is good so the offenders have nothing to fear from me.

  •  Hate porn (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jessical

    While we think of porn as being about sex, titillating media include other broader-defined types of porn as well.  Celebrity porn is of course very popular, especially among some female audiences.  Gun porn is popular among many men.  And what we're seeing a lot of nowadays is hate porn.  It's giving these people a kind of should-feel-guilty pleasure by appealing to their baser instincts, as porn in general is wont to do.

    We should recognize it and call it like it is.

  •  Tipped and rec'd for the spirit, if not every (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Gay In Maine, a2nite

    ...idea presented.

    Time and again, I am disappointed by the left's extreme rejection of anyone who votes Republican. As you can see by the plethora of "FUCK EM" comments, this is not a controversial statement.

    The Tea Party should have been our creatures, and the shellshocked low-information voters should be ours, too. As I said in another comment:

    I would like it if - for once - we didn't throw out the baby with the bathwater, whereupon the right wing is waiting with open arms to manufacture the next Tea Party.

    The problem with going with your gut as opposed to your head is that the former is so often full of shit. - Randy Chestnut

    by lotusmaglite on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:21:07 AM PST

  •  Perhaps the words of Churchill (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Gay In Maine

    might be apropos here: "In defeat defiance; in victory magnanimity." I believe that Lincoln also was of the same mind when he offered up his second inaugural address to the nation and asked that we "bind up the nation's wounds", and this after losing 600,000 lives in the Civil War. I don't see how we can do less after a mere election.

    I sat next to a Texas Republican for a day and a half this week at a meeting. He is a Drudge Report reader and pretty red state. But we had a pleasant time with some ribbing back and forth. We found many things that we agree on along with the things we do not. There are bubble-dwellers on both sides. You cannot convince people you will not talk to or treat with kindness.

    For if there is a sin against life, it consists perhaps not so much in despairing of life as in hoping for another life and in eluding the implacable grandeur of this life. - Albert Camus

    by Anne Elk on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:22:18 AM PST

  •  I'm reminded of a scene from "Downfall" (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jds1978, Fixed Point Theorem

    No, not the well-known Hitler rant scene that's been used in a thousand parodies.

    This takes place near the end of the movie. We see several workers from the Führerbunker start to make their way out of the underground complex, which is crowded with Wehrmacht soldiers and officials taking refuge as the Red Army closes in.

    They pass by several SS officers, who discussing what to do.

    One of the officers responds to another, "I'm not going anywhere!" and puts his Luger to his mouth and pulls the trigger.

    I'd recommend "Downfall" on this ground alone: we see, close up, people who have been integrated into a totalitarian worldview and how they cope as that world crashes down. Some have been key figures in it and its crimes, while for others it was simply the way things were, the ideological air they breathed.

  •  I do understand, its just.. (0+ / 0-)

    without seeking proof, they have allowed their judgement to be colored by prejudice.

    And it just keeps happening. The scandals they make up, fade after a week or two. Theres no acknowledging this. Theres no apologizing for the years spent claiming Obama wasnt an american...

    ...All the evidence in the world goes against them. And yet they refuse to accept any of it. They make up theories and convince themselves they are right.

    How many times have you seen these people sarcastically refer to Obama as "the messiah"? How many times have they preemptively accused us of calilng them racist for things, and then attacking us for the words they just then put in our mouths?

    I can't ignore the fact that they ignore when their candidates switch their stated views over the course of days, or even paragraphs.

    What can we possibly do, at this point, that we have not already done...? I do sympathize. Really, I do. But they are convinced of a reality that simply does not exist. Its just been a relentless stream of lies, of denial, of thought-terminating cliches.

    We -- all of us -- tried so hard to convince them. Did everything possible to convince them...And we made a lot of ground. But... and I hate to say this... i fear there may truly be a good number who will not believe us, no matter what happens.

    And their attacks and lies continue, to this very day, to this very minute. I dont like seeing floods of message board posts making the most vile attacks against us, only to be followed by accusations that we are the ones who are attacking.

    Ridicule...It seems this is the only thing we have left. The only thing that gets to them. I dont like seeing people hurt, physically or emotionally....

    ...But we're left with little other options. They exist in a fantasy world, and eve nthe fact that they predicted the same things four years ago -- things that never happened -- that they are today isnt enough to convince them they may be wrong.

    If there is anything, anything else that may work...That would be wonderful... But what if theres not? What can we do...? We can't just ignore them. But we can't convince them either.

    Then you came out all of a sudden and said, "You're Prism Indigo!" but I don't get it...

    by kamrom on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:26:51 AM PST

    •  This is a good post (0+ / 0-)

      and I can think of some explanations for the behavior we see and consistences in denial running from climate change to Ohio election results.  What I really can't explain is how we got here.  It honestly caught me by surprise when someone that I knew well thought it reasonable to demand to see the President's original signed birth certificate.  It struck me as absurd in the extreme, just as I thought it was absurd when that same person remarked earlier that Sara Palin had similar qualifications to Obama's.  This denial of objective observation and reason seems to be pervasive.  Where did this come from?  Supply side economics?  Weapons of mass destruction that must be there? I just don't remember such willful ignorance being part of political discourse in my younger years.

  •  Boehner and McConnell didn't take PBO phone call (8+ / 0-)

    I have NO sympathy for the Republican party.  Wasn't it Einstein who said that all it takes for evil to succeed in this world is for "good men" to do nothing.  Not all Republicans are racists but in this election in particular I do believe that the racists all voted Republican.  Not to mention their anti-women, anti-LGBT, anti-elderly, anti-immigrant policies.....and then, having alienated practically the entire electorate, they are surprised they lost?!?  I'm still angry at having to hear their hateful rhetoric the past 4+ years!  Far from "patriots" the obstructionism the GOP has embraced has hurt our country.  This anger was reignited when I heard that Boehner and McConnell refused to take President Obama's phone call after he won.  FUCK THEM!

    "The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it." - Flannery O'Conner

    by Dixiedemocrat on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:28:49 AM PST

  •  ignorance=suffering (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Anak, COBALT1928

    All those FOX-bots are now going to suffer. Crying over a fantasy.

    And crying for naught. Their lives -- at least the middle class one - will get better because of Obama's next 4 years.

    I bet most will still be too ignorant to notice or acknowledge that thanks to their guy losing, their own lives have better opportunities.

    My faith in the American intelligence and in our voting system was lifted by last Tuesday's results.

  •  Beautifully done youtube video. (0+ / 0-)

    What is incredibly sad to me is the way people were lied to about everything--Obama's motives, Romney's sincerity, the GOPs larger goals (which certainly had nothing good in mind for the ordinary souls pictured here), the polls themselves.  Although there are no doubt a large number of racist, toxic people among those who worked for the GOP, a great many were sincerely following what their friends, their neighbors, their pastor, their newscaster were telling them.  For them, the election was a tragedy.  On the plus side, Obamacare, clean energy, a tax hike on the wealthiest Americans, etc., will benefit them, too.

    "I'm really proud of all of you." -- President Barack Obama

    by SottoVoce on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:33:10 AM PST

  •  Sorry... (8+ / 0-)

    but I don't feel a bit sorry for them.  They have been sold a bill of goods by the right wing, told that Obama is "foreign", "other", Muslim, and "socialist", and they were dumb enough to swallow it whole without doing any research for themselves.

    Geronimo had a legitimate grievance. They don't.

  •  I take a different approach (4+ / 0-)

    "That being the case, I'd much rather it was them than us wearing down the enamel."

    I believe the Democratic Party has a right to celebrate and celebrate with a vengeance.  Conservatives spent the better part of the last 4 years demonizing this President.  Called him everything in the book.  Accused the man of destroying America.  Accused the man of crimes against the constitution. Accused the man of being a traitor and infiltrator of democracy.

    Anyone who was a personal friend of the President, they dragged them through the mud.  Good men and women voted out of office in 2010 by the ravenous Tea Party.  Guns at political rallies.  Guns at town hall meetings.  Guns at grocery stores.  Shooting up campaign buildings.  Spitting on congressmen.  Calling half the country lazy.  Not ONCE did Mitt Romney or congressional conservative leaders denounce any of this garbage.  Then embraced it and ran a whole campaign on it.

    We are just to forget all that now?  Stop grinding our teeth?  Even now they are claiming they always wanted to compromise with the Socialist Kenyan Muslim.  That's a lie and we all know it.

    Nah...we have to shame them until they finally get it.

  •  Great piece by Billmon (0+ / 0-)

    This sentence:

    I also know that they have been lied to, with ferocious intensity and relentless dedication, by the conservative propaganda machine and its political masters.
    is a gem - and a truth we all need to remember.  We need to separate the manipulators (leaders) from the manipulated (followers).

    They hear this stuff from the time they get up:  on their television, in their car, on their computer, at their church, wherever.   Yes, they actively choose many of these exposures, but a simplistic explanation for today's ills delivered by a commentator who talks "plain English" a lot like your next door neighbor can be quite seductive, regardless of how misguided or contrived the message.  Society and tribalism play a huge role in this.

  •  Let them grieve in private. (0+ / 0-)

    Ok, so it's virtually impossible not to enjoy a little schadenfreude, but I'd have been PISSED if my grieving face from '04 been plastered all over RW blogs for widespread entertainment.  It's the practical consequences I'm worried about.  Two college campus race-based riots are quite enough.

    What exactly is a google problem?

    by senex on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:34:07 AM PST

  •  Not very empathetic of people in photos (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    COBALT1928

    They were living in a bubble and continue to live in a bubble. They openly shit on facts and supported outright lies. They are getting no sympathy from me.

  •  Thank you, Billmon (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    allensl

    I recognize those people. I graduated from an all-white segregated high school in a town segregated by law and delaying the removal of the laws because the Supreme Court said desegregation would proceed "with all deliberate speed."

    But these people, like me, have lived through massive social changes in America. I was born white in a world dominated by members of the white race. It was divided by class and race and that was what we were taught in church and by the politicians was the source of stability. For a nation still dominated economically by agriculture it may have been true. 80% of the population in 1940 were born on farms or in small towns. The U.S. had two really large cities, Chicago and New York. It was a rural agricultural nation with a growing industrial segment and (after WW II) a very powerful military that defended international trade.

    Then the industrial revolution which had started before the Civil War kicked into high gear. America has has more than doubled in population and that new population has moved into cities. The two lane rural roads I used to drive are four and six lane highways now and the interstate highway system has totally reorganized the American society.

    The culture of white dominance I was born into is impossible in an urban environment, and America is no longer rural. It is now primarily urban. But for those of us born in the 40's we learned a very different culture and we were taught that it was a better one. So the massive changes could only have gone downhill, right? Right??

    If you are afraid of social change then you block out modern music and retreat to conservative religion and clean your guns. And you vote for politicians who are like you and have rural power bases and will continue to have rural power bases until they die and are replaced by newer, urban politicians who have grownup and learned their trade in new high-population density society.

    Except for the children of the rural elites (small town doctors, dentists, lawyers and small business owners - with their bankers) the kids of today no longer understand the race-based society. The voting patterns make that clear. The urban kids will elect women, LGBT individuals (they have invented a name for this class now allowed out of the shadows), ethnics, racial minorities, Hindus, Buddhists, Muslims, and whatever else we use to socially classify people.

    Actually this change of society has left a lot of people behind. But the creation of industrial-based high-density urban society based in large cities has been leaving the poets, priests and writers behind for two, going on three centuries now. Every generation learns their culture as children in their family, and it is ALWAYS clear that any change from that culture is WRONG - or at least dangerous. But in America until this last generation you could always retreat to rural America and avoid the cities. That has not been possible for the last generation.

    Since the power base of older politicians goes back to the political structures and power of a generation earlier the conservatives reared on John Wayne Westerns fear the liberated hip-hop music people. Or whatever is popular today.

    Yes, these people have been lied to. Their politicians know right now that the old America culture is dead and will not be resurrected. But rural politicians like DeMint, McConnell, Ennis and Coburn have their power base in that older more rural America. Plus the multinational financiers can buy and use them to maintain their Wall Street American base with which to control much of the world's wealth. But this conservative politician party is nearly over. They know it, so they have pulled out all the stops for this election - and to some extent lost with Obama's reelection.

    This exposed the lies many of the change-resistant the white Americans have been buying and hoping were true. It all came crashing down on them Tuesday.

    Seems like I've seen similar pictures of sports fans whose teams just blew the big game. They'll recover. And many will buy a new ticket for the game for the next election with little change in attitude.

    The US Supreme Court has by its actions and rhetoric has ceased to be legitimate. Whiskey Tango Foxtrot - over

    by Rick B on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:35:54 AM PST

  •  It's kind of nice not having to delete so many (5+ / 0-)

    Obama-hating emails from my RW relatives now that their world has ended.

  •  I will go even further: we could open our hearts (0+ / 0-)

    wide open right now.  We could start with simply perceiving all of these people -- rich or poor, rural or urban, educated or not -- as JUST AS HUMAN AS WE ARE.  That sounds like an insult.  That sounds like I am saying we think they aren't human.  How dare I suggest....

    Well.  I think it isn't that we truly view them as less than human, not deep down.  Deep down, we know there is so much more to the story.  It is just that we don't yet understand the deeper story.  So we are confused, and in our confusion we lash out and make fun and call them names and make them into "the other".  

    We are very confused and trying desperately to understand!  We are baffled.  We are angry. We struggle with mixed feelings:  "how can they be so stupid?  so uncaring?  so allergic to facts?  so hateful? I know deep down they are just like me, but still they are ruining our country, our world...."  It is so easy, despite our best intentions, to begin to dismiss them.  To fight against them, as if they are the enemy.  

    And yet we know the all great spiritual leaders, all great political leaders, have always demonstrated that understanding the "enemy" with compassion is the WAY.  It is the path that leads to an evolution of humanity.    

    We also know, from observing human history, that giving attention to what we DON'T want often creates more of what we don't want.  If we insist on pushing against what we perceive as "the other", we will only get pushed back.  If we insist on staying at a cognitive place that insists "these people" are inherently stupid, inherently mean-hearted, inherently "other"... we will get just that.   A "fuck them" attitude is understandable, for sure.  Anger is appropriate, and a great motivator.  But is it in our best long-term interest?  Is it effective?  Is it expanding our understanding of how humanity CAN get so hateful and ignorant in the first place?  

    If we are finding ourselves still ignorant of how THEY got ignorant, doesn't that make US ignorant?  If we can't yet understand how people --- people just like your brother, your grandmother, your neighbor, your co-worker --- get to a point where they will vote against their own best interests, then what does that say about OUR level of enlightenment?  

    I want to understand.  I want to create a world where everyone can truly feel love for everyone.  I don't want to spend energy dismissing people, fighting against others.  Those "others" ARE me?  There really is no separation.  If I hate them, I hate a part of myself.  

    I know from my work with children that the best way to deal with children who are upset/angry/ignorant/hateful etc is to make sure my perception of them is accurate.  That is, to focus on their best self, not the yucky self that is presenting.  To SEE THEIR INNER SELVES, THEIR TRUE SELVES.  To look past the ugly costume they have put on and to see their real self.  To effectively communicate and allow them to change their behavior it is imperative to talk with them from a place of love and understanding.  This opens up their hearts just a bit, and allows them to connect with their own best selves, which are always connected to love.  That is how change occurs.  We can only change ourselves, but compassion opens up a space for it to occur.  

    Opening hearts comes before opening minds.  The mind will defend when offended.  It is VERY good at that.  It will twist reality to its liking, in order to defend the egoic self.  But if you speak to the heart, from the heart, both hearts can't help but open up and hear what the other is saying.  

    And so, I would say, that the evolution of humanity that we all desire so much starts with love, and ends with love.  (Although it never ends, really.)

    We are all love.  We are made of love.  When someone is acting (yes, we are all actors!) out negative emotions it simply means they are out of alignment with their own true self.  

    It is very difficult for us to pull ourselves out of the good guy/bad guy mentality.  It is a huge hurdle.  Our entire worldview is based on this.  It is hard to see past it. Even great intellectuals, people who are brilliant analysts of current world situations, often fall into blaming and shaming.  

    Really, what IS the difference between hating the rich and hating the poor?  Something to think about.  I am not making a political argument here.  I am not apologizing for any groups behavior.  I am simply saying we can go deeper in our introspection, we NEED to go deeper, if we want to truly acheive the potentials that humans have on this planet.  

    As so many people mourn the further dissolution of their worldview, I will intend to open my heart and in that process I will trust that their hearts will also open, just a bit.  If I can empathize with their pain, then that paves the way for them to empathize with my pain.  

    All of the ugliness, the racism, the lashing out, the blaming that is coming up is coming up to be healed.  There is a lot of healing going on!

  •  Righties: You've Been Lied To (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dixiedemocrat, jds1978, a2nite

    Surprised? Shocked? Isn't it amazing to look down at your Morning Joe and realize that you've been drinking liquified dog shit for the past four years?

    Yep, there's one thing you can no longer deny, as much as you'd just love to keep denying it: You've been lied to, and for once, you can't blame me, your sworn enemy.

    Nope, this time you cannot deny that Fox News, Rush Limbaugh, Joe Scarborough and all the right wing talking heads were the ones that led you down the old primrose path of false optimism. They lied. They told you there was no way Mitt Romney could lose, and you fell for it.

    Hits you in the face like an East Coast hurricane, that's the truth. That giant flood of cold, wet reality is drowning out even the staunchest delusions of right wing infallibility. It's as if God sent a hurricane just to fuck you up.

    Of course, the real hurricane didn't hit Romney country, where the Old South did it again. The Big Slap in Your Face was an electoral hurricane of pissed off Latinos, women, gays, veterans, school kids, and of course, Blacks. Y'all just didn't quite block enough of 'em from voting, tho your boys in Florida and Ohio most certainly tried to rig the election. Not exactly a point of civic pride, eh? Your biggest weapon was voter suppression.

    I forgive you, because we beat you. But you're still one sick puppy inside, in the paranoid delusions of your twisted heart. You've been lied to, but instead of coming to the natural conclusion, you're going to keep watching Fox News, waiting for the evil clowns to wave more scarey balloons to justify some new conspiracy.

    One of your ilk has just called the winners of this election "maggots." Well then, if your party just got destroyed by maggots, what do you think maggots eat?

    Whatever you do, don't use this giant failure as a chance to engage in thoughtful reflection of your core philosophy. As your enemy, the last thing I want is for you to adapt to the changing times. That would be Evolution, and you know, that can't possibly exist. Just like Hurricane Sandy, it just can't happen.

    Propaganda doesn't simply lie; it conjures a magic castle out of pretty fables, then bricks over all the doors and windows so the truth can't get in.

    by jimbo92107 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:41:37 AM PST

  •  I wish we could help them to understand (0+ / 0-)

    that our goal is to make America better for them. I really hope that, if the Repubs in the House don't block his every effort, when the Prez gets to do some Keynesian economics, and when his health care plan really kicks in, these folks will see why we fought so hard - for them. I'm betting every single person in every one of those slide that was not of a TV screen is paying lower taxes under Obama, and none of them realizes it.

    We all understand that freedom isn't free. What Romney and Ryan don't understand is that neither is opportunity. We have to invest in it.
    Julian Castro, DNC 4 Sept 2012

    by pixxer on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:45:11 AM PST

  •  Who's to carry on Mitt Romney's legacy? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jds1978

    Tagg, you're it

    Slow thinkers - keep right

    by Dave the Wave on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:49:44 AM PST

  •  I do remember that day in 2004 (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Ian S, vicki

    When Gore conceded. I was at lunch when I heard.

    I cried bitter tears, called my boss and told him I wouldn't be coming back for the afternoon. I went home and drank myself silly.

    So yes, I understand their grief, their pain and bewilderment, their shock. Their outrage.

    On that day in 2004, I was convinced that the second Bush administration was the wrong choice for our country. I was convinced that it would be an unmitigated disaster, with not only Bush being re-elected, but also in that the GOP picked up 4 Senate seats, 3 House seats and held steady in Governorships.

    And I was absolutely correct. It was an unmitigated disaster.

    A disaster that we are still, in many ways, trying to recover from.

    So I do empathize with them, but I am absolutely convinced that the second Obama administration will not have the same results that the second Bush administration brought us.

    God Bless America.

    I'm not really FAT - it's an unfortunate childhood nickname.

    by FatPath on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:58:02 AM PST

  •  Beautifully stated by billmon--however, it's hard (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Pithy Cherub, JayRaye

    to sympathize with people who hate women, blacks, Hispanics, gays, immigrants, and so on.

    That Dick-and-Jane vanilla world of life on Pleasant Street, with Mom wearing an apron and Spot running loose in the neighborhood without a leash is GONE, never to return--thank Goddess.

    We had to accept that Gore was deprived of a presidency by one Supreme Court vote.

    Now they will have to admit that an African-American born in Hawaii will remain president for four years.

    "Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich."--Napoleon

    by Diana in NoVa on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:05:21 PM PST

  •  To sympathy or not to sympathy? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    tha puddin

    I can’t conjure up any sympathy.  Clear Channel, which aired a progressive station in the northwest, just pulled the plug on it.  I hear Bain is partial owner.  Spite.  Their guy didn’t win so no progressive radio for you.  They are at war with the majority of the American people.  Again, I have no sympathy at this point.

  •  I think we should just shoot 'em. (0+ / 1-)
    Recommended by:
    Hidden by:
    Hammerhand

    We won; they're scum.

    Put 'em out of their misery.

  •  Not all of those faces were mourning Romney (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mgoodm, illdemforchange

    My daughter's picture appeared on the front page of that site -- probably still does. She's clutching an American flag, eyes wet with tears. Problem is - she's in the front row of the crowd listening to President Obama's acceptance speech in Chicago! She's weeping tears of joy for the President she campaigned for all year! In fact, photos of her that night appeared on the CNN website, the NYT website and many others -- all with caption correctly identifying her as a Romney supporter. Now, she's a victim of another Romney-GOP lie.

  •  Been there, (0+ / 0-)

    hard to make fun of them.

    "We believe that the people are the source of all governmental power; that the authority of the people is to be extended, not restricted."-Barbara Jordan

    by sancerre2001 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:15:01 PM PST

  •  I had precisely the same reaction. (0+ / 0-)

    Thanks for writing this.  Looking at those pictures, it's very apparent that many of these people really thought they were doing the good and right thing by backing Romney.

    As much as I want to hate them for what they've put us through (and probably will continue to put us through), I mostly just feel aggravation and pity toward them.  I suppose they'd think that's condescending and arrogant, but it's how I feel.

    My true hatred is reserved for the people pulling the strings, the people who are deliberately misleading these people for their own ends.  They know what they're doing is wrong, and they do it anyway.  That's why I feel such joy looking at the sad faces of Rove, or Ryan, or Romney, or anyone on Fox News...but I just feel peculiarly depressed looking at that Tumblr page.

  •  Conservatives in Family (3+ / 0-)

    That night I went on Facebook and there was a posting from a cousin who is an evangelical Christian in which he despaired about how "faggots" are going to be allowed to marry in several more states.  He talked about the forces of Satan controlling America.  I always had the policy of never talking about politics with such family members.  But this time, I had to reply.  Calmly, I posted an argument which stated that ours was a secular society and god as well as satan does not lead to a rational argument about the economic, social and political needs of our society.  Well, he went off on me saying that I was lost, immoral, perverted, etc., etc.  Then, the next day, he unfriended me on Facebook.  It is sad that many, like my cousin, do not even want to hear our arguments.  The divide is a chasm at this point.  When one views the world in theocratic terms, it becomes impossible to accept that the majority do not want such a society.  What breaks my heart is the fact that when his son had brain cancer, I and many in the family raised money to pay for many of his medical bills because he did not have decent insurance. And yet, he condemns me as a profligate.  Unfortunately, when he looks at Obama, he cannot get past the color of his skin and the literal interpretation of the Bible from the book of Noah which condemns people of color based upon a mythical story.  

    Each generation has to fight anew for economic and social justice!

    by liberalteacher on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:26:39 PM PST

  •  I get it. You hate middle-aged white people. (0+ / 0-)

    Problem is, there is nothing I can do about that.
    I am stuck with getting older and I am stuck with my genes.

    You are as free to your narrow-mindedness as those nazi assholes who the ACLU protects in the name of free speech.

    Makes me sad, though.
    In my young activist days, I naively hoped that we would largely be past all that by now.

    I guess 40 years is just too short a time.

    LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

    by dinotrac on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:28:40 PM PST

  •  Republican relatives (0+ / 0-)

    Yes, I have some. They have sought my friendship and I must be tactful. I could at least present the Keynsian viewpoint.
    They live in Oklahoma, where not a single county voted for the President either time.

    btw I live in Houston, Harris County TX. This county just barely voted for the President. Dallas County voted morely strongly for him.

    Censorship is rogue government.

    by scott5js on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:29:06 PM PST

  •  I live in Kansas, so I know these are not bad (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Fixed Point Theorem

    people. I carpool their kids and they have done the same for me. They're the first people to line up and get dinners organized if you've just had surgery. They're GOOD people--but I don't feel the least bit sorry for them and their loss right now. They are so ignorant and they have no interest in seeing the other side--at ALL. Yes, they're trying to raise their families and they want good schools and again, they're nice, but they also supported Chick-fil-A with gusto and were really proud to do so. So like I said, I don't give a rat's butt about their loss and I'm thrilled that things turned out this way. I can't muster a shred of sympathy for them, and I know that probably makes me a horrible person, but I kind of don't care. They will be okay. How many times have we had to muddle through? The world needed their side to lose. Period.

    Let America be the dream the dreamers dreamed...

    by langstonhughesfan on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:36:58 PM PST

  •  I find it unsettling (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Pithy Cherub

    to be sure -- understanding that I would probably have looked pretty much the same way had Obama lost.  

    But there is one thing I cannot get over, and that is, when I see Obama I see a guy who pretty much did what I did, in the middle of a dysfunctional family that nonetheless stressed education, he worked hard and went to good schools and tried to marry his aspirations to do well and to do good.  (He is A LOT more successful than I am -- but the point is, I identify with him.)

    I find it unfathomable that anyone looks at Obama and sees a Kenyan, or a socialist, or that he hates white people or business or any of the rest of it.  That is so utterly disconnected from reality that I find it somewhat frightening.

    Basically, he did what everyone left right and center tells young people they should be doing -- but (and I am sure more than a few African-Americans have figured this out) there is a segment of the population that sees only dark skin and fills in the biographical blanks based on their own deterministic understanding of what race means, regardless of the objective external facts.  I don't sympathize with that.  I can't.

    •  Excuse me! Kenyans are hardworking, decent (0+ / 0-)

      people to! says this Kenyan American citizen. When I look at Obama, I very much see his HERITAGE in him. God! Americans are just awful. The whole lot.

      My name is X. I'm a semi-military black woman and I voted for Barack Obama.

      by tha puddin on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:59:23 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I wasn't slurring anyone (0+ / 0-)

        But Obama is not "Kenyan" just like I am not "Serbian" (to name a group that definitely has a poor reputation in a lot of quarters but that also happens to be my grandfather's birthplace).   In any event, in Obama's case "Kenyan" means, basically, "not American."  

        But I am pretty sure you have me beat for negative and overbroad generalizations, Just re-read your comment. Hint:  "Americans . . . . The whole lot."  You know that includes Obama, right?

  •  Awwww... (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dumbo, Fixed Point Theorem, JayRaye

    Born with way too much empathy, there are times when it fails ;)  Schadenfreude is the mood of the week!

    •  Damn right. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      JayRaye, Faroutman

      Don't fuck with my schadenfreude-buzz.  I've been waiting years for this.

      My two favorite posts on that tumblr:

      America, you bitch.

      And:

      I'm going to be spending the next four years eating cupcakes and white wine.

      Actually, that last one was pretty bad.  As soon as I read it, I could TASTE cupcake/wine vomit in my mouth.  Really taste it!  She better get used to that.  Ugh, what a combo.  Cupcakes and wine. She better start wearing a headband to protect her hair.  Oh, jeezus, that's bad.

  •  Eh (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    tha puddin, JayRaye

    screw 'em.  They deserve the shock and pain. Now they know all the lies, bullying, idiocy and anger will NOT make things go their way. Like a petulant child, they got smacked and put in the corner. When they are ready to grow up, they can come out and join the rest of us. Until then, keep them down where they belong revels in his Schadenfreude

  •  I feel no sympathy, no empathy, no understanding, (3+ / 0-)

    no pity. If these people continue to work against us, then I will do nothing but make sure they are (electorally) ground into dust.

    Socialist Fuckstick No. 308273

    by culturejammer on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:51:54 PM PST

  •  So typical of (6+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dumbo, Papuska, Al Fondy, tha puddin, JayRaye, HCKAD

    liberals:

    These folks who think of us as "maggots", who do everything but shout out the N word, yell "you LIE" from the floor of Congress, call him foreign and Kenyan and compare him to Hitler and say he will destroy the country, that he hates Americans (whites) . . .

    Can you imagine the kind of anger boiling just under the surface, borne of nothing but "why is this darkie in OUR White House!", for someone in Congress to yell at the President as he makes a speech?

    None of them would give a shit about our pain if Romney's lies had succeeded, if his money bought the WH.  

    They'd laugh at us, and call us fools, and they wouldn't see any dignity, and they would stomp on our faces up to and including a good stomping from the WH on all of our progress, on our hopes of being free to marry and continue to be free to control our bodies, they'd sneer at us and our charity and our desire to lift everyone up.

    They are crying now that we are gloating and being "mean" - but these are the folks who fucking wore purple bandaids to ridicule John Kerry's service.

    Nah.  They have not learned anything - in the face of this stunning loss they will still cling to the lies and and hatred, blind to how much they're getting screwed.

    Normally I'm pretty compassionate, but I'm sick of their bullshit, their willful ignorance, their blind allegiance, and their scorn.  They think we "stole" the country, as if it is theirs and we are not a part of it.

    Typical Democrats allowing compassion - the sort of compassion that gets you close to the poisonous snake you thought was dead, poor thing . . . .

    Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are the change that we seek. Barack Obama

    by delphine on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 12:59:01 PM PST

  •  it comes down to this (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Papuska

    these guys don't really believe in democracy. they believe they should win, period. the idea of americans sharing their thoughts and wishes and coming to a consensus is not on their program.
    i recently wrote to my brother in law, whom i love, when he kept sending me anti obama email stuff, "i know exactly how you feel. i felt that way from 2000-2008."
    and then i watched that guy blow the a giant surplus really fast, start 2 wars, one with the wrong country, the other, an unfinished shoot-em-up, without the promised rebuilding of a country weary of war, and watched him get U. S. allies of 40 years to want nothing to do with us. plus too many other items to fit on this page. and he was white, like me.

  •  No quarter given. . . (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Papuska, tha puddin, JayRaye, HCKAD

    simply because I have no sympathy whatsoever for the folks who were hoping for a Romney presidency.  What do you want me to say? Sorry your dreams of an all white America were slam danced out of here? Sorry that you want to continue believing that somehow God loves white Americans more? Sorry that your desire to narrowly define the ideals and vision of this country failed to come to pass? I'm not sorry. I'm glad. I'm damn proud that the majority of this country said hell no to racism, hell no to corporate elitism, hell no to isolationism.  Am I sorry that Americans voted for better education, equal pay for equal work, for healthcare for all? Hell no. It's not Schadenfreude; it's vindication that America is better than the fear the anger the hatred the scorched earth philosophy of  American conservative politics.

  •  I haven't got to the poignant sympathy (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JayRaye, importantinstructions

    stage.  Not likely, either, because I'm just not that kind of guy.  My natural tendency is to be a dick in 99% of situations.  That's just me!  So I'm enjoying this.  Can't get enough of it, really.  I'm fuckin' evil.

    Having said that, any tendency towards sympathy is blunted by the fact that I'm not as pessimistic for their chances as they are and many here are.  They'll bounce back from this, faster than you think, and they'll be just as big assholes, and they'll still have more superpac money than us.  They'll just be SMARTER about expressing their naked hatred for other Americans.  

    They seem to have forgotten how dogwhistles are supposed to work: Only DOGS are supposed to hear them.  They've confused dogwhistles with megahorns.  Rather than using a private wink and a nod, they're trying to rub our face in the most hostile of their sentiments, and then snicker and act coy about why we're pissed off about it.  

    They'll be back.  

    Even Chuck Norris, who predicted 1000 years of darkness if Obama won.  That's pretty extreme, don't you think?  I'm awaiting with bated breath to hear his opinion on our new state of darkness, how it feels waking up in the morning and yawning and going, aw shit, 999 years and 364 more days to go!

    Did he ever consider that Obama became president 4 years ago?  If he did, he might realize that there's only 996 years left to go.  Maybe it would be a relief.  On the other hand, the implication is he didn't get raptured, so he's fucked.

  •  I am sorry for the Romney voters (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Harkov311, Killer of Sacred Cows

    in the sense that I am sorry for people who smoke, are unrecovered alcoholics, and are drug addicted.  I am sorry to see folks acting in a self-detructive manner.

    I live in Wisconsin, where Gov. Walker again has a Republican majority in both state houses.  I don't see it as the end of the world or the end of democracy in Wisconsin.  I see Walker's administration as a maker of damages that will take a long time to change.  Some, such as what was done to state workers, may never be changed.

    I don't hate the people who support Walker and Republicans like him.  I am sorry for the people who are affected by bad policy.

    Back to the Romney voters: Hopefully a few will hit an emotional bottom that will cause them to look at what the Republican party has become.  Hopefully a change to a more rational GOP will begin.

  •  A More Apropos Soundtrack (0+ / 0-)

    Then they came for the trade unionists,
    and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

    by Ex Con on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:16:39 PM PST

  •  I like Ossie Davis's line--1958 (0+ / 0-)

    Actually these same kind of people believed that their world was coming to an end in the late 1950s.  

    But we look back now an sing the song from Purlie: "The world's not coming to an end my friend, the world is coming to a start!"

  •  Tangential to the post: conservatives are .. (0+ / 0-)

    ..creating their own electoral enemies
    Why?
    Besides the GOP goals of keeping government and its revenues in private corporate control – Hate propaganda makes loads of money
    I found this discussion interesting in that it took aim at the motives behind the source of propaganda and its target audience  - the republican base
    (15 second commercial - sorry)  

    “..the deeper issue is that for conservative politicians and conservative networks and conservative websites there is simply too much to be gained by feeding the sense of persecution and siege that many white Christians feel down to their toes. I’m not sure what is going to shift those incentives because that insecurity as an emotional fact it is real and it isn’t going away.
     Although with shifting demographics, gains from feeding the sense of persecution and siege are looking like they are less guaranteed today than in the not too distant past – which is a good thing and trending to the better
    ..It does not mean that Democrats are assured some permanent majority in perpetuity..but it does mean this: that the only way our politics avoids the increasingly ugly spectacle of a revanchist party attempting desperately to strengthen its appeal to a shrinking pool of white voters is if the movements leaders show some genuine leadership and stop cultivating their bases worst instincts.”
     Fomenting hate is a lucrative business and that goes beyond their fucked up ideology, it’s just plain old greed. Faux News and the Limbaughs and Glen Becks of the world have proven that part of it for years

    This does not absolve the right-wing fanatics imo, but it at least puts the onus on who’s profiting from this hate business. It sure isn’t prejudiced “little people” by and large.

    So that is where Dems should focus their energy fighting imo - the powersful machinery at the top
    For more context, here is the longer discussion:
    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/...

  •  I can relate to this: (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Killer of Sacred Cows
    In the end, though, what really makes it hard for me to dine with gusto at the schadenfreude buffet is that the grieving faces on the other side of the partisan divide aren't those people, they're my people -- the middle-class neighbors of my Southern childhood, the kids I went to school with, my redneck uncles and cousins, my own mother and father.

    The sagging chins and pot bellies, the crew cuts and blue hair, the bad make up and worse fashion sense -- these are all as familiar to me as the lines on my own face. I know these people too intimately, their pasts are too intertwined with mine, for me to look at them and see only the despised Other, even though I have no doubt that's how many, if not most, of them would look at me.

    I also know that they have been lied to, with ferocious intensity and relentless dedication, by the conservative propaganda machine and its political masters. If we must have demons to hate, better to seek them among the con artists who have turned Rwandan-style hate speech into an industry profitable enough to rival the porn business.

    That's how it feels to look at some of my German past and extended family members and neighbors. It's the past now, but it's familiar.

    The first diary from you I really like a lot. I am not familiar with those of your diaries that made you famous among the oldtimers here. But I can sense now ... why that might have happened.

  •  They can go to the ninth circle of hell with (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Killer of Sacred Cows, Faroutman

    Rotten Ronnie & the other betrayers. They are stupid & dangerous.

    The radical Republican party is the party of oppression, fear, loathing and above all more money and power for the people who robbed us.

    by a2nite on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 01:55:11 PM PST

  •  There's a black dude in one of the pics (0+ / 0-)

    he's wearing a cowboy hat.

    Can't fool us liberal media!

    What's wrong under Republicans is still wrong under Democrats.

    by gila on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 02:08:44 PM PST

  •  Racist Bullshit on many fronts HR'd (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JayRaye, mimi, elizabethawilke, Faroutman

    Did you know Gernimo was Americas longest held POW until present day Leonard Peltier passed him up. Geronimo DIED in captivity so your analogy reeks of both racism and ignorance.

    You would not use a slave in your analogy because you can plainly see how ignorant and racist it would be. But like many Americans you can refer to Indian humans without thinking nor guilt because of your vast ignorance and that of your audience.

    There isn't a fucking thing wrong with those pictured except they lost an election. There is no MOURNING going on so you're also insulting people who actually have reason to mourn.Tomorrow these same fuckers will be working hard to deny we minorities, gays and women our rights and they'll be smiling for the camera as they do.

    America could have chosen to be the worlds doctor, or grocer. We choose instead to be her policeman. pity

    by cacamp on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 02:13:52 PM PST

    •  I didn't quite understand the comparison (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      cacamp

      with Geronimo and am glad you made it clear, because I wouldn't have seen that aspect otherwise consciously.  I just didn't get it and it seemed odd to me, without giving it a thought of why it felt odd and reading over it. And it's good to learn that I haven't seen that point as the main subject of the diary, whereas you did. It makes me think about my own inability to recognize what is so obvious clear to you. In that sense I really appreciate your comment.

      Another thing you made me think about is, if there is mourning going on or not. I think you are right. It is not mourning, but a deep sense of disappointment, loss, disgust and confusion.

      Considering the hate they showered on their "enemies", it's hard to care for their disappointments and confusion.

      On the other hand I think it's quite honest of the author to tell us that "our enemies" are "his (and our) people", he knows well, and that he doesn't allow himself to glide into gloating and drinking from the "Schadenfreude" fountain. I think what I appreciate in this diary is the fact that hating and gloating over the defeat of the haters is just too easy a reaction, common, but too easy, imo.

  •  Very interesting diary (4+ / 0-)

    that asks us all how guilt free our gloat should be, where our empathy faces our anger.  I'm torn.

    I understand the diarist's point, and have often felt upon listening to ignorant, bigoted, hateful, fearful people, blessed not to be so. We don't choose where we are born or into what family, and we have as children little to fight back with, or even understand there's is something to fight.  It's a "there by the grace of God go it" kind of thing.

    At first I didn't look at the Tumblir pix. Read the diary and lots of the comments, then scrolled back up to look at the pix.  And that's when I got mad, all over again. The signs, the whiteness, and yes, the YOUTH and plenty of it in these pictures got my Irish up plenty.

    We think the right is all old white men? They're not. There's plenty of women and youthful people in this party, ready to carry on their support for everything I loathe. Instead of pity or empathy, I felt anger and resolved to fight them harder if they continue in their present path.

    Somehow their faces reminded me that while they might have a big sad now, they'll be back with a vengeance, probably with few lessons learned, and they will make it  necessary for us to fight them for a long time to come.

    And finally, I realized looking at those faces, how very good it is they lost, how very good it is they've been humbled, if only for 2 minutes.  And how very happy I am that those on our side of the aisle have smiles strung from one ear to the other.  We fought a good, fair battle and we won. This time.

    In the end I guess I'd rather spend my time being happy for us, than sad for them.

    "A typical vice of American politics is the avoidance of saying anything real on real issues." Theodore Roosevelt.

    by StellaRay on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 02:14:37 PM PST

  •  Holy shit what a terrible post (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JayRaye, Faroutman

    I was almost with you regarding the tragic aspect of Romney's followers, but sympathy? Fuck no. I have no sympathy for hateful bigots. And then you had to blow it with that incredibly dense, offensive analogy to Native Americans? Only a white person could write this.

  •  I Remember How I Felt... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Killer of Sacred Cows, JayRaye

    ...the morning after the 2004 election.  I was working for a major defense contractor on the Mississippi Gulf Coast, and I could probably count the number of Democrats in my company (of 15,000 workers) on one hand.  

    One part of me wants to feel sorry for the poor misguided SOBs who actually believed Romney/Ryan were ever interested in anyone except the 1%.  The other part remembers the weeks of gloating in 2004 (following their stolen 2000 election which Republicans still refuse to acknowledge) and I just can't feel any compassion.  

    They lost, we won.  Fuck sensitivity.  After all the many years of having to tolerate the likes of Limbaugh, O'Reilly, elected Republican leaders, and even on-line commenters  mocking anything and everything "Liberal," I say fuck a bunch of Republicans and everything they profess to believe in.  They lost, we won, and now we get another four years to fix the messes the last bunch of Republicans left behind.  

    Some day, there probably will be another Republican in the White House (unless the GOP melds down into something new and improved),  at which time they'll have another opportunity to undo any of the improvements Democratic leaders created.

    Fuck them.

  •  Mourners (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Killer of Sacred Cows, Faroutman

    I don't have an ounce of sympathy for any of them.

    "The test of our progress is not whether we add to the abundance of those who have much. It is whether we provide enough to those who have little. " --Franklin D. Roosevelt

    by jg6544 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 02:40:19 PM PST

  •  Those tears are tears of realization (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Killer of Sacred Cows, JayRaye

    No longer can they pretend that 2008 was just some fluke after Bush's downward popularity spiral (which many Republicans, at least here in VA, told themselves).  This is the new normal, and they don't like that fact.

    I'm already hearing sad jokes from certain southerners about kicking VA and FL out of the Sons of Confederate Veterans, since they're obviously too filled with Yankees to be considered properly southern.  All I can say is, just wait fellas.  GA and NC aren't that far behind.

    All your vote are belong to us.

    by Harkov311 on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 02:40:33 PM PST

  •  I was trying to feel sorry for them (4+ / 0-)

    but when I got to the one at Romney headquarters that someone has photoshopped Stefon  ( SNL character) in the center of I snorted my coffee,

    Good thing we've still got politics in Texas -- finest form of free entertainment ever invented.- Molly Ivins

    by loblolly on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 02:53:20 PM PST

  •  I look at those Tumblr pictures (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Killer of Sacred Cows, loblolly

    and read the twitter and Facebook comments from those people and I just think...

    Fuck you.  Deal with it, you ignorant, racist fucks.

    I have not on scintilla of a whiff of empathy or sympathy for them after reading  the comments about the "Death of America" and all the dog-whistle phrases used about food stamps and welfare.

    Fuck them.  Suck it, deal with it.

    Assholes.

  •  In fact, hope to give them a whole (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    loblolly, helpImdrowning

    lot more to piss and moan about.

    We Comal Co Dems are already planning our strategy for the next elections.

    Won't they just be bawling and bawling their eye balls out when Texas goes Blue!!!?

    Oh, my. The thot of all their tears just fills this old lady's heart with pure sweet joy.

    Nope, not even an ounce of sympathy. Already plotting to really give them something to cry about .

    Yours for (another) damn fine fight!
    JayRaye

    WE NEVER FORGET Our Labor Martyrs: a project to honor the men, women and children who lost their lives in Freedom's Cause. For Nov: Voting Rights Martyrs

    by JayRaye on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 04:21:42 PM PST

  •  agreed (0+ / 0-)

    I certainly browsed through that Tumblr like everyone else. What I found, though, is that I was ready and willing to laugh at the people who tweeted their crazy about revolution and communism and Australia's Christian male president -- but the photographs of people simply being disappointed that the guy they supported didn't win did nothing for me whatsoever.

    I've been the disappointed guy many times, and I'm sure I will be again -- so the photographs just seemed natural and honest to me. And while I don't generally agree with Republican ideology on much of anything, there are plenty of principled, intelligent and decent Republicans I can and do respect as people -- but in most of the photographs I had no way of telling whether the person I was looking at was one of those or a Tea Party loon.

    So yeah...I'll gladly mock the hell out of Donald Trump, and Victoria Jackson, and that woman who ranted about all her Republican friends not sharing her anti-Obama YouTube videos so that her hit count would go up. But I'm not going to hate on or make fun of a person just because they happened to prefer Romney, if I don't have any further reason to believe they're actually as insane as The Donald.

  •  I remember 2004 quite well (0+ / 0-)

    We were convinced Kerry had a good shot, not that he was going to win, and certainly not by a landslide.

    But looking at those woeful faces -- hopes smashed, the awful truth finally revealed -- it's hard not to remember election night 2004, when it became clear that lies and war crimes notwithstanding, President Cheney and his sidekick were going to be reelected despite our best efforts.
    What is easy to remember about 2004, is these very same faces represent those voters and power brokers who put Bush back in office after he started the Iraq war. It's not a schadenfraude thing with me, they just had it coming.
  •  This (0+ / 0-)
    I also know that they have been lied to, with ferocious intensity and relentless dedication, by the conservative propaganda machine and its political masters.
    I truly feel for those who have been lied to about the "fiscal cliff," tax policy, etc. and are conservative based on that. I don't feel the same empathy for racists, bigots, and religious fundamentalists hell-bent on forcing their beliefs on me and my daughters.

    This diary gave me a lot to ponder. Thank you for writing it.

    Uncultivated minds are not full of wild flowers, like uncultivated fields. Villainous weeds grow in them, and they are full of toads.--Logan Pearsall Smith

    by elizabethawilke on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 06:24:37 PM PST

  •  Oh come on. (0+ / 0-)

    There were people who had a big sad when slavery was abolished. When the Civil War was lost (still mourning). Had a big bad sad when Jim Crow was abolished withe the voting rights laws.

    They continually have a big sad when minorities suggest that they are equal citizens deserving of full rights and privileges of all citizens.

    They have had a big sad about gays, for decades and decades.

    They have had a big sad that women can control their own bodies.

    And finally they had a BIG BAD SAD that an African-American could actually become President of the United States.

    I have as much compassion for the people as cannibals who  has a big sad when they are thrown in jail for cooking people for dinner.

    Enough of their crap. Evolve or die.

    The Fierce Urgency of Later

    by Faroutman on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 06:42:52 PM PST

  •  Shit happens. (0+ / 0-)

    And then you deal with it or not.

    It would be great for Dems to be gracious about this and extend an olive branch on a personal level, but conservatives need to do some soul searching if they want to avoid irrelevance and it start with the facing reality that their philosophy and message is not cutting it any longer.

    What I found at the top of the page is a statement about losing because of demographics.

    If that is the conclusion and no more, they are not suffering enough yet.

    Dems need to move on with or without these people following; reach-out, sure, but move on nevertheless.

    What about my Daughter's future?

    by koNko on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 07:21:18 PM PST

  •  a big 'pray for America' sign has (0+ / 0-)

    gone up on  the main drag here.
    to me it is has that same feeling
    as the tears  an abuser cries
    the regrets of a sociopath
    it is so  self pitying
    they are not praying to help Obama
    they are not praying to help heal this country
    they are praying because they think this election spells doom for america and would love it if their god would only do what the election did not do.
    get it? it's the  nastiest most self absorbed prayer you ever did hear.
    let me tell you what that old american heartland is full of ..
    in all it's whiteness:
    meth, physical and sexual abuse, poverty, addiction, health issues, crime, ignorance, bitching, broken families, dependence, denial, and blame
    a lot of arrogant, bullying shits marching around, and a lot of other folks just following whatever those shits tell them.
    sooner or later, folks get tired of the extremists who just can't quit raging. i hope that happens. i hope people get tired of it enough they just want to move forward, like most peopple do.
     I'd say jobs and education are the only things that will make inroads here..
    usually the only thing that makes you realize the big bad  socialist,kenyan monster is neither bad nor a demon, is to get to know it. and eventually accept and even welcome it in ..guess what..your god loves everyone equally, right?
    you have to allow yourself to get some exposure to someone new, something new
    these folks are in a fuckin bubble.it needs to pop.they need to come out and interact with the world.
    i could careless about their big sad.
    I care more about getting the country moving forward.

  •  No Making Fun Here (0+ / 0-)

    Their agony, grief and incomprehension is not sad.  It is entirely justified and richly deserved.

    It is the result of self delusion and willful ignorance.  Notice, the first word in ignorance is "ignore."  They willfully denied all the facts, all the numbers, all the trends, all the demographics.   They decided to do this of their own accord.

    I went to school with nothing but people that looked like this.  We had one black person in our class, one person of Hispanic heritage, and couple Asians and people from the Middle East.  That was it.  Everyone else was second or third generation Americans, their parents all from various countries in Europe.

    I still have no sympathy for them, and comparing these photos to pictures of Geronimo is sick and inappropriate.  It's not the color of the skin, and it's not so much their politics, which are wrong, but, overriding all, it's unjustifiable cocksureness and arrogance that far too many of them (though I'm sure not all of them, let's be fair) have evidenced in this election.  (And, most likely, going forward from this point as well.  Very few will have learned the lessons of this election on a long term basis.)

    I'm happy to dine at Schadenfreude Buffet.  I'd like seconds, please.

  •  Bigots, crackers, haters and thumpers. (0+ / 0-)

    Take that transvaginal-ultrasound-promoting motherfuckers.

    You would let your neighbor starve or lose their home without batting an eye. Embarrassment and shame isn't punishment enough for you.

    "Life is short, but long enough to get what's coming to you." --John Alton

    by Palafox on Sun Nov 11, 2012 at 11:18:23 PM PST

  •  I can't muster up any sympathy (0+ / 0-)

    One of my most vivid memories of 2004 was all those hateful people at the gop convention wearing fake purple hearts.

    I'm a southern boy too Bill, but unlike you, I never was made to feel like those were my people. That was their intent then and fifty plus years on nothing's changed.

  •  A limited amount of sympathy (0+ / 0-)

    God help me...in my case it also involves a lot of my friends and family.  Old high school chums (at a meeting of our class reunion committee, I was the only Obama supporter at the table and the guy next to me actually bought the "secret Muslim born in Kenya" nonsense), family (my own mother and stepfather, siblings), women I've dated, women I'm dating now (not many Obama supporters in the Alabama dating pool, at least not my age).  

    Lots of hurt on their side.  But I don't care.

    A few of the choice bits from my Facebook feed:

    Well folks time for bed so I can get up and go to work and pay more taxes for all of Osamas peeps that get a check!!! And hope I keep a job since our prez wants to increase taxes on the wealthy to give to the 47% of sorry asses that voted him ina check! I don't guess he thinks about the wealthy payin folks like us that support the47% that are too lazy to work but hey maybe I can get in that 47% butI doubt it!!! Night my friends at least 47% of us will sleep good tonight and half the day tommorrow!!!!!!!"
    So... If he doubles everything...we will be 32 TRILLION out, 40% per cent un-employed, and have 12 guys guarding the nation. Great Job, voters. Get ready to learn another language...
    What won on Tuesday: Marxism, abortion, Obama phones, transgender, homosexuality, open borders. See for yourself as students celebrate outside the White House! Living through Hope & Change is like being trapped in a septic tank as it fills up with sewage
    Just a question. Since all of the O-zombies were going to riot, burn and kill if he wasn't re-elected, does this mean I can go hold up a liquor store with no shame?
    I really don't want to associate with anyone who could support that man. I do not understand it....
    Now the trick is to hold back the tears and act as though everything is ok to my kids this morning
    I'm sorry, no.  I have no sympathy for these people.  None.  Nada.  Zip.  

    My own mother raised me to be the opposite of all of this--to look after those lesser than me, to share, to get an education...then she drank the kool-aid and took it all back to justify someone she voted for.

    These people consider their ignorance their most prized possession, and one of the right-wing lies being debunked with the truth, as a form of violence.  If they got everything they ever wanted, only to find out the neighbor across the street has just as much and is just as happy, they'd feel like they'd been held up at gunpoint.

    I'm sorry, I'm done.  I'm just done.  Someone will sympathize with these people but it won't be me.  God help me I should be better than that, but I'm not.  I remember what it was like 8 years ago and the amount of sympathy I got from that side was zip.  I even send a consoling message to a friend who was swearing up and down a day earlier that Romney would win, only to get my head bitten off.  These people don't know sympathy.

    It's not that I want to enjoy their suffering.  It's just that I'm coldly oblivious to it.

    “Nice country you got here. Shame if something were to happen to it” --the GOP philosophy to governing as described by Paul Krugman

    by dwayne on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 02:16:34 AM PST

  •  Late to the party (0+ / 0-)

    Man, I missed me some billmon.

    ~ have a powerful day ~

    by moeman on Mon Nov 12, 2012 at 01:31:14 PM PST

  •  Thanks (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Panurge

    Bill, thanks for this.  I feel the same.  The folks on the other side are not our enemies, not our foes, not crazed deranged sado-masochists.  At least by and large.  

    They're us.  And they deserve better than Karl Rove, George Bush, Bill O'Reilly and Rupert Murdoch.  They deserve better than being conned.  All of us, smart or dumb, tall or short, left or right, need to demand more and better from each other.

    If you think you're on the side of the angels, then you should be happy to behave the way you wish they would: with toleration, kindness, striving for mutual understanding, etc.  I think that's the President's approach, and it would do us all some good to follow it.

  •  Wow! (0+ / 0-)

    That was really good writing. I particularly liked "Rwandan-style hate speech". I have often thought that that is really what it is, that it's the reason Dr. Tiller is dead, Gabby Giffords is brain damaged and the people who came to listen to her dead or wounded.  Those Republicans have been subjected to propaganda for years and though they might identify as Republicans no matter what happens, I don't think they would  ,most of them,be hateful Republicans if they hadn't been subjected to 24/7 brainwashing .for years

    48forEastAfrica - Donate to Oxfam> "It is better to light a candle than to curse the darkness." Edna St.V. Millay

    by slouching on Wed Nov 14, 2012 at 12:02:31 AM PST

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