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Because I'm feeling kind of random.  But I was catching up on NCIS as I do - on the internet - and the whole episode was all ANGRY WHITE MAN SEEKS DAUGHTER LOST TO SEX TRAFFICKERS.  Now I'm not trying to say that doesn't happen or doesn't exist - there are far too many instances of women and children being sold into sexual slavery to deny it.

BUT...the tee vee seems to be kind of weirdly focused on this smothering rage of white men that their little princesses might BE VIOLATED.  Even the shows I've caught lately that haven't been about WHITE GIRL KIDNAPPED have been about dad's and their creepy pervert protectiveness if their daughters and their virginity.  

Not their daughters as people - as walking virginity.

That really creeps me out.

Now it creeps me out because it's creepy and demeaning to women and girls as people - but also because it reminds me of my own weird relationship with my father and his obsession with my sex life 20 years ago.

Because even now, as an adult aged 43 - my parents are convinced my "gender issues" are really about who I had sex with at age 18 - 20 they didn't approve of - because well, girls aren't supposed to have or like sex with anyone, including their husbands.  Women that like sex are whores and sluts by this lack of logic.  And changing means that someone must have been really terrible at it. (True, some of them were pretty terrible at it, but who isn't at first?  Not a cause.)

They aren't related in the slightest.  Living in here, I know this.  But to them - there is this whole weird world where women are not people and dreams and aspirations and even relationships are crushed by this overwhelming need to control other people's sexuality and purity.  And by other people I mean vagina holders - because men are just fine and don't need quizzing about who they had sex with at 18 - 20 that wasn't parent approved.

My brother doesn't get asked these kinds of questions.  He gets congratulated for being sexually active back then.  Me - not so much.  Even being the first kid to get married and even "looking normal" isn't enough - because they know that evil vagina is still lurking in my pants fooling people.  Really.  I've had whole throw down phone fights about how I am "misleading" people by being myself - because somewhere genitals are used for secret greetings or something and they are worried I can't do the penis shake - I can.  Just for the record.  I'd be a pretty crap orthodox Jew if I couldn't show my snippage.  But that just infuriates them too - whole other diary. LOL

But this weird thing about men and purity needs to stop.  It wrecked my relationship with my dad - I went from being a kid to being a vagina with legs that MUST STAY SHUT when I still wanted to goof off and hang out with my dad.  It warped everything.  He couldn't talk to me as a person anymore.  He was worried about things I didn't know or care about - but he sure thought I was just out there letting anyone grope and rub and feel - I didn't have friends, much less anyone trying to get in my pants at 12.

My mum felt like puberty was some kind of permission to let me into the secret shitty world of womanhood - where everything hurts all the time and you just have to deal with it and smile.  No child should ever hear about their parents disappointment with their intimate life.  With details.  It's just gross.  There was no sympathy for the horror of being phobic at the sight of my own blood - tampax would "ruin me" so I had to stare at pads.  Pills?  We don't need no stinking pills, just deal with the pain, it's the way it's supposed to be.

Thank G-d for Coach F.  He taught the best sex ed class (and only sex ed class) I ever took - but he had the facts and he gave them to us in 1984.  He talked about AIDS. As much as you could in 1984 which wasn't a lot - but he was like - "Um, condoms are a good idea if you like other guys, because I don't want anyone dying because they didn't know they could at least try to protect themselves. So just remember that if you find yourself a gay adult at some point."  He was the bomb and he's still teaching.  He taught us we were people, in charge of what happened with our bodies - and that we could do things to protect ourselves, no matter who we were or who we were attracted to within our species and proper legal age requirements - and it was ok.  That was a man who empowered girls to be women.  

I remember when I was about 14 and had some particularly crap secondary melody line in some fairly complicated orchestra piece and I made the mistake of complaining about it.  Now I had been immersed in science and anthropology and politics from about age 9.  I wasn't sure if I was going to be an astronaut, Indiana Jones or Maggie Thatcher (shut up, it was a republican home, I got better) or all three.  And she looked at me and told me how lucky I was to play flute, because when I was 30 and a hausfrau I would be able to play on my couch and make everything better.  I was just stunned and went back to my room.

Even to my mum, I was just a vagina, waiting for someone to own me and make me a hausfrau - what I wanted or planned didn't matter.

Don't do that to your daughters.  Let them be people.

Originally posted to Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 01:24 AM PST.

Also republished by Sluts and TransAction.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Tip Jar (18+ / 0-)

    And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

    by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 01:24:07 AM PST

  •  Yeah, it's creepy (7+ / 0-)

    No wonder it creeps you out.

    How wounding.

    How dehumanizing.

    And yet you still are a human, no matter what anyone has ever said.  Sorry about the bullshit.  We all need more Coach F's in this life.

    •  the crap was counterbalanced (7+ / 0-)

      with the David Bowie educational system:

      1. If that shit isn't working, change it.

      2. Never be afraid to be yourself.  SOMEONE will think it's the shit.

      So there was that and it helped a lot.  And I'm 43 and not really in the mood to put up with a lot of shit - and as a dude who really likes Tae Kwon Do - I don't really have to anymore.

      But I worry about the girls who do have to deal with that kind of weirdo shit messaging.  Because it's gross and creepy and not productive.  Some women may really want to be mums - and that is awesome.  But having a vagina is not a sentence to motherhood if you don't want that - nor should it be.

      Hell, it's not even a sentence to being female.

      And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

      by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 02:50:41 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Fellow Whorish Slut Sex Maniac Vagina Holder (4+ / 0-)


        If it makes you feel any better. I am teaching my kids that their vagina is an organ, not a life sentence.


        •  that is at least accurate LOL (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Joy of Fishes, GreenMother

          because it's not - I'm living proof.

          But it's not a bad thing to be cool with being female either.  I wouldn't wish the whole "gender, what is that stupid idea?" on anyone in our very binary society.  Because I pretty much think gender is a stupid idea and largely useless to me personally.  

          This lack of concern about people's genitals has caused a lot of grief in my life.  So apparently, people are supposed to feel strongly about it one way or another.  I don't.

          And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

          by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 12:59:39 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  My daughter... (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        asym, Joy of Fishes, Mortifyd

        has decided at 9 that she is never getting married and will adopt her children. She wants children. She's just not so into pregnancy or boys. Of course she's 9 that could change. Either way it's up to her.

        She's also started the first stages of puberty and we've gone over what to expect, etc. But I keep things realistic, and there will be Pamprin et. all when the time comes.

        I do understand your point. My dad was less..obvious about it than yours was I think. But before 12 we could go out with our friends, weekend curfew was a more malleable thing, if there was a holiday skating party that ran until midnight, that was fine so long as we all stayed together. As soon as we hit those teen years curfew was 10:30 no matter what, even if the school dance didn't start until 9:30. And most of the time he found an excuse to ground us so we couldn't go out at all. I didn't have any brothers to compare it with, we were all girls.

        "Madness! Total and complete madness! This never would've happened if the humans hadn't started fighting one another!" Londo Mollari

        by FloridaSNMOM on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 06:19:07 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  but you know what she wants and can say it (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          FloridaSNMOM, Joy of Fishes

          which is way ahead of my folks.  Yep, she could change her mind a dozen or more times between now and being an adult - but that's what you DO as a kid, you try things on and check them out and determine who you are.

          My parents were always strict, and I wasn't invited to any dances.  When you walk around dressed like Tom Baker - I suppose it's understandable. :P (the 4th Doctor, for those of you who are not familiar with ancient Who lore.)  

          Then I moved up to Serious Moonlight Bowie - that didn't really help.  Though I got more male gay friends (2!) at that point and that was cool.

          The fact that what I said and wanted and dreamed was just not taken seriously and dismissed - was not cool.  There was never any room in my life for having babies myself.  NO.  That's an alien and I'm NOT doing it.  I love kids - I love my stepkids, I would love to adopt kids - but they don't let people like me have kids.  So I won't have any.  And I'm deeply sad about it sometimes, but lets face it, I know what having a crazy parent is like - and no kid needs that.  

          And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

          by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 01:07:12 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

  •  This diary struck a chord with me today-thanks- (8+ / 0-)

    I've been dealing with my hostile 81 yr old mom, who favored her 4 sons and treated her 4 daughters as 'competition'. All my brothers are married and doing well. All us girls are not married, or been married multiple times to abusive, alcoholics etc., and some how I'm beginning to understand the man-made religious gender dilemma..

    I never blamed it on my vagina before, but damn I do now believe the v-jay-jay is the root of all evil...OY!!

    "Time is for careful people, not passionate ones."

    "Life without emotions is like an engine without fuel."

    by roseeriter on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 02:56:02 AM PST

    •  I didn't have to deal with the "competition" (4+ / 0-)

      aspect - but I saw friends have to deal with it.  It was a whole level of creepy I was glad we didn't have frankly - because some of them had grabby dads or step dads.  My dad was just horrified that I was "ripe" or something and seeing threatening peens everywhere.  I wanted to read Heinlein and make D&D maps - I was not interested in sex at all for years.

      That's definitely something I think that grows from the same sick root.  I was expected to be a confidant - because my mum was lonely and didn't trust the women who were her peers not to talk.

      I just did not need a view into that adult world of sexuality and power struggles as a child - it did me no good at all.

      And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

      by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 03:03:30 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Mortifyd... (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Joy of Fishes, Mortifyd
        I wanted to read Heinlein and make D&D maps - I was not interested in sex at all for years.
        I'm only a year younger than you... and I think if we'd grown up near each other we would have been good friends as kids! This is exactly where I and my small group of friends were at this age. Boys came much later. Even my boy friends were interested in Heinlein, Asimov, and D&D.  

        "Madness! Total and complete madness! This never would've happened if the humans hadn't started fighting one another!" Londo Mollari

        by FloridaSNMOM on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 06:24:01 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  all my friends were boys when I had any (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          FloridaSNMOM, Joy of Fishes

          because all I cared about was science fiction and D&D.  If I had the occasional female friend she had a lot of brothers  or she was able to roll with I was weird and thought like a boy.  Because I just didn't care about all that girl stuff.

          I think my parents thought I would at some point - they are still bitterly disappointed.  I got a wifeish instead, she loves all that girly stuff so I don't have to - while also being cool with Heinlein and D&D.

          I call her my wifeish because I discovered our marriage was not legal after the fact.  But we are still semi legally bound and I don't really plan to change it anytime soon.

          And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

          by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 12:54:17 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I used to run over my sister's barbie dolls (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Mortifyd, Joy of Fishes

            with my tonka trucks when I was younger. I played war with the boys, and I too didn't care about the girl stuff. I wore dresses to church because my mom made me, but that was about it.
            My daughter is an odd mix of a tom boy and a girlie girl. She can talk girl stuff with the best of them, and she loves to draw clothing designs, but she grew up with a big brother and can hold her own with the boys just as well. Maybe it helps that she was raised with boffer swords (SCA kid) and playing pirates and knights, and rough housing with a much older autistic big brother?

            But we never put any expectations on her one way or the other. She likes crafty stuff, she likes dolls, but she also has a WWE wrestling ring and wrestling figures, luchador masks, remote controlled cars and lots of legos. Her interests are wide and varied and have little to do with gender expectations.

            "Madness! Total and complete madness! This never would've happened if the humans hadn't started fighting one another!" Londo Mollari

            by FloridaSNMOM on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 02:01:21 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  that's very cool (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              FloridaSNMOM, Joy of Fishes

              I wish that I had been able to do more of the things I wanted - but things were tight and my parents are pretty confined in their gender roles even now.  Which is why I think we have so many problems between us - to them I am still a "runaway" girl who needs to come home and behave.  I don't have time for that bullshit.

              I was not allowed to do things I was interested in because they were too "boyish."  I was forced to wear a patch on my jacket declaring my gender to the world because I looked like a boy.  I could play soldier because there were lady soldiers - but I was supposed to be support personnel, not shooting.  I liked the shooting part.

              You are clearly not doing that. LOL

              And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

              by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 02:24:45 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  ((Mortifyd)) (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Joy of Fishes, Mortifyd

                No, not at all what we're doing. That doesn't mean her father and brother won't turn overprotective when she hits her teen years however. Just that it will be more moderated by everything else.. and me.

                I'm sorry you went through all that BS. And I agree, you shouldn't put up with it now either. Be yourself. That's always the best move in my book.
                As for the dances, I didn't have dates either at least not until my Jr. year. But I would have liked to have had the opportunity to go to a few of them, when my friends went stag as well. I was the oldest of three girls with a wood furnace and a garden and 2 acres of land that needed tending. My dad is an alcoholic. Unless he wanted to do all that yard work himself he couldn't force me to be too girly. I was often my father's 'only son' at least in the chores department. My sisters stayed inside and helped my mom with the housework. At least until I graduated and moved out.

                "Madness! Total and complete madness! This never would've happened if the humans hadn't started fighting one another!" Londo Mollari

                by FloridaSNMOM on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 03:06:39 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  I was confused by all the "dating" crap (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:

                  though I had friend boys who would occasionally serve as "dates" when required - I did go to prom for example.  But I was never allowed to go anywhere alone after bleeding struck, despite looking male myself.  

                  My bestie was 6'4" and as much a dork as I was - he neither groped nor fondled - my father mostly believed he was ok.  So I had a male chaperone anytime I left the house other than school.  Because OMG vagina.

                  We lived in army housing a lot - no yards to mow or in some places soldiers did it for us - Ft Leavenworth military prisoners mowed the lawns.  And rapists and murderers bagged at the commisary.

                  My dad is also an alcoholic and I will never watch The Great Santini ever again.  He would drag me out of bed at 3 am to watch it with him.  I also know far more about Viet Nam than anyone my age has any right to unless they are Vietnamese.  How this squared with his purity protection freakout I have no idea.  But there it is.  We are just a mess as far as mixed messages go.

                  And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

                  by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 05:10:02 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I won't watch (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:

                    Westerns or War movies for similar reasons. My dad never went over seas in Nam, he was in the Air Force but state side repairing planes to send back over.  

                    He was reserves by the time I was 4, and out completely by the time I was 9.  But he was still an alcoholic, controlling and abusive. Just in different ways than your parents. My mom is a recovering alcoholic, but she fell off the wagon sometimes, and I was always the confidant. After my youngest sister was born her ovaries went FUBAR and she started going through menopause every other month. When I was 20 she had a hysterectomy and was put on hormones which made things a lot better. Before that though, from the time I was 12 until I left at graduation she was unstable, kind of like Bi-polar. She would destroy the house and blame it on us. She threw a cereal box at my sister and sliced her head open and tried to blame that on me. I remember once she got stuck in the snow, and took her shoes off and ran through 4 foot snow drifts in her stockings a quarter mile home, leaving me and my sisters in the car.

                    As an adult my mom and I have had issues. I haven't talked to my dad in about 6 years. I've had to move back in with them twice. It never lasted long. The hard part is keeping in your mind that you are an adult now. There has to be some consensus on some things but you don't have to be under their thumb. You have to stand up for your rights as an adult.

                    "Madness! Total and complete madness! This never would've happened if the humans hadn't started fighting one another!" Londo Mollari

                    by FloridaSNMOM on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 05:32:18 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

    •  Ug! Have older female relatives who went through (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      FloridaSNMOM, Joy of Fishes, Mortifyd

      similar issues.

      Have given elderly sexist relatives fits of rage with my not caring about their effed up values.

      It felt good.

  •  even Paula Broadwell must have had that treatment (4+ / 0-)

    because the first two days of news stories about her it wasn't even clear that she had a husband and two children somewhere in the background. They actually quoted her Father about what kind of a person she was...I thought that was creepy and weird and it certainly fits your diary scenario. It would have made sense if they dug up the hidden hubby and asked him, but no...

    ps- I experienced a little bit of distance from my Dad throughout puberty, which I didn't even realize what was different until he hugged me good-bye at school and I realized I hadn't had a bear-hug from him in several years. But I can understand how a blossoming teen can unnerve even a Daddy for a minute, Dads are still men and beauty is still beauty. It's just their job to deal with it, not put it into anger frustration and fear that comes out on the daughter.

    •  I suppose some girls do "blossom" (4+ / 0-)

      me - not so much.  I look like a man because I'm male and always have been.  There was no sudden visit by the tit fairy or being all cutesy - I thought that was gross.  

      So there was no flowering of femininity to be all freaky about, just a vagina I wasn't nearly as concerned about as he was.

      And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

      by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 03:23:54 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  so I was sort of confused by your whole story- (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        were you a female teen who has now changed over? (Sorry for not getting it, I did see your references to penises etc. but I didn't quite follow what you were saying all the way.) At any rate, I was an early bloomer, period at 11, overflowing a c-cup by 13, with raging hormones to go with it. In today's day and age my parents would have been under great pressure to put me on the pill (and by the heaviness of my periods it might have been justified in my particular case) but it also would have been (in my mind at least) a license to...When my own daughter was that age many of her friends had been put on it prophylacticly, but I personally stood against that because I believed in teaching the just say no until you're 18...It almost worked...

        •  I believe technically it's called being (2+ / 0-)

          transgendered, but I don't particularly think that label fits well.   I have a vagina, yes.  I also have a penis of sorts that grew from hormones (enough to have had a bris) and really don't pay much attention to or use either of them.  My wifeish is 3200 miles to the west of me on open ocean - I don't need to use them.  That's for me and her when we get out shit together in one sock.

          I am not particularly "out" about my situation AT ALL, being in the orthodox community and all.  That's private stuff unless I get pissed off or weirded out enough to say something.

          For me, there was no blooming.  Just cramps and blood everywhere - no tits, no hips,  just acne to hell and back, hair in places girls weren't supposed to grow it and a whole lot of confusion.

          I'm also mildly autistic - enough to have some issues, not so bad I can't mostly fake it with other people - but that is mostly what I'm doing - faking it.  So the whole freak out about OMG PROTO WHORE made no sense to me, as I was a little boy inside who liked dystopian fiction and D&D.  Boys? Were for playing more D&D.  Girls?  Unless they read or played D&D we had nothing really in common other than an organ.  

          And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

          by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 12:17:26 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  I am also confused... (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        FloridaSNMOM, Mortifyd

        ...but that is not unusual for me.  

        There are far too many people in this culture who think they can impose their obsession on controlling female parts on the rest of us.  It is infuriating, it is hurtful and damaging, and sometimes it is deadly.

    •  eh, no worries (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Joy of Fishes

      I can live with it and have done my own thing for 26 years away from them, and will keep on doing it after 7 or so months at my folks house - I figure that is all I can stand and the moorage will be due then anyway.  

      I worry about the girls mostly.  Because random Jewish guy can't just tell girls that it's ok to be themselves.  That someone will like them for whoever they are and share interests with them - but it is kind of a hard search sometimes, and being picky is ok too.  They don't owe anyone attention or have to accept unwanted attention.

      And the hidden kids too - like me - who are someone else on the inside - there is no way I can tell them it will be ok - because a lot of the time it's not.  And I don't know how to fix that for them.

      And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

      by Mortifyd on Thu Nov 29, 2012 at 10:22:18 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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