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Hamas leader Khaled Meshaal makes it clear there is no room for the state of Israel in his vision of the future.

"Today is Gaza. Tomorrow will be Ramallah and after that Jerusalem then Haifa and Jaffa," he told a rally on Saturday. Ramallah is in the West Bank, while Haifa and Jaffa are a part of Israel, though with sizeable Arab populations.

On Sunday he said at the Gaza Islamic University, "we do not accept the two-state solution," or Palestinian statehood alongside Israel.

Nice.

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Comment Preferences

  •  and Moshe Feiglin (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    happymisanthropy, SCFrog

    has a better idea?

  •  HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! (8+ / 0-)

    Sorry, I usually stay away from I/P, but...

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

    They're just gonna keep doing the same shit over and over until reality relents and makes a circle into a square, huh?

    In Roviet Union, money spends YOU!

    by Troubadour on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 04:37:48 PM PST

  •  Can you explain for me (0+ / 0-)

    how Hamas fits into the Paestinian government and how power do they have in the government, if any?  This has always been the missing piece for me.  The only thing I know is they were democratically elected (thanks to Bush).

    •  In brief, they organized as a political party (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      US Blues, volleyboy1, RedPencil

      which won a decisive number of seats in parlaiment in 2006, and in latter years has been in a coalition with other parties.  It's compllcated, of course.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/...

      "The extinction of the human race will come from its inability to EMOTIONALLY comprehend the exponential function." -- Edward Teller

      by lgmcp on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 04:54:10 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Gaza and West Bank (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      lgmcp, Smoh

      Palestinian territory, as I understand, is politically divided into two territories. West Bank is controlled by Mahmood Abbas from PLO (Arafat party) and Gaza is now under the electoral control of Hamas.

      In the past, PLO could arguably come to negotiate to the peace table as a representative of all Palestinians, not any more. U.S. and Israel while still are willing to recognize PLO as a legitimate representative, don't recognize Hamas as anything other than as a terrorist organization.

      Hamas, much like the current Bibi administration in Israel believes in unilateral resolution by violence and force.
       

    •  Basically, Hamas governs Gaza (informally) (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      lgmcp, volleyboy1, Smoh, Farugia

      and the PLO governs the West Bank (both de jure and de facto).  The two parts should be governed as one but Hamas had a strong showing in local elections which seemed to be followed up by basically a coup.  So now Hamas controls the poorer and more radical Gaza but can't really make inroads into the West Bank, whereas the more pragmatic PLO controls the West Bank and claims de jure right to govern Gaza but can't actually do so.  Neither party seems to have the ability to dislodge the other.

      It's a serious barrier to peace and a huge barrier to final status negotiations because the two have very divergent interests and goals and it's difficult to see how the two territories reconcile.

      Imagine, say, a nation made out of Michigan where an armed rebel group takes over the Upper Peninsula but the rest of the state is unable to do anything about it.  It's a permanent standoff.

      "The first drawback of anger is that it destroys your inner peace; the second is that it distorts your view of reality. If you come to understand that anger is really unhelpful, you can begin to distance yourself from anger." - The Dalai Lama

      by auron renouille on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 09:43:38 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  And the right in Israel does not accept it (8+ / 0-)

    Including members of the current government.

    Let all the Bush tax cuts expire

    by Paleo on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 04:43:19 PM PST

    •  The right in Israel accepts elections. (6+ / 0-)

      Netanyahu has twice stepped down.

      If the Palestinians want the left to win in Israel, they have an easy way to do it: 1. stop trying to murder Israelis. 2. stop talking about murdering Israelis.

      •  Since that's proven so productive in the past... (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ZenTrainer, corvo, WattleBreakfast, Smoh

        Likewise, all Israel has to do is end the punitive blockade that limits food and medicine imports, and vacate the settlements...

        The problem is neither party is making any move in the right direction, and continued aggression from the other side makes it less and less likely to happen in the future.

        •  And in response to that Hamas will step up the (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          JamieG from Md, Anima, Farugia

          attacks. In fact, they will do it no matter what Israel does.

          •  Quite possibly because they've learned that (4+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            WattleBreakfast, stargaze, FG, Smoh

            stopping the attacks does nothing.  Similarly, Israel has learned that stopping settlement expansion doesn't do much good, either.

            Pointing at one side and screaming that it's all the other's fault just doesn't make much sense.

            I'll admit that I'm most sympathetic to Palestinian civilians, since they tend to end up dead the most often, and don't have a whole lot of prospects for economic success (Exports are blockaded, too, as a pure collective punishment measure - Israel is not worried about the Palestinians exporting weapons to Iran, methinks).

        •  Not trying to murder people worked for me. (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Anima, volleyboy1, Farugia

          For 37 years so far. It's been very productive.

          I heartily recommend everyone try it.

          "Likewise, all Israel has to do is end the punitive blockade that limits food and medicine imports, and vacate the settlements..."

          The blockade is there to reduce the accumulation of rockets in Gaza. No rockets -- no blockade.

          •  That argument doesn't work. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            stargaze

            Not when they limit (Not block) food.  At various times, they've blocked wheelchairs, chocolate, limited medical supplies, etc.  They also block exports, limiting economic development.  It's clearly an economic blockade, not a purely economic on.

            I'll add that, in fact, most Palestinians have not killed anyone, either, and it hasn't proven very productive.  I'd even go so far as to posit that a greater portion of Israel's population has kill Palestinians than the other way around.  (There are a lot more Palestinian deaths, and fewer Israelis to have caused them.  Also, Israel has mandatory military service).

            •  *economic blockade, not a purely military one (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Smoh
            •  So how about this... (0+ / 0-)

              Hamas agrees that everything that is shipped through Israeli crossings has to come through on an Israeli vehicle.

              Have all goods for Gaza delivered to the U.N. and then have the U.N. AND Israeli inspectors go through it, and then ship the wheelchairs, chocolate, limited med. supplies on Israeli vehicles into Gaza.

              THUS.... Gaza gets the supplies it claims to need and Israel get the security it does need.

              Looks like a win-win for all sides.

              "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

              by volleyboy1 on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 03:25:00 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  Correction... All goods coming to the strip (0+ / 0-)

                not just the ones through the Israeli Crossings.

                "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

                by volleyboy1 on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 03:26:25 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  For exports, at least, (0+ / 0-)

                  it's been written that Israel inspections don't allow for the cheap shipping available elsewhere, preventing competition internationally...And this is for the West Bank.

                  Surely they won't be treating Gaza any better.

                  I'd love to see the settlements dismantled, the blockades go away, the violence from both sides end, and a Palestinian state...  I just don't see any path for any of that to happen, regardless of what either side tries to do.

                  •  I don't know... I don't really see any realistic (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Flying Goat, JNEREBEL

                    paths that anyone, Israeli, Palestinian, American or anyone else really "likes". I am not sure there is one. I know what I would like to see, but that might not be what you or someone else would like.

                    And that is the problem. No one is going to get what they want no matter what.

                    "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

                    by volleyboy1 on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 04:57:52 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

              •  Claims? There's a question? (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Flying Goat

                Cats are better than therapy, and I'm a therapist.

                by Smoh on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 03:34:51 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

  •  Well that's useful. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    volleyboy1, corvo

    "The extinction of the human race will come from its inability to EMOTIONALLY comprehend the exponential function." -- Edward Teller

    by lgmcp on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 04:50:20 PM PST

  •  In other breaking news (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    AoT, happymisanthropy, corvo, Smoh

    water is wet and the sky is blue.

    So, obviously, Israel has to bomb Gaza into submission until Hamas utterly surrenders this defining feature of its charter.

    Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free
    ¡Boycott Arizona!

    by litho on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 04:59:38 PM PST

  •  Wonder why Israel doesn't have hellfire drones yet (0+ / 0-)

    Kind of surprised, actually.

    "Michael Moore, who was filming a movie about corporate welfare called 'Capitalism: A Love Story,' sought and received incentives."

    by Bush Bites on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 05:35:49 PM PST

    •  Hey, I'm not fond of a two-state solution either! (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      a2nite

      Of course, my hoped-for one-state solution would begin with the ruthless extirpation of people like Meshaal who'd make a pluralist single-state impossible. If he really thinks a single state on the Hamas model is possible then he's crazier than Joseph Kony.  At least the radical Right in Israel can point to an actual non-failed state on basically all of the territory they hoped for.

      You know, I sometimes think if I could see, I'd be kicking a lot of ass. -Stevie Wonder at the Glastonbury Festival, 2010

      by Rich in PA on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 05:47:59 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Maybe two-state can work as a transition stage. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        a2nite

        But I was serious about the drones.

        You'd think they'd have 'em by now.

        Maybe they figure that would lead to more terrorism?

        "Michael Moore, who was filming a movie about corporate welfare called 'Capitalism: A Love Story,' sought and received incentives."

        by Bush Bites on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 05:59:20 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Two state makes the most sense (4+ / 0-)

        Otherwise Palestinians would be second class citizens with no voting rights and suppressed by the IDF AND their native government.  However I've seen your posts before, and human dignity is low on your level of priorities.

        This is just a case of two right wing nutcase factions, one in Israel the other in Palestine, going at each other.  Except one has more guns.

        And if israel essentially turns fascist, then I'd call it a failed state.

        Romney/Caligula 2012!

        by sujigu on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 06:20:51 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Human vanity is low on my list of priorities. (0+ / 0-)

          So I agree with the thrust of your characterization of my views,  just with a slight twist, in my favor predictably enough.

          You know, I sometimes think if I could see, I'd be kicking a lot of ass. -Stevie Wonder at the Glastonbury Festival, 2010

          by Rich in PA on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 03:47:14 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  It's a long-standing concern (0+ / 0-)

          in Israel (i.e. that an Arab majority will form and basically vote Israel as a Jewish state back out of existence), so there's quite a few pragmatists in Israel who want the Palestinians to have a separate state they can go to.

          You can understand Israeli frustration when their two options seem to always be "Be the bad guy oppressive minority in a new Apartheid state" or "Acquiesce to the creation of an independent country which wants to destroy us."

          Not that I condone a lot of the evil crap Israel has done over the years, but if ever there's a real historical use for the phrase "A plague on both your houses", it plays out daily over there.

          "A good president does what's possible and a great president changes what's possible." --sterno

          by sk4p on Sat Dec 15, 2012 at 06:09:58 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

  •  When the Palestinians (10+ / 0-)

    Put down their weapons there will be pease. When the Israelis put down their weapons there will be a lot of dead Israelis.

  •  meanwhile, (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    corvo, Smoh

    while Hamas fantasizes about rebuilding Arab cities in Israel, Israel builds actual cities on the West Bank.

    It's been a hundred years, isn't it time we stopped blaming Captain Smith for sinking the Titanic?

    by happymisanthropy on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 06:07:57 PM PST

    •  So one is effectively evil (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      letsgetreal, ConfusedSkyes

      while the other just dreams of it?  

      Romney/Caligula 2012!

      by sujigu on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 06:22:54 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Israel has other alternatives. (5+ / 0-)

        Palestine has none.

        It's been a hundred years, isn't it time we stopped blaming Captain Smith for sinking the Titanic?

        by happymisanthropy on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 06:26:22 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  The apologism for radical rightwing religious (6+ / 0-)

          nuttery in these comments is astounding.

          •  Are you surprised? (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            TLS66

            "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

            by volleyboy1 on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 06:46:35 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  I just don't understand what compels them. (0+ / 0-)

              Of course, religious rightwingers are in power in Israel right now, which I'm sure when is pointed out in a diary doesn't cause them to come in and lambast Palestinian rightwing leadership.

              •  I don't see water rights in context of religion (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                bluedust, Smoh

                I remember reading articles about cisterns being broken as being "illegal', etc.

                There isn't anything inherently religious about water rights. When one group is taking and not sharing (especially when the other group had access to the water before) that's an issue of demanding equal rights.

                I think USA is spending $8 million a day on military aid to Israel. I don't know how many millions per day for Afghanistan and all the other bases.

                I'd rather my taxpayer money go for something useful.

                The boss needs you, you don't need him. -- France general strike, May 1968

                by stargaze on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 07:57:58 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  Hamas gives 2 shits about water rights. (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  volleyboy1

                  It's not out of line to point something out that is certainly related to the strife right now....i.e. Hamas's existence.

                  •  I care more about my taxmoney than what Hamas says (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Smoh

                    especially as I've read credible descriptions of how Israeli right-wing fanatics encouraged Palestinian right-wing fanatics because it's politically expedient.

                    I don't want $8 million per day of taxpayer money being spent on people who steal water, and that's what I tell my legislators.

                    I believe that USA taxmoney, including a lot of my tax money, is prolonging and making things worse by propping up Israeli right-wing fanatics.

                    I also believe USA should be out of Afghanistan, etc., and spend my and other taxpayer's money of stuff that actually helps people: affordable housing, healthcare, education, etc.

                    The boss needs you, you don't need him. -- France general strike, May 1968

                    by stargaze on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 08:04:36 AM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  So basically you came in to change the topic? (2+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      JNEREBEL, volleyboy1

                      That would be consistent since you changed the topic in this conversation as well.

                      •  Well the diary was quoting rhetoric (1+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        Smoh

                        and the way it was presented made me think the writer thought it was something that should be a great importance for progressives in general, and upthread there is discussion of religion as if that was very important to understanding the I/P situation.

                        What it looks like to me is that different groups of people are fighting over the same resources and THAT is much more a reason for the fighting than religion or rhetoric.

                        I get mad at people stealing water and saying it's a disagreement over religion, when it looks like a disagreement over water resources to me.

                        I get really mad when part of my taxmoney seems to being used to steal that water.

                        So that was the path my thinking took to go somewhere you think is "changing the subject".

                        The boss needs you, you don't need him. -- France general strike, May 1968

                        by stargaze on Tue Dec 11, 2012 at 12:01:30 PM PST

                        [ Parent ]

  •  The rhetoric of Hamas is less important (6+ / 0-)

    than its actions - unfortunately neither really indicate a deep-seated desire for either peace or a recognition that Israel is a reality.

    "The two pioneering forces of modern sensibility are Jewish moral seriousness and homosexual aestheticism and irony." Susan Sontag

    by Shane Hensinger on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 06:22:31 PM PST

  •  To me, this article is more interesting (0+ / 0-)

    That is to be expected: Hamas has said that before; it's in their charter.

    I find this to be much more interesting right now, however, since it's news to me:

    http://www.haaretz.com/...

    Click the ♥ to join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news & views written from a black pov - everyone is welcome.

    by mahakali overdrive on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 06:43:38 PM PST

    •  I hate Haaretz's new pay site (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      mahakali overdrive, volleyboy1

      I mean - really. I wanted to read that article!

      "The two pioneering forces of modern sensibility are Jewish moral seriousness and homosexual aestheticism and irony." Susan Sontag

      by Shane Hensinger on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 07:14:01 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  It seemed to let me in earlier but now (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Shane Hensinger

        it won't. Weird! I'm not a subscriber either. If I can access it again, I will post excerpts. It details Obama's plan for handling Netanyahu by letting Europe put pressure on him instead, but it's much more in depth than this. With all the speculation about Obama, I wondered how much of this was speculation too and how much was rooted in fact.

        Click the ♥ to join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news & views written from a black pov - everyone is welcome.

        by mahakali overdrive on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 07:32:29 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  Hamas can't accept Israel because of the (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ocschwar, volleyboy1, oldpunk, Smoh

    fundamentalist islamist religious belief that no non-muslim country can exist in a formerly muslim land. (nnmccefml). Remember when OBL said on video that he wanted Spain to again become Muslim--he wasn't kidding.  It's a core belief.

  •  If Meshaal wants to talk about intolerance... (0+ / 0-)

    He needs to look in the mirror! If he really respects Islam, he would recognize and respect Jews as fellow "people of the book." Hence to me, he and Hamas are as "Islamic" as pork!

  •  They never did. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    volleyboy1
  •  And this is news? (6+ / 0-)

    Hamas doesn't have the power -- politically or otherwise -- to realize its vision/revenge. So these statements are all bluster. That's not to say that Hamas isn't deadly but Israel is much moreso. To those who ask, "Why doesn't Hamas recognize Israel?" I ask, "Why doesn't Israel recognize the Palestinians?" To those who ask, "Why doesn't Hamas put down its weapons?" I ask, "Why doesn't Israel put down its weapons?" Israel IS the occupier -- it has a legal and moral obligation to end the occupation once and for all. It is in NO danger of being wiped off of anyone's map -- that can no longer be an excuse. End the occupation and begin the road to peace.

    The civil rights, gay rights and women's movements, designed to allow others to reach for power previously grasped only by white men, have made a real difference, and the outlines of 21st century America have emerged. -- Paul West of LA Times

    by LiberalLady on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 07:56:17 PM PST

    •  How does Israel "recognize the Palestinians?" (0+ / 0-)

      As what?

      "The two pioneering forces of modern sensibility are Jewish moral seriousness and homosexual aestheticism and irony." Susan Sontag

      by Shane Hensinger on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 08:01:48 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  perhaps she meant "Palestine" n/t (0+ / 0-)

        "Okay, until next time. Keep sending me your questions, and I will make fun of you... I mean, answer them." - Strong Bad

        by AaronInSanDiego on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 08:17:42 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  The fact that you have to ask this question (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        corvo, Smoh

        is concerning. Recognize their human rights and support their aspirations for a STATE, just like Israel, that has a right to exist in security.

        The civil rights, gay rights and women's movements, designed to allow others to reach for power previously grasped only by white men, have made a real difference, and the outlines of 21st century America have emerged. -- Paul West of LA Times

        by LiberalLady on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 08:42:41 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  More things Meshal said, and achieved (6+ / 0-)

    Visiting Gaza, Meshal's pronouncements went far beyond the language quoted in the diary:

    Mr. Meshal said the Jewish state would be wiped away through “resistance,” or military action. “The state will come from resistance, not negotiation,” he said. “Liberation first, then statehood.”

    His voice rising to a shout, Mr. Meshal said: “Palestine is ours from the river to the sea and from the south to the north. There will be no concession on any inch of the land.” He vowed that all Palestinian refugees and their descendants would one day return to their original homes in what is now Israel.

    He also promised Palestinian prisoners held in Israel that they would be freed using the same methods that had worked in the past — the kidnapping of Israelis and Israeli soldiers, ...

    Meshal spoke on December 8. It is amazing that this is the first diary to mention it. In fact, at least 48 hours went by without a single mention of Palestine in a diary here, perhaps a Daily Kos record.

    I don't know what Meshal was trying to achieve, but I'm pretty sure of two things he accomplished:

    1. Helping Netanyahu in the upcoming elections.  Maybe the two of them have a pact to stay in power via reciprocal bogeymanship.

    2. Casting a strange pall over the I/P discussion here. People who throng to a diary about the behavior of Orthodox men on Jerusalem buses don't seem to have anything to say about Meshal's rejection of negotiation or compromise and his advocacy of violent militarism to achieve maximalist goals. As one who hopes to find at least a shred of balance and reality-based discussion here, the reaction- actually lack of reaction - was pretty disappointing.

    I believe that all the people in the region desperately need leaders who can find a path to peace. Despite the assurances I have read here that, for example, the Hamas Charter no longer expresses Hamas policy, it seems clear that Meshal is not such a leader.

  •  "Two states" should never have been contemplated (6+ / 0-)

    The establishment of two states was a politically expedient move by the British in order to remove itself from its imperial obligations to remain until a proper settlement could be achieved to the mutual satisfaction of two irreconcilable groups.

    Exactly the same process happened in India around the same time with the division into India and Pakistan along religious lines. The model the British Foreign Office used was that employed in Ireland. There the allocation of most of the country to the Irish Free State while retaining Ulster to home the Protestant loyalists who would "never, never, never" leave the British crown led to the running sore of an imperfect solution. The ideal of giving independence to a united island was impossible because of threats of rebellion and terrorism from the likes of Carson.

    Actually the Irish Peace Settlement is now a fairly good model for the future of the land east of the sea and west of the Jordan. Accept both groups have ligitimate claims to both parts of the land but that in order to establish an indefinite short term peace there will be different political organisations in two parts.

    I have long thought that the rush to the imperial exit door post 1945 was a huge mistake and thoroughly irresponsible. Even at the costs of life and treasure, the country should have stayed to sort out a workable and agreed solution. The almost 70 years of conflict between the two factions in both I think support this argument. Would we now see two states on the Indian sub-continent with nuclear weapons who have had a series of wars and history of antipathy if Mountbatten had stood up to Jinnah and refused to establish a muslim state?  Would the British have created an artificial deadline to leave Palestine had they not been under pressure from the USA politically and the Jewish terrorist activities on the ground? If they had stayed and completed the negotiations - and knocked a few heads together on both sides to do so, could a workable division have been sorted out by 1950 and recurrent wars and suffering averted?

    "Who stood against President Obama in 2012?" - The trivia question nobody can answer.

    by Lib Dem FoP on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 09:24:01 PM PST

    •  Well - who knows? (3+ / 0-)

      When I was in India I asked the same question - most had no answer.

      The Gordian knot has been tied - it cannot be untied. The facts on the ground are now permanent - we have to work with the situation as it exists.

      Forcing people to live together carries with it great risks, especially when one or both populations within a state have powerful advocates and adversaries outside their borders. Just look at Cyprus if you want to see how trying it the other way turned out.

      "The two pioneering forces of modern sensibility are Jewish moral seriousness and homosexual aestheticism and irony." Susan Sontag

      by Shane Hensinger on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 10:58:43 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Well, since Israel apparently doesn't either (0+ / 0-)

    (to judge by its actions), I guess they're even on this issue.

  •  The Dog and the Bone (0+ / 0-)

    I think Israel agrees.   They were sort of holding their nose when they suggested two states in the first place.   The question is -- which one state.  Militarily speaking, it does look like the answer is...  "Israel".

    Which begs the question.   If you had a choice to have zero states, or one state, which would you choose?

    I am reminded of the old story of The Dog and the Bone.

    At the end of the story, the dog had nothing.

    •  Bullshit (0+ / 0-)

      Time and time again polls of Israelis have shown clear support for two state solutions.

      They just don't think it is ever going to happen, because people keep stabbing their babies and celebrating it.

      Yeah. That happened. Fogel family, 2011.

      I'm so sick of this false equivalency bullshit. Israel is the clear military power, the clear occupying party, and also the clear peace wanting side.

      Until 32 percent of the Palestinians don't approve of the murder of an infant, this isn't going to change.

      "The president was committed; elected on the basis that he was not Romney and Romney was a poopy head and you should vote against Romney and he won by two points." The increasingly irrelevant Grover Norquist

      by Wolfox on Mon Dec 17, 2012 at 10:47:46 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

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