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Surprise:

The prospect of a renewed assault weapons ban in the wake of the Connecticut school massacre has set of a round of buying, as thousands of Americans head to their local gun store to secure the popular AR-15 -- the model used by the school gunman -- before potential government prohibitions on their purchase.
And the ammo used in the AR-i5, the .223 round, is also flying off the shelves, as are high-capacity magazines.

And...

* The Colorado Bureau of Investigation says it set a new record for single-day background check submittals this past weekend.

In San Diego, Northwest Armory gun store owner Karl Durkheimer said Saturday "was the biggest day we've seen in 20 years. Sunday will probably eclipse that."

In southwest Ohio, from dawn to dusk a Cincinnati gun show had a line of 400 waiting to get in, said Joe Eaton of the Buckeye Firearms Association.

The ammo, again, is also sailing off the shelves:

Gun owners aren't just afraid of losing their right to buy certain guns. Jeff Serdy, owner of AJI Sporting Goods in Apache Junction, Ariz., said his buyers were buying ammunition.
"I am selling a ton of ammunition," Serdy said. "My people figure it is easier for the president to ban ammunition sales than to get a gun bill through Congress."
So, in anticipation of effective regulation (not otherwise specified) hundreds of thousands of Americans are 'stocking up' on guns and ammo.

I imagine this is a sign that these people 'fear' the imposition of 'regulations" (again, not specified) and they INTEND to not be affected by it OR honor it.

And when these regulations are created and implemented I don't think many of these people are going to turn around and sell their stuff back to the government for a pittance. nor will they line up with smiling faces to patiently turn all their now-illegal stuff in.

As indicated by stocking up in anticipation of just such an occurrence.

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Comment Preferences

  •  I'm stocking up on tips. (22+ / 0-)

    Thanks.

    The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men.

    by xxdr zombiexx on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:03:23 AM PST

  •  if only those people were as afraid of (6+ / 0-)

    their children shooting them as some unknown terrorist or ATF, we would all be safer.

  •  'cause there's not enough out there now. n/t (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    msmacgyver

    I'm not always political, but when I am I vote Democratic. Stay Democratic, my friends. -The Most Interesting Man in the World

    by boran2 on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:16:04 AM PST

  •  Well (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    beltane, msmacgyver, jck

    assuming such a ban actually passes, which may or may not happen, these people would then be committing a crime. Which means a Federal agent now only has to find the banned gun, not prove that it was part of a conspiracy to armed rebellion against the government.

    It is high time we went after these fucks. Stockpiling weapons and casually planning the armed overthrow of the democratically elected government ain't cool.

    Visit Lacking All Conviction, your patch of grey on those too-sunny days.

    by eataTREE on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:16:50 AM PST

    •  eataTREE - the most likely outcome (6+ / 0-)

      will be banning the sale of new assault weapons, just like the former assault weapons ban. Congress isn't going to pass a law making ownership of an assault weapon a crime and requiring mandatory confiscation, even through a buy-back program.

      "let's talk about that"

      by VClib on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:26:27 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  They did with machine guns (0+ / 0-)

        why not Bushmasters?

        Visit Lacking All Conviction, your patch of grey on those too-sunny days.

        by eataTREE on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:33:05 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Because there isn't the political will (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Otteray Scribe, FG, eataTREE

          There were far fewer machine guns than the millions of assault weapons now in circulation. The fully automatic feature of machine guns made them particularly dangerous for both police and civilians. The primary difference between semi-automatic assault rifles and some other semi-automatic rifles is largely cosmetic. It will be an uphill fight to ban the new ones. I think members of Congress are going to start with a bill they believe has a chance to pass. A mandatory confiscation bill could not pass Congress at this time.  

          "let's talk about that"

          by VClib on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:41:49 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Very well... (0+ / 0-)

            a ban on new sales, plus we pay a $5,000 bounty for each one turned into Uncle Sam. The guns that are going to be used in the next massacre are already sitting in the next Mrs. Lanza's closet, I fear: a mere ban on new sales isn't going to be effective when we are all a little too heavily armed already.

            Visit Lacking All Conviction, your patch of grey on those too-sunny days.

            by eataTREE on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 11:53:56 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  A bounty could take some off the street (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              eataTREE, nextstep

              The cost of a new assault rifle rarely exceeds $2,000 and most are between $1,000 - $2,000. If you offered a modest premium to the current transaction prices I think you could repurchase a significant number, but probably not enough to make a significant statistical difference. If there is a ban on new ones the value of these weapons in the aftermarket will significantly increase. I think that is why some people are stocking up.

              "let's talk about that"

              by VClib on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 12:58:54 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  That's why I suggested making the bounty (0+ / 0-)

                fairly high; perhaps it should be even higher. I'd be prepared to spend quite a bit to prevent another such massacre. I would also suggest a "no questions asked" policy: turn in AR-15, get check. "The Ebil Gubamint Is Paying Handsomely For Yer Guns" just doesn't have the same ring...  

                Visit Lacking All Conviction, your patch of grey on those too-sunny days.

                by eataTREE on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 01:25:01 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

              •  Yeah. They think private resale will be allowed. (0+ / 0-)

                They're expecting the same old AWB ban to come back unchanged.

                "Furthermore, if you think this would be the very very last cut ever if we let it happen, you are a very confused little rabbit." cai

                by JesseCW on Wed Dec 19, 2012 at 04:27:20 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  I think they are right (0+ / 0-)

                  No bill coming out in the next year is going to retroactively register these assault rifles and I would be surprised if there is no right to transfer. If there is, there will be lots of underground sales. My guess is that to encourage universal background checks they will allow private sales, but subject to a background check, or have all sales go through licensed dealers.

                  "let's talk about that"

                  by VClib on Wed Dec 19, 2012 at 06:42:21 PM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I'm not saying they're wrong. (0+ / 0-)

                    I'll be surprised if they close the private sale background check loophole.

                    "Furthermore, if you think this would be the very very last cut ever if we let it happen, you are a very confused little rabbit." cai

                    by JesseCW on Thu Dec 20, 2012 at 09:35:14 AM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  Jesse - I don't know how you close the (0+ / 0-)

                      "gun show loophole" which is a misnomer because it really in the "private sale loophole" without requiring private sales be subject to a background check.

                      "let's talk about that"

                      by VClib on Thu Dec 20, 2012 at 11:21:15 AM PST

                      [ Parent ]

        •  There is only cosmetic difference (5+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          meagert, NYFM, ban nock, BachFan, rockhound

          between the AR-15 and the average semi auto hunting rifle.  Actually most hunting rifles, such as the Remington 742, are way more powerful than the average AK-47 or Ar-15.  Big 30-06 round.

          It is possible to take the wood parts off the Remington 742, replace them with black plastic or metal pieces and you cannot tell one from what is commonly called an "assault rifle."  Remington made about 1,5 million of those particular hunting rifles before they discontinued it in 1980 and upgraded the design.  

          The general who wins the battle makes many calculations in his temple before the battle is fought. The general who loses makes but few calculations beforehand. - Sun Tzu

          by Otteray Scribe on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:49:57 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  it looks to me like (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Otteray Scribe

            you can't get high-capacity magazines for the 742 though .. a quick search shows lots of high-capacity magazines for .223 rifles, I couldn't find one higher than 10 rounds for the 742

            "Electronic media creates reality" - Meatball Fulton

            by zeke7237 on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 11:11:39 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  True, however they used to make a 12 round mag. (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              ban nock, BachFan, rockhound

              And I read there are a few 20 and 30 round specialty aftermarket mags, but they are not worth a crap and jam.  That is the problem with most high capacity magazines.  They are heavy, unwieldy, and the spring has to be so strong to overcome the weight of that many rounds, it tends to overload the receiver, causing it to jam.  

              The general who wins the battle makes many calculations in his temple before the battle is fought. The general who loses makes but few calculations beforehand. - Sun Tzu

              by Otteray Scribe on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 11:23:29 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

          •  The size of the individual round (0+ / 0-)

            doesn't bother me. A humane hunter would want as big a round as possible I expect. It's the magazine capacity combined with the high rate of fire that bothers me. You could kill quite a few people with .22 ammunition if you had some sort of machine gun that fired it and enough rounds...

            Visit Lacking All Conviction, your patch of grey on those too-sunny days.

            by eataTREE on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 11:45:58 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

          •  It's precisely because they're so powerful (0+ / 0-)

            that they're not very useful to anyone planning a mass casualty shooting at close range.

            The mob always used tommy guns indoors, not BAR's.  That's not because BAR's were not available.

            I'm very, very familiar with .30-06.  They don't break your shoulder, but there is more than enough recoil so that you have to reacquire your sight picture with every shot.  Follow up shots come a lot slower than with an intermediate round.

            What's more, in general, we're talking about a lot longer and heavier weapons.  That means it's a lot easier for someone to blind-side you, to get a hand on the weapon, to stop you.

            The M-14 wasn't just replaced because the M-16 was lighter, but also because it was simply a better intermediate range weapons system.

            The M-16 has been replaced by the M-4 because it's a superior short range weapons system.

            Cosmetics do in fact matter.  That's why assault rifles have pistol grips and forward wrap around grips.

            It makes them easier to handle when it comes to quickly changing targets and killing lots of people.

            "Furthermore, if you think this would be the very very last cut ever if we let it happen, you are a very confused little rabbit." cai

            by JesseCW on Wed Dec 19, 2012 at 04:40:04 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

        •  They actually *didn't*. They made you register (0+ / 0-)

          your machine gun and get a stamp and go through a lot of hoops.

          They didn't ban them.

          "Furthermore, if you think this would be the very very last cut ever if we let it happen, you are a very confused little rabbit." cai

          by JesseCW on Wed Dec 19, 2012 at 04:28:23 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

  •  Anyone who has the slightest understanding (6+ / 0-)

    of human nature could have seen this one coming all the way from Pluto.  

    "We have come for your guns."

    "What guns?"  

    The Eighteenth Amendment worked really well.  For the mob.

    The general who wins the battle makes many calculations in his temple before the battle is fought. The general who loses makes but few calculations beforehand. - Sun Tzu

    by Otteray Scribe on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:19:12 AM PST

  •  xxdr - they fear that sales of new assault rifles (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Otteray Scribe, ban nock, jck, BachFan

    will be banned. That's what is driving the sales now. I don't think they believe there are big risks that those weapons will be deemed illegal to own or that they will be confiscated through a mandatory "buy back" program. Rather I think many of them believe they will be able to flip the rifles and sell the new guns at a profit if new ones can no longer be sold.

    Just to satisfy my curiosity, and it was a limited search, but I went online yesterday and checked the availability of assault rifles at Walmart (the largest gun seller in the US). I checked five cities in the South, Southwest and Rocky Mountain West, and in every case all local stores were sold out of assault rifles. My guess is that Walmart has sold out of all its assault rifles nationwide. There is also evidence that ammunition sales are off the charts because people fear restrictions or taxes/fees will be imposed on bullets.

    I think the bill most likely to pass the Senate will be the bill authored by Diane Feinstein, the author of the original assault weapons ban, which will be submitted at the start of the 113th Congress. Feinstein's bill will ban the sale of new assault weapons and large capacity clips, close the gun show loophole, and improve the background check system. I believe the Feinstein bill can pass the Senate and has a chance in the House. There is no serious discussion in Congress regarding making assault weapons illegal or any mandatory repurchase programs of any guns or ammunition, or large capacity clips.  

    "let's talk about that"

    by VClib on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:22:34 AM PST

    •  I have not been down to the gun shop (5+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      meagert, VClib, ban nock, BachFan, rockhound

      around the corner from my office, but I am willing to bet the price of a Big Mac they are all sold out as well.  They had several such rifles last time I was in there.  Prices are also going through the roof thanks to the magic of capitalism and the entrepreneurial spirit.  

      The general who wins the battle makes many calculations in his temple before the battle is fought. The general who loses makes but few calculations beforehand. - Sun Tzu

      by Otteray Scribe on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:35:25 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Big Bad Boogy Men afraid of their own shadows.. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    beltane

    There is no monster under your beds, oh fearful ones..OY!

    "Time is for careful people, not passionate ones."

    "Life without emotions is like an engine without fuel."

    by roseeriter on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:30:50 AM PST

    •  I wonder if Nancy Lanza, with her cache of guns to (0+ / 0-)

      keep her safe, thought that. And look what happened and how many innocent bystanders also suffered.  

      One point useful to make to the gunnies is probably that the gun is as dangerous as the weakest person who has access to it. And that such weakest person is the one the gummint may need to be after, because the guns don't kill people, but they are so much paperweight until some weak person who shouldn't have one picks it up and uses it, and then that gun can kill anything, and the weak person could not killa anyone without having it in his hands..

  •  Everytime "gun control" is pushed (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Otteray Scribe, rockhound

    it is immediately followed by a stratospheric increase of guns and ammo, far outweighing any benefits of emotionally developed and ineffective firearm regulation. So, 300 million firearms in the hands of citizens is now increased by millions. Further, those opposed to the liberal agenda become more bunkered down, increasing the chances of another incident.
     Yes, there are things that can be done, well intentioned but flawed legislation. Please. I want the madness to stop. Fully fund, finetune, and effectively implement the current laws, and policies. Begin to campaign for a Single Payer Health system with ginormous increases in Mental Health funding and services. End the drug wars and overnight the everyday violence that never sees the paper will decrease sharply. Right now there are some 350,000 people in prison for non-violent drug related incidents. Everyone knows that prisons are not rehabilitative. They are schools for people who will not be able to get jobs when they get out. They ain't learning origami.

    "The United States is a nation of laws: badly written and randomly enforced." -Zappa My Site

    by meagert on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:37:01 AM PST

  •  Australia did it in 1996 (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    snoopydawg, entrelac, jck, indycam

    Rebecca Peters spoke with Amy Goodman on DemocracyNow this morning about Australia’s 1996 ban of weapons http://www.democracynow.org/...:  

    “…in Australia, the new law banned semi-automatic rifles and shotguns, assault weapons, and we did ban not only new sales...we banned importation sales, and we also banned ownership, so currently owned weapons were prohibited.

    And the government bought those guns back at a rate of about the retail price plus about 10 percent.

    And in addition, you couldn’t get them repaired. You couldn’t sell them...it was a very comprehensive ban….the buyback ended up buying back and destroying more than about 650,000 of these weapons…”

    The ban should be total and retroactive!

    •  This is not Australia. (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ban nock, BachFan, rockhound

      That is a false equivalence fallacy.  There is no other country on the planet with the history, culture and a Constitution like the USA.  We were born of revolution, whereas Australia was not.  Unlike any other revolution, the founding fathers handed the power of governance to the people, instead of keeping it for themselves.  That is unique.

      The general who wins the battle makes many calculations in his temple before the battle is fought. The general who loses makes but few calculations beforehand. - Sun Tzu

      by Otteray Scribe on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:57:27 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Nowhere that I can see did kjallen say (0+ / 0-)

        America is equivalent to Australia .
        Nor was America said to be equivalent to England , Israel , Japan or any other country that has made progress toward reducing the numbers of killed and wounded each day .

         

        "Drop the name-calling." Meteor Blades 2/4/11

        by indycam on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 01:15:41 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  Yes, well (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Otteray Scribe, NYFM, BachFan

    after all the proposals I've seen on dKos this weekend for taxing ammunition into the ozone, I've put a couple of boxes of 30-30 on my Solstice shopping list myself.  I'm going to have to deal with bears and coyotes up in the mountains, not to mention two separate neighbors who think they own my property and like to cut down my trees and break into my sheds when they think I'm not around.

    I'm not likely to go shooting up random batches of schoolchildren, but armed and ornery rednecks who think they own what I've spent a decade paying for are a different story.  And no, you don't just call the cops to come in and settle matters up there.  Tried that ONCE, in attempted deference to being a good member of the community.  The community told us in no uncertain terms that local custom was to shoot the bugger and call it an accident.

  •  This happens every time there's a mass shooting (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    BachFan

    that hits the front pages. Gun and ammo sellers make a huge profit off these events. Maybe that's why they resist common-sense firearm regulation.

  •  America has gun problems . (0+ / 0-)

    "Drop the name-calling." Meteor Blades 2/4/11

    by indycam on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 01:16:47 PM PST

    •  Is there perhaps any hope in limiting the number (0+ / 0-)

      of firearms that any family can own at any one time, since one person can only fire one at a time? That and pruning down the number of long guns with capacity to shoot more than ten rounds might help a lot.

      •  A lot of hunters own 10 or 15 guns. (0+ / 0-)

        They hunt different game in different places under different conditions.

        Given that people really do only fire one at a time, and these mass casualty shooters typically do not carry more than one long gun at a time, there's little to no reason to limit the number of guns a person can own.

        A person can swap magazines, generally, faster than they can swap weapons when it comes to long arms.

        "Furthermore, if you think this would be the very very last cut ever if we let it happen, you are a very confused little rabbit." cai

        by JesseCW on Wed Dec 19, 2012 at 04:45:14 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  America has 99 problems. (0+ / 0-)

      Guns are one.

      "Furthermore, if you think this would be the very very last cut ever if we let it happen, you are a very confused little rabbit." cai

      by JesseCW on Wed Dec 19, 2012 at 04:43:06 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  The stock market is not so sure. (0+ / 0-)

    Sturm-Ruger and Smith & Wesson pretty much tanked the last two days, and an investment company is divesting itself of another company that makes, among other things, Winchester.

    •  That's because clearing out stock doesn't (0+ / 0-)

      necessarily mean anything for future profits.

      "Furthermore, if you think this would be the very very last cut ever if we let it happen, you are a very confused little rabbit." cai

      by JesseCW on Wed Dec 19, 2012 at 04:45:43 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Now is the time to enforce the KEEP part of RKBA. (0+ / 0-)

    Felony - failure to secure deadly weapon.

    Accessory - any gun traceable to you used in any crime, you are an accessory to that crime.

    Automatic intent to murder charges for possession of a gun with no serial number.

    Oh unless they pried the gun out of your cold dead hands, then you have a pass.

    Hey, GOP - Get In, Sit Down, Shut up, & Hang On!

    by 88kathy on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 02:30:16 PM PST

  •  Say it before, say it again. (0+ / 0-)

    In order to work with this problem, we also have to deal with all of those silly laws NRA loves to push which make less severe the consequences for using a firearm on another person,  whether or not that person survives. the "Stand Your Ground' family of issues.

    If the penalties for using a firearm on another person or threatening him or her with it are stringent enough, it will at least deter some of the abusers of guns, and won't bother the hunters and those who love to shoot targets inside gun clubs, who for at least a substantial part, are doing it there because it's safe and not because they are polishing their skills in case they feel threatened by another kid walking home from the store or playing music inside his car.

    A law penalizing those who lose control of their toys as a result of which any crime is committed or harm done  by anyone at all would also be useful.

  •  Why a pittance? Want a big stimulus in (0+ / 0-)

    some of the areas hardest hit by the recession?

    25 bucks per 5 round or more magazine, no question asked, any caliber - just as soon as we ban production, import, and sale.

    50 bucks for magazines over 30 round capacity.

    Cash for clunkers had a positive impact.

    "Furthermore, if you think this would be the very very last cut ever if we let it happen, you are a very confused little rabbit." cai

    by JesseCW on Wed Dec 19, 2012 at 04:26:12 PM PST

  •  What a rerun! (0+ / 0-)

    These sales booms are exactly what happened when Obama was elected the first time!  Gun sales broke records and ammo prices skyrocketed.  The Gun Manufacturers lobby aka The NRA is laughing all the way to bank. All it takes is to blow the "Angry Black Man in the White House is coming to take your guns" dog whistle and sales go up!

  •  I'd like to see penalties for OWNING (0+ / 0-)

    high-capacity magazines.

    Oh, give 'em a six month amnesty period, maybe some $$$ incentive, and then throw the fucking book at 'em.

    Oh, and crush the mags AS they are turned in.

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