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NRA seniors have been quoted as saying that you cannot own a automatic weapon in the US and similarly that the  public is confusing semi-auto (1 trigger pull, one bullet) and a automatic (one trigger pull, many bullets). So let's quickly discuss legal automatic weapons within the US.

The National Firearms Act states that any fully automatic weapons constructed before 1986 in the US is legal to be owned by a civilian possessing a Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (ATF) Class 2 permit. A Class 2 permit requires a secured facility, local police check, photographs, fingerprintsetc including ATF review and approval, and a annual special occupational tax of $1,000 or $500, if eligible for a reduced rate.

When you have a ATF Class 2 you can own a automatic weapon, such as a machine gun built before 1986. Practically all these automatic weapons are at shooting ranges, and are available to be rented to fire them.  Some people get their "kicks" from firing these guns. For example, the GE M134D Minigun which fires at 3000 to 4000 of 30 cal rounds per minute.


In the time of this video roughly 750 rounds were fired. The ammo cost was at least $300.

While these guns are legal, I wonder what productive purpose they serve? But this is America, and if someone  wants to get "their jollies" by firing a Mini Gun, I am very glad that the National Firearms Act requires this gun be rented from a ATR Class 2 facility, while it also shows the power of the gun lobby.

The National Firearms Act does show that there is possibilities for some forms of gun control which will pass the Supreme Court and the second amendment. The "art" in the near future will be to make a gun control act which will have some REAL CONTROL.

Originally posted to jsugrue on Mon Dec 24, 2012 at 07:48 AM PST.

Also republished by Repeal or Amend the Second Amendment (RASA).

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Comment Preferences

  •  At least a mini-gun is too big (0+ / 0-)

         to sneak into a theater or school.

    The free market is not the solution, the free market is the problem.

    by Azazello on Mon Dec 24, 2012 at 07:57:38 AM PST

  •  No need for a ATF Class 2 , (0+ / 0-)

    no need for the big bucks , no need for the stamp ...
    900 rounds per minute "semi auto" .

    "Drop the name-calling." Meteor Blades 2/4/11

    by indycam on Mon Dec 24, 2012 at 08:00:02 AM PST

    •  ATF letter says.. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:

      The ATF letter states that it was approved for a stated reason ' for people with hands which have limited mobility'.

      It should be noted that  these techniques horrendously degrade the accuracy of the firearm, due to the necessary jerking of the weapon, which makes viable aiming impossible. The techniques trade accurate, aimed fire for an increase in the firearm's rate of fire. Bump-firing requires practice and concentration. It is uncommon to "empty the mag" without at least one stoppage. The inaccuracy, difficulty, and ammunition costs render the practice uncommon. While it looks sexy to some, it just basically empties the magazine!

      •  ... (0+ / 0-)

        How accurate is it ?
        "...surprisingly controllable , as you can see here is 4 or 5 mags I've fired into this target from 15 or 20 yards , and you can see that most of those rounds fired using the ssak47 stock are actually in the kill zone ... "

        How accurate is it ?
        30 round burst from 30 yards , "27 within a 2 foot radius"

        "Drop the name-calling." Meteor Blades 2/4/11

        by indycam on Mon Dec 24, 2012 at 08:36:12 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  As I said.. (0+ / 0-)

          Bump-firing requires practice and concentration. It is uncommon to "empty the mag" without at least one stoppage

          And the ATF has pulled permission of similar devices after 2 years and required the manufacturer to supply the list of purchasers. I will just note the videos basically seem to all be associated with sellers.

          Do you have experience in shooting one of these, or know someone who did shoot one?

          •  "pulled permission" ? (0+ / 0-)


            It is uncommon to "empty the mag" without at least one stoppage
            Got a link for that ?
            A mechanism that was designed for full auto from the factory ...
            Do you have experience in shooting one of these, or know someone who did shoot one?
            Ah , the old you have to be a chicken to know an egg argument .

            "Drop the name-calling." Meteor Blades 2/4/11

            by indycam on Mon Dec 24, 2012 at 09:10:20 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Not fully automatic.. (0+ / 0-)

              See US patent 6101918 which is the basis of these devices.  Notice the title " Method and apparatus for accelerating the cyclic firing rate of a semi-automatic firearm "..please notice the words semi-automatic, accelerating the cyclic firing rate. It does not make the weapon into automatic.

              Now if you will look at

              I did not want to get into the physics when I wrote the above, but what the weapons designer faced was the recoil due to the gas pressure from the large caliber bullet (the physics of a equal and opposite reaction) pre these assault weapons generation . The US M-14 is an example of  this concern. So assault weapon designed went to a lower caliber bullet to decreased the reaction so that the weapon accuracy was increased. If you will reread the article you will see the mention of the calibers. These weapons had the cyclic capability of a submachine gun with the accuracy of a rifle, without the recoil of a machinegun.  This is why the M-14 was quickly replaced by the M-16. In simple words .. you need to control the recoil for accuracy. A 'bump device' uses recoil to 'pull the trigger', and it's not positively controlling the recoil which is one of the designers main concerns, and this can lead to wide movements of the weapon. Similarly, you do not have complete on/off control. I suggest you google (bump firing) and look at the indoor range concerns and other concerns.

              And the "Ah, the old..." you have amy more experience that looking at videos? These video's are sales devices!

  •  You are talking about Class 3 weapons (3+ / 0-)

    We have several machine guns, legally obtained.  They are more historic than useful for anything.

    I looked on Google to find any crime committed by a legally transferred machine gun.

    I found one.  It was a city government owned machine pistol used by a rogue cop to kill an informant.

    The owners of full automatic machine guns that I know are more into the history and function of the guns than carrying one around for some use other than shooting at targets or showing it to groups interested in history.

    Just my experience.

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