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The True Power Of Conservatives And Their Use Of Religion
- Conformity and Authority -

WARNING:  
If you are NOT prepared to have REALITY challenge ALL YOUR RELIGIOUS BELIEFS
do not read any further.

Conservative Christianity and all other religious beliefs are based on inequity and group control based on FEAR.  

Understanding the psychological need for conformity and the response to an authority figure explains the perpetuation of religions born out of beliefs that included animal and human sacrifice, torture and abuse.  

Let’s take Christianity for example, a religion that has become socially acceptable and a norm for our society.  

We indoctrinate our children from a very young age into this religion and beliefs.  We pass them on to others without really having any insight into the origins of or the context of these beliefs.  We follow the group dynamic, never giving it a thought that this religion and other related ones has at their core a belief that God is pleased by KILLING!  

The Israelites in the Old Testament practiced animal and human sacrifice.  Sometimes even children were sacrificed.  The tone may have changed with the New Testament but the same idea of a human needing to be sacrificed for God to accept us was maintained.  The blood lust was just turned toward Jesus as he was tortured and killed as God, his own Father, watched.  Christians have been programmed to see this as normal.  No sane parent would ever treat their own children as we perceive God is treating humanity.  

Christianity is a shame based religion (all have sinned) seeking to control people much like a domestic abuser controls their victim by belittling them and making them feel unworthy.  

People are duped into believing that an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent God who is also all wise would not only be pleased by blood and killing but would require it!  They attribute to such a God great wisdom while at the same time they associate the most barbaric traits and characters imaginable.  Even the idea that a wise God would ever create humanity for the sole purpose of worshiping him sounds childishly narcissistic.

After coming out of a Christian fundamentalist cult myself whose staff psychologist was trained at the 700 Club’s CBN University I began my journey of recovery.

I learned all I could about where these beliefs I once believed in came from.  I learned of the pagan origins of monotheistic religions.  I learned how the 10 Commandments came first from the Egyptian Book of the Dead and the concept of monotheism from one of the Pharaohs of Egypt.  I learned how the Israelites passed on their religious beliefs for over 600 years before it was ever written down and how those beliefs evolved from many other different beliefs.  I learned how Christianity mimicked other beliefs present at the time like Mithraism.  And that Christmas was actually Mithras birth date not Jesus.  Many of the dates in Christianity were actually adopted from pagan holidays to try and eliminate the practice of those beliefs.  I learned that Jerusalem was conquered about 70 AD and as a result all original records were destroyed.  I learned that in an effort to solidify control, Roman Emperor Constantine adopted Christianity for his people even though he didn’t personally follow it himself until on his death bed.  I learned about how a committee of 200 decided what books would be included in the Bible and what would not be.  Then these leaders attempted to destroy anything that contradicted their interpretations.  Their failure became evident later with the discovery of the Gnostic text which portrayed a much different version of Jesus.  

The group dynamics need for compliance and the respect for authority created a religion built on BLIND OBEDIENCE.  Nothing was ever challenged.  Not even the worship of killing and blood sacrifice.  Even genocide, if God commanded it, was allowed (see God’s command to Saul in the Old Testament to kill all of a people).  We just can’t see the obvious evil from inside the group.

How can we see a God who is perfect and the Bible as his divinely inspired text yet acknowledge it is re-written and edited later during the Protestant Reformation?

How can we see God’s Holy Catholic Church engaging in torture and killing in the name of God as demonstrated by the Crusades, the Inquisitions, the witch trials and later the sexual abuse of children and never realize that no God with true wisdom would ever condone such a history at all?  

Religion sees God with blood on his hands and dripping from his mouth and a hunger that feeds on the fear of humanity and the worship of followers.  At the core of most wars is religion yet we fail to learn from that history.

Why it is that no one sees a God asking for a child to be killed by Abraham as a human sacrifice as evil? Why we don’t notice that since such a sacrifice wasn't written as a departure from religion it was normal and acceptable for them to kill children.  No one sees God and Satan gambling over the torture of Job and the killing of his family as evil.  No one sees the order by God for Saul to kill all of a people as genocide as evil either.
How about a Father offering his own daughters up to be raped in the story about Sodom and Gomorrah?  Are all these events about obedience or abuse?  Later in this article you will see how at the core of all blind obedience is an element of abuse. (Compliance video)

Solomon Asch’s Conformity Experiment explains one of the most powerful psychological factors in society, the need to conform to the group.  Here is a video about this experiment.

Solomon Asch Conformity Experiment Or How People Believe Obvious Lies
http://www.youtube.com/...

This desire for compliance along with respect for an authority figure has allowed religions to prosper.  By creating inequity and promoting abuse of other groups in society the religious make up spiritual enemies around every corner.

The Milgram Experiment demonstrates how average people can be convinced to abuse and torture others with the prodding of an authority figure.  Take a look at this clip from the Milgram Experiment.

Milgram experiment clip
http://www.youtube.com/...

But you say “Christianity is a good religion that inspires people to do well.”
No, Christianity forces people to follow and not think for themselves.  It creates a group structure that eliminates logic and reason. Knowledge and enlightenment are the enemies of religion.    

Creationists within the Christian faith are attempting to re-write the history books and eliminate all science that disagrees with their beliefs. Evolution, the age of the planet, global warming, and even genetics are being corrupted by religion.  

Those who seek power use Christianity to manipulate the masses.  
Read:   The Family: The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of American Power
(click link to find book on Amazon and back button to return to this page)
http://www.amazon.com/...

The following video about the movie “Compliance” will shock you.  The movie is based on events that really happened.  It gives you some idea the extent of the power authority and the need for compliance has over people.

Compliance: Most Disturbing Movie Ever?
http://www.youtube.com/...

This last election we saw an alliance among competing religions.  Religions that were formerly considered by each other a cult embraced each other.  Biblical ideas about how we treat the poor, sick, and elderly were abandoned as religious power brokers waged a war on women’s rights and health.  Their true motives became clear.  

It’s time we all see all religions for what they are, abandon them and embrace humanity.

Note:  
For further information about religious evolution check out the following.

"The Bible's Buried Secrets" - Israelite Origins
(click link to see video and back button to return to this page)
http://www.youtube.com/...

Also, here is a great book to give you information about ALL MYTHOLOGIES including Judaism.  The author also wrote one other specifically on the Holy Bible.  You will be amazed at how little you really knew.

Don't Know Much About Mythology: Everything You Need to Know About the Greatest Stories in Human History but Never Learned by Kenneth C Davis
(click link to see book on Amazon and back button to return to this page)
http://www.amazon.com/...
Also by Kenneth Davis

Don't Know Much About the Bible: Everything You Need to Know About the Good Book but Never Learned
(click link to see book on Amazon and back button to return here)
http://www.amazon.com/...

ADDENDUM

This article proved more successful than I could have imagined.  I understand the challenge of taking religion head on.  I knew there would be some trolls, some attacks.  But I never imagined the potential insight gained from a Jewish person about their ethnic group’s use of mythology.

First some background.  Years ago I scored the highest in my state to that point on the military induction exam.  I was offered a job in Military Intelligence.  Later I was offered a job interview with the CIA.  I ultimately ended up working for the largest auditing firm in the World at that time.  A psychological test scored me at 99.9% on social awareness (the highest core allowed).  Social awareness is the measure of “cause and effect reality.”  I’d say my instinct is as a cipher or code breaker.  I see things from the ground up and it has been a useful tool through the years.

I don’t believe I have any special talent or ability that others cannot learn.  My goal in writing this article was to expose the mechanism used to control people and exploit society, one of the greatest being religion  Once exposed it gives people opportunity to be free of the negative control, prejudice and oppression.  Understanding the power of mythology to create authority gives people the tools to see life from a different perspective.  It will help you better understand others and it will help you understand yourself.

A book I read years ago showed me how to first look at "results" to gain insight into "motives."
Here is the book on Amazon for further reading.

People Reading: How We Control Others, How They Control Us
(click link to see book on Amazon and back button to return to this page)
http://www.amazon.com/...

Some trolls attempted to discredit me in the comments and thus discount the validity of what I said.  They provided insults rather than examine further the links about “Dominionism”, “The Family” also called “The Fellowship.”  I supplied links to further info and reading as well.  I am confident anyone who looks seriously will discover what I have also discovered.  

I made the core point pretty obvious.  Basic to the Judeo-Christian belief system is that God sees “Killing as an acceptable sacrifice.”
Watch the following video about the power of the myth.  

The Greatest Story Ever Told Part 3
http://www.youtube.com/...

Now you can challenge parts of this video but if you do a search of mythology you will find this substantively valid.  Check out the “Epic of Gilgamesh.”

For those of you who have had experiences with trolls before you might see similarities in the comments.

First a troll starts his statement about your content with an insult.  Like this one, “If you're going to get all upset about another religion - ie Judaism - learn something about it first that's actual facts.”   Or they try and label you and thus minimize your contribution by saying something like, “oh you're one of those.”  They will pick apart everything and minimize the elements that they agree with trying to drag you down the road to dilute the conversation.  They attempt to provoke anger rather than offer discord and they accuse you of “being angry.”  Usually by the time a troll is done it is hard to ferret out who is really the cause of the breakdown.  Then there is their attempt to control the conversation saying things like, “wow. You just can't stop, can you?”

To give an analogy here, it is like someone coming into your home, insulting you, not willing to substantiate their claims or review additional material you provide, and in the end asking you to shut up and leave your house.
One of the ways to recognize someone genuine is that they aren’t afraid to accept when they are wrong.  Like when someone corrects my spelling mistake.  A thank you is appropriate, especially when a mistake substantively changes the meaning of the sentence itself.  

Enough said on trolls.  I hope if you go to the Comments now I have provided some context.

But the most significant thing to come out of that dialog was an admission about the relationship between the Jewish known mythology and the Christian faith giving insight into the power of knowledge over ignorance.
When I was a Christian I pondered how Jewish people did it?  Christianity has one thing Judaism does not have, “grace.”  There is no forgiveness just the law.  I knew a Jewish owner of a CPA firm in adultery.  According to their law he should be put to death.   How do they reconcile reality with their beliefs?  Well the Jewish person in the comments clarified that quite well for me.  They don’t actually believe their religion.  They know it is “mythology”.  This explains a lot.

2.2% of the population in America is Jewish.  Yet they appear to have a much greater influence in America than other ethnic groups.  The United States supports Israel both financially and militarily.  What power could they have over America?  The God of the Jewish mythology is the Christian God!  That gives them quite a bit of leverage in America, a country where approximately 78% of Americans believe in Christianity to some degree or another.  Knowledge is power.

Seven out of the top eleven media moguls are Jewish and Hollywood is still controlled majorly by Jewish people whose historical expertise is mythology.  Isn't marketing a form of mythology?  Sheldon Adelson, the Jewish casino billionaire conservative in Las Vegas funded the Republican’s last election with millions of dollars.  Sheldon Adelson is also buying up media in Israel to become the dominant force in Israel.  Just like Rupert Murdoch did in England and the United States.  The word “Conservative” really means “controlling.”

It never dawned on me that without the Jewish mythology there would be no Christian religion at all.  That is the insight I gained from the comments.  Thanks…  

Here are some videos to understand the Religious climate today I noted in comments.

IF YOU CLICK A LINK JUST CLICK THE BACK BUTTON AFTERWARDS TO BRING YOU BACK TO THE ARTICLE.  
-- As an alternative you might also try right clicking your mouse on top of the link and selecting "open link in a new tab" to save your position in the article --

Here is a video to update you on the attacks being waged on SCIENCE IN THE PUBLIC SCHOOLS.
CREATIONISM IS CREEPING INTO SCHOOLS
(click link to see video and then back button to return to this page)
http://www.youtube.com/...

Here is one describing DOMINIONISM - The 7 Mountains

Lance Wallnau Explains The Seven Mountains Mandate
(click link to see video and then back button to return to this page)
https://www.youtube.com/....

Here is one about the religious power brokers (with WORLDWIDE INFLUENCES)

Jeff Sharlet on "The Family: The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of American Power"
(click link to see video and then back button to return to this page)
DEMOCRACY NOW INTERVIEW WITH AUTHOR OF "THE FAMILY"
http://www.democracynow.org/...

IN ADDITION TO THE DEMOCRACY NOW LINK ABOVE I WAS ABLE TO EMBED THIS VIDEO.

I still highly recommend you watch the Democracy Now interview (ABOVE).

MORE POLITICAL POWER EXPLOITING THE FAITHFULL
Ralph Reed:  From Purgatory To Power
(click link to see video and then use back button to return to article)
http://vimeo.com/...

Ralph Reed: From Purgatory to Power from BillMoyers.com on Vimeo.

EXAMPLES OF THE RESULTS OF RELIGIOUS POWER -- THE ATHOLIC CHURCH
---------------------------------------------------
The Vaticans Colossal Wealth

The Roman Catholic Cover up

Catholic Slavery - Magdalene Laundries disgraced Irish Catholic women

Oranges & Sunshine - movie trailer (based on true story)

Deliver Us From Evil

Catholic Child Abuse - Breaking The Silence (BBC Documentary)

Abuse of Trust (part one of five)

Lest you think I'm just talking about Catholic abuse here is a short clip on the Evangelical money machine.  --  

Christian church RIPS OFF Donors!!

Originally posted to Jack Ryan on Thu Feb 28, 2013 at 08:07 PM PST.

Also republished by Street Prophets .

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Comment Preferences

  •  Wow. (6+ / 0-)

    L. Ron Hubbard was no dummy--if you wanna control people and rake in the bucks, start your own religion.

    The biggest things that turned me away from the religion of my youth were the hypocrisy, the blind obedience, and the lies.  

    (That sound you are hearing is a paradigm being shifted at Warp Factor Infinity using no clutch.)

    by homogenius on Thu Feb 28, 2013 at 08:38:30 PM PST

  •  Thank You - N/T (5+ / 0-)

    "Upward, not Northward" - Flatland, by EA Abbott

    by linkage on Thu Feb 28, 2013 at 08:44:06 PM PST

  •  I'm thinking of starting a religion (5+ / 0-)

    To become a member requires only that you give up your earthly riches in order to attain.......oh let's see......yeah that's it............"spiritual purity".

    I'll be happy to take all your stuff free you from  the yoke of worldly possessions, in order to.....um.....facilitate your spiritual journey.

    That's it. You won't even have to show up for services (I certainly won't).

    If the pilot's good, see, I mean if he's reeeally sharp, he can barrel that baby in so low... oh you oughta see it sometime. It's a sight. A big plane like a '52... varrrooom! Its jet exhaust... frying chickens in the barnyard!

    by Major Kong on Thu Feb 28, 2013 at 09:05:55 PM PST

    •  Too late in my case; my Goddess apparently (0+ / 0-)

      isn't worried too much about my material prosperity.

      Of course, I have lights, heat, roof, bed, clothes, and food, so I suppose I'm fine. (wry grin) I'd just appreciate stuff like getting to buy a new set of braces and such.

      When you come to find how essential the comfort of a well-kept home is to the bodily strength and good conditions, to a sound mind and spirit, and useful days, you will reverence the good housekeeper as I do above artist or poet, beauty or genius.

      by Alexandra Lynch on Thu Feb 28, 2013 at 11:18:13 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  May the FSM lash you all with is noodly appendages (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Jack Ryan, Mortifyd

    "Remember, Republican economic policies quadrupled the debt before I took office and doubled it after I left. We simply can't afford to double-down on trickle-down." Bill Clinton

    by irate on Fri Mar 01, 2013 at 03:31:13 AM PST

  •  Just a few things here... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Joieau, JDsg

    If you're going to get all upset about another religion - ie Judaism - learn something about it first that's actual facts about the culture you're trying to piss on.

    1. Jews don't believe in literal understanding of the text - we KNOW we wrote it down.  We also have another text called the Talmud that details how we apply the commandments in the Torah itself - and in many cases where we borrowed from, fascinating stuff that - one without the other is a mess, as you might have noticed from Literal Christianity.  Which also borrowed.  Because people DO that.  Hence the Jews not being literalists.  Not to mention we never intended for you to use it anyway.  It's for Jews by Jews.

    2. The whole point of the story of the binding of Isaac is that G-d doesn't want human sacrifice at all.  Isaac lived, you know.  Had a bunch of kids.  Their descendents are called Jews. waves  I'm one of them.  Not a literalist either.

    3. Jerusalem was already conquered well before 70AD - that was when the Temple was razed and the Jews were mostly driven out by the Romans.  They already had been occupying long before that.  Herod was a puppet of the Roman Empire.  Why do you think Pontious Pilate was even IN Jerusalem?  Overseeing the real estate because they didn't trust the puppet king. Oh, and he was banished there for being a brutal bastard - which by Roman standards is pretty messed up.

    4. Almost all of the sacrifices in the Temple were FOOD for the Kohanim - the priests.  Some of it they could take home to their families, some of it they had to eat at the Temple.  Our G-d is real into barbeque.  And if you were too poor to make a barbeque, you could offer a pancake - It likes those too.  Our G-d is an IT with no body, gender or form - sometimes referred to as male, other times female - because we borrowed shit.  Doesn't do people suits though, we definitively rejected that idea long before the Jesus stories were ever thought up.  

    5. If you don't believe any of it anyhow - why are you still writing like it's fact?  Most religious people DON'T believe like you were taught - there are other ways to be religious.  In fact, I know a lot of orthodox Jews who are atheists - there's no conflict of interest there for us.  Different mindset completely than what you learned.  The NT is not history any more than Torah is.

    I understand you are angry about being lied to - but we didn't do it.  Don't slander us because you don't get what we do.

    And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

    by Mortifyd on Fri Mar 01, 2013 at 03:54:39 AM PST

    •  You are dilluded by what you have been taught (0+ / 0-)

      I'm sorry to correct you but you have been dilluded and deceived by your religion.  First off do you know that the original Israelite, Moses (if he even really existed) and Jesus (if he ever really existed) were most likely Black or of dark sinned like current Ethiopians from the region?

      The point to be made is how stories like gossip retold over many years tend to become fabrications of imagination.  They are mythology.  Religion is just a living form of mythology with selfish underlying motives.

      I would suggest that you investigate your religion from outside it.  You will be amazed at the wealth of information and the freedom you will gain outside the cult of religion.

      "The Bible's Buried Secrets" - Israelite Origins
      (click link to see video and back button to return to this page)
      http://www.youtube.com/...

      Also, here is a great book to give you information about ALL MYTHOLOGIES including Judaism.  The author also wrote one other specifically on the Holy Bible.  You will be amazed at how little you really knew.

      Don't Know Much About Mythology: Everything You Need to Know About the Greatest Stories in Human History but Never Learned by Kenneth C Davis
      (click link to see book on Amazon and back button to return to this page)
      http://www.amazon.com/...

      Also by Kenneth Davis

      Don't Know Much About the Bible: Everything You Need to Know About the Good Book but Never Learned
      (click link to see book on Amazon and back button to return here)
      http://www.amazon.com/...

      Religion exploits the "need for compliance" and people's trust creates authority.  When was the last time someone from within religion challenged that authority?  It is rarely done.  Most who become enlightened and leave religion do not become activists and fight but with the world becoming a battleground for ignorance in education seeking to create a theocratic world it is time to speak out against all religions.  Sorry to burst your bubble.  I did post a warning at the beginning of this article.

      •  oh you're one of those. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        JDsg, Joieau

        Moses was not the first Jew by a longshot. And I don't give a flying fuck about Jesus - nor do I think Moshe sat on a mountain taking dictation.  I said above we KNOW it's mythology - we fucking wrote it down.

        We don't think about religion like you do.

        Have fun with that.

        And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

        by Mortifyd on Fri Mar 01, 2013 at 06:27:26 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  use of religion (0+ / 0-)

          First I found it interesting that you attempt to pigeon me and then control the discussion by saying "your one of those".

          This gives you the power to discount what I am saying and not have to contemplate it further.  The Jewish people have a talent for taking everything in relation to them.  If my words are found offensive then I'm anti-Semitic in some way?.

          Well let me clarify.  I was Christian for over 30 years.  I have known fine people who are Jewish.  I have known Catholics in my day too.  A former in-law was a converted  Muslim at one time.  I am not judging people but challenging them to examine the very purpose and legitimacy of ALL RELIGIONS.  ALL RELIGIONS SEEK TO CREATE INEQUITY AND ESTABLISH CONTROL OVER PEOPLE.

          As you point out the Jewish faith is more interpretive than literal.  I can appreciate that.  As a Christian I interpreted Bible stories as lessons too.  It was only when I discovered that some actually believe that a talking snake really existed or that the earth is only 10,000 years old and that as a Christian we should dump science and evolution that I began to speak out about it.

          Christians may look at their Jewish origins with more zeal than Jewish people do but the truth remains.  These stories "manipulate lives".  I have thought about the unique relationship between Judaism and Christianity at times.  Christians blame the Jews for killing Jesus but to some extend have become allies with one religion validating the history of the other. Fascinating...

          Whether you truly believe symbolically or literally or you discount one source or another at the very core of your religion and Christianity and most of the other religions is a belief in an ALL POWERFUL God.  Now maybe your faith believes more in power than justness.  I guess there is latitude to depart views on religious bounds and individual beliefs.  But that doesn't change the reality of believing in an "abusive" God to justify actions against others.

          I looked back over your original comment.  First I know 70 AD wasn't the first time Jerusalem was conquered.  They were conquered around 576 BC.  That is when they developed most of their beliefs and wrote their stories down.  They were in exile in Babylon.  Up until then there was a lot of paganism among the Israelite people.  Their "Gods" were defeated so they had to come up with a reason, a way to regain face.  They repented and became "monotheistic".  Artifacts and even the Christian Bible support this transition.  But religion writes everything from a "God's perspective" like they know instead of from a rational explanation for the development of these myths.

          I have already deviated greatly from the original focus of ALL Religions.  Your comment makes the point that some consider themselves Jews as a matter of race not religion.  It is the only people considered so.  But even then it comes from a religious perspective as they think themselves "God's chosen people".  So is an atheist Jew still really a Jewish person?  Also fascinating...  I had a friend who considered himself Catholic even though he didn't follow the faith but was the child of a Catholic.

          I'll not split hairs.  You can be whatever you think you are.  it is not the followers but the leaders and religious forces that create wars and kill.

          Ireland went through terrorism between the Catholics and Protestants for a long time.  Hatred was passed on for generations.  

          It is only when we can step outside religion itself and create a new paradigm that humanity will heal.            

          •  If I thought you were antisemetic (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            JDsg

            I would have said so.  I just think your angry for realising you weren't Really Right.  That is not our problem and has nothing to do with us or our culture.

            The Torah is not a history book. Neither is the NT - everything you "know" about Judaism is wrong.  Everything you have stated about Judaism is wrong.

            Because you don't actually understand what it is.

            Your being a Christian is both quite evident and irrelevant to the point I was making.  

            We never intended out tribal rituals and "beliefs" - more like worldview really - to be universal.  Name a point in time Jews forced anyone to join?  You can't.  Because there wasn't one. Judaism is passed through the mother or by adoption.  Period.  It's not about belief.  

            We don't CARE what other people do - we just like to do our thing because we find usefulness in it culturally. We are a tribal ethnic group, not a "race" - there you go again not understanding what is in front of you.

            We aren't touting the One True anything for the world - that's a Christian problem, not a Jewish one.  Our mythology was for ourselves.  And we KNOW and always knew it was mythology.  Because we created it. We wrote it down.  Because cultures do that.  

            So you telling me it's not real?  Not exactly the revelation you hoped it would be - always and already knew it, thanks.  It doesn't bother me - nor does it shatter my world, morality or culture.  What I "believe" in is pretty much MATH, not some woo woo sky daddy.

            Your assumptions not only are wrong, but frankly make you look foolish.  We don't HAVE a hierarchy. We don't break away over dogma and custom like Christians do. And we certainly don't kill one another over it.  Because we aren't you or what you think we are.

            Christians murdering people for having heretical beliefs is a Christian problem - not a Jewish one.  Because we don't give a shit what you believe or do to each other. Ireland - nothing to do with the Jews.

            Believe whatever you like - but don't blame us because you grew up in a messed up abusive home.  Stick to your own messed up violent and oppressive faith to call out.

            And get some therapy.  You need it.

            And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

            by Mortifyd on Fri Mar 01, 2013 at 12:05:38 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  you sir are the one angry (0+ / 0-)

              You sir are the one angry as evident by your attitude and expression.  

              No I don't think you ahve made me look foolish.  Actually quite the opposite.  You ahve demonstrated some insight into the Jewish mind.  something I wuld not be able to expose any other way.  

              Jews have not a history of prosletizing others but they do have a history of conquering and taking waht they think they are justified in taking.  Like land they say God gave them.  This puts a twist in his if you say jews realize this is all mythology.  Thank you.

              I saw many things about the Jewish people.  Not about religious wars but about child and human sacrifice.  I didn't not mention them because there is no way to validate them just because they are on the Internet.  The Muslims seem just as likely to create stories as the Jewish people.  I did see a story that the Catholics were giving Sainthood to about 23 children who were sacrificed by Jewish people and then stopped recording the records.  But then the Catholics don't have any record to brag about either.  Oprah ahd a woman on who talked of her Jewish family involved in child sacrifice.  But I wouldn't call her credible as she was schizophrenic.  I don't think it is fair to judge any one in a religion by their extremists.

              I find your anger quite puzzling.  Since you indicate that your Jewishness isn't a matter of deep beliefs you are not insulted then by it being called a mythology.  yet you still lash out and attack me with your latest comment saying I had issues in the fundamentalist Church taht stemmed from my childhood even though you don't know me.  And then you say I should seek therapy.

              it was not I who had the issues or the family history it was my wife at the time.  You seem to know less than you portray yourself knowing.  Like why you are angry at the premise taht religions use the psychological tools of compliance and authority to manipulate people.

              If I told you a car sales man uses those same tools you wouldn't ahve responded in the same manner.  

              Finally, whether t is a religion or a mythology to you the foundation of Judeo-Christian beliefs is the killing of animals and humans just like the Aztecs did.  Is this such a revelation to you that it angers you?

              I don't need to know your religion from your perspective to know the writings and whether literally taken or implied using mythology the nature they attribute to those who create religion.

              Are we our ancestors?  No but Conservative Religions hold on to the old with a vengeance.  Like the earth being flat.

              Your wrong about my extent of knowledge of the Jewish people.  I know the the Koch brothers come from a Jewish family and Ayn Rand, also Jewish both have a link with Russia.  Also George Soros was Jewish but changed his religion to survive the Germans.  George Soros went to England studied Karl Marx and finances to become a philanthropist.  Their religon didn't seem to dictate their direction as much as their childhood experinces and place in society.

              There must have been some cord I struck with you.  I don't know what but I'm sorry.  I did warn people not to proceed if they had a problem.

              •  wow. you just can't stop, can you? (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                JDsg

                I have a background in anthropology and I hate liars who double down on their lies and ignorance as somehow justified.  That's pretty much it.

                I feel sorry for you.  Get therapy.

                And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

                by Mortifyd on Fri Mar 01, 2013 at 03:20:35 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  social awareness (0+ / 0-)

                  Big flip about your background.  Watch the videos and look up the archaeological resources given.  Maybe you'll learn something.  There are many people who interpret reality through the eyes of religion rather than the other way around.  It is only recently that a Biblical view of archaeology has been challenged.

                  As for therapy.  I scored 99.9% on social awareness.  I learn from the people I deal with.  Your anger and attitude has taught me much.

                  Your acknowledgement about your created religion and disdain for Christianity got me thinking about the relationship between the two.  Knowledge is power.  Especially if others remain ignorant.  The Jewish population in the United States is about 2.2% yet seven out of the top media moguls in the world are Jewish.  For a long time they dominated Hollywood and still have great influence and power to maintain propaganda and mythology.

                  As a Christian before I pondered how Jewish people dealt with sin.  I knew a Jewish owner of a CPA firm in adultery.  According to Jewish beliefs he should be killed.  Christianity has one factor Judaism does not, grace.
                  It never dawned on me that the way they deal with it is that they don't truly believe their own mythology.  

                  So how does Judaism have such power in relation to Christianity that the United States majorly funds Israel and is drawn into their politics?  Christianity is dependent on the Jewish God!  Without the Jewish God there would be no Christian faith.  That gives Judaism major power doesn't it.  We saw that influence this last election with Sheldon Adelson, Casio Billionaire in Las Vegas major funding the Conservatives with millions of dollars.  Sheldon Adelson is building his own media empire in Israel to spread propaganda.  Sheldon Adelson is another Rupert Murdoch building a media empire for power.  

                  Now you can try and deflect and lie and call me names.  I would expect that of you anyway.  Maybe the degree of non-belief of Jewish people in their own religion you demonstrated was a shock at first to me.  But it all makes sense now.

                  What better way to manipulate others than control over the core of their beliefs in God itself.  Maybe that is why you got angry.  Because I pointed out the fallacy of believing in a God who requires animal and human sacrifice and worship of him.  It doesn't shake your beliefs but it might shake your people's influence and control over the Christian beliefs at least from the angle of media.

                  Oh, your background in anthropology is no more guarantee to your ability to reason than the guy in the first video "Solomon Asch Conformity Experiment Or How People Believe Obvious Lies"  Which line is longer?  

                  Your comments deflect and deny any religious belief to stand behind so it would appear your efforts are more slanted toward maintaining power rather giving substance.  By attacking and belittling you hope to maintain taht power.  

                  "When asked which stick is longer you ask the questioner why he wants to know."  lol

                  I'll take social awareness over a background in anthropology any day.  At least it gives a person the ability to examine and learn.

      •  The word you're seeking is (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Mortifyd, JDsg

        "deluded." As in fooled by intentionally false information.

        And just so you know, neither the Egyptians nor the tribes of the Levant were black. No, they weren't blond-haired blue-eyed Aryans, but neither were they black Africans.

        •  thanks (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Joieau

          Thanks for the spell check.  -
          deluded adjective: believing things that are not real or true

          As for color, that was just something to ponder.  We created a western European image of Jesus and Moses and it has been perpetuated.  

          I have seen the arguments about race before but don't feel that strongly about it.  The truth is humanity itself with evolutionary origins in Africa may have all been dark colored at one time.  I know that with the use of DNA mapping some who are white have black origins.

          It reallly wasn't relevant for this post and is a distraction..  

        •  note - facts = distraction (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          JDsg

          I smell troll here with every comment "Jack" makes.

          Reminds me of someone who got the banhammer back a year or so ago, just haven't come up with the name yet.

          And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

          by Mortifyd on Fri Mar 01, 2013 at 05:20:00 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I don't know that I'd say "troll," but... (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Mortifyd

            ...it does seem to me like Ryan's undergoing what Unitarians call the "Baptist Bends."  Quite frankly, I stopped reading the diary after the first sentence after his warning because I've seen this all before and I know it's not true. But some people live in pain and lash out at those who won't do as they do. My only "fear" is that of taqwa, "the reverence which is akin to love, for it fears to do anything which is not pleasing to the object of love."  I'm not sure that Ryan can understand that, though.

            Muslims and tigers and bears, oh my!

            by JDsg on Fri Mar 01, 2013 at 06:07:39 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Judgementalism (0+ / 0-)

              JDsg - I think that your comment sounds judgmental.  Since you made the comment about Unitarians I am assuming your the one who wrote the original comment about them.  

              you will note that I made no comment about that post either way.  I didn't seek to render an opinion on it.  Your right.  I'm not the one here who is a troll.

              Your personal attack was not warranted.  I didn't even attempt to mention that while a Christian there was a book I had on Cults and Unitarians were listed as one of them.  Why would I?  This is comparing one religion to another something that others like to do to get the upper hand.  The book was pure Christian propaganda.    After all, if you can step and judge another you are the expert.

              The arguments have gotten convoluted as people try to find weakness in every statement.  I say I came out of a fundamentalist Church and people make assumptions.

              I came out of that Church 10 years before I ever started rethinking my Christianity.  I was a Sunday School teacher for 6 of that 10 years too. My doubts came when the pastor of this second Church started preaching against evolution and political flyers turned up on car windshields in the parking lot on Sunday.  I saw Christian leadership serving the wealth and ignoring the poor, sick, and elderly as Jesus commanded.  It came after I saw religious politics and the Koch brothers infiltrate the this countries religious dialog.  

              I have no great desire to preach a new religion or against a religion.  I'm not an activist.

              I have a desire to draw attention to how religion manipulates and controls people.  You can say you've heard this before and it isn't true.  But it is true.  Religious people, myself at one time too, never really think about the logic of believing in an abusive God who finds joy in killing.  Their group presents it as acceptable so, like in the asch experiment, they go along with it.  In the fundamentalist Church I saw 6 year old kids getting slain in the spirit.  I saw all kinds of mental manipulation.  

              Once again.  I know nothing of your religion so I didn't comment on your statement.

              I would have hoped you would have given me the same level of thought and respect.

              I like Henry David Thoreau and Emerson and their transcendentalism.  I saw a little on the Chinese faiths and how they are interwoven.  The line between waht is  spiritualism and religion can become blurred.  

              Each of our own definitions can vary as well.  

              I think it was in Mathew and Luke that it was said "you can judge a tree by its's fruit."  The religions I spoke about have definitely produced bad fruit.

              I think it is important to differientiate the difference between faith and religion.  Faith is believing in something or someone.  Religion is the structure we submit to.  Having faith in others is never a bad thing as long as healthy boundaries go along with it.

              I had no way to judge the fruit of your Unitarian Church and so I didn't comment.

              Your comments here are the first fruit to me about what you believe.

              Apparently you took no comment as a negative.  

              You were right about one thing.  I'm not the troll.

              There are minor Churches like United Methodist who preach a more progressive Christianity.  

              I weighed speaking out so boldly when not all are a danger to society.  But in the end I figured if your not going to speak out against the wrong that is being done then your part of the problem.

              Churches spoke out during the Reformation and change happened.  

              If these judeo-christian beliefs are the cornerstone then the Church has a bad foundation.  Could I find equally bad in other religions?  At one time the Hindu faith practice sacrifice too.  

              Maybe none of us could live up to the scrutiny of our past.  But at least going forward we should go in a new direction and acknowledge the truth about the past.

               

              •  I see reading comprehension isn't one... (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Mortifyd

                ...of your strong suits.  Needless to say, I've given your latest comment the same amount of attention as I gave your diary.

                Muslims and tigers and bears, oh my!

                by JDsg on Sat Mar 02, 2013 at 04:30:02 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  no religion isn't a religion (0+ / 0-)

                  That's alright.  

                  You can go ahead with your insults.  

                  I looked up your Unitarian religion last night after the post.

                  Separating all the pointed comments against Unitarians by Christians that use the Trinity as a litmus test for all religions I found one comment appropriate.  
                  "No religion isn't a religion".

                  Between your trolling in the name of religion and the Jewish person's attack it reinforces something pointed out originally in this article.

                  Some use religion to gain power over others...

                  •  You still don't get it. (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Mortifyd

                    I'm not a Unitarian.  You just made up an assumption and went with it.  If you had actually bothered to compare my sig vs. that of the other guy who wrote about the Unitarians, you'd see we're different people.  Duh!

                    Muslims and tigers and bears, oh my!

                    by JDsg on Sat Mar 02, 2013 at 07:01:34 AM PST

                    [ Parent ]

          •  I see (0+ / 0-)

            I see you troll my responses and attack me and then call me the troll?

            You give no substance other than to say your right and I'm wrong.  

            I've seen this before too.

            I put links and refer you to articles for your further review.  You just attack.  

            Do you troll often?

          •  OK, on second thought... (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Mortifyd

            ...you may be right about the troll here. :)

            Muslims and tigers and bears, oh my!

            by JDsg on Fri Mar 01, 2013 at 10:38:38 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

  •  Not ALL Religions... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JDsg

    It's obvious from your screed that you haven't completed your comparisons.  You haven't mentioned Unitarian-Universalism, and that religion is way different than the orthodox religions you rail against.  
    "UUs confirm and support:
    "The inherent worth and dignity of every person
    "Justice, equality and compassion in human relations
    "Acceptance of one another and encouragement to spiritual growth in our congregations
    "A free and responsible search for truth and meaning
    "The right of conscience and the use of the democratic process within our congregations and society at large
    The goal of world community with peace justice and liberty for all
    "Respect for the interdependent web of all existence of which we are a part"
    Services every Sunday morning.  Give it a try.

    •  Fowlers stages of faith (0+ / 0-)

      Faith is seen as a holistic orientation, and is concerned with the individual's relatedness to the universal. Fowler defines faith as an activity of trusting, committing and relating to the world based on a set of assumptions of how one is related to others and the world.

          Stage 0 – "Primal or Undifferentiated" faith (birth to 2 years), is characterized by an early learning of the safety of their environment (i.e. warm, safe and secure vs. hurt, neglect and abuse). If consistent nurture is experienced, one will develop a sense of trust and safety about the universe and the divine. Conversely, negative experiences will cause one to develop distrust with the universe and the divine. Transition to the next stage begins with integration of thought and languages which facilitates the use of symbols in speech and play.

          Stage 1 – "Intuitive-Projective" faith (ages of three to seven), is characterized by the psyche's unprotected exposure to the Unconscious.

          Stage 2 – "Mythic-Literal" faith (mostly in school children), stage two persons have a strong belief in the justice and reciprocity of the universe, and their deities are almost always anthropomorphic.

          Stage 3 – "Synthetic-Conventional" faith (arising in adolescence; aged 12 to adulthood) characterized by conformity to religious authority and the development of a personal identity. Any conflicts with one's beliefs are ignored at this stage due to the fear of threat from inconsistencies.

          Stage 4 – "Individuative-Reflective" faith (usually mid-twenties to late thirties) a stage of angst and struggle. The individual takes personal responsibility for his or her beliefs and feelings. As one is able to reflect on one's own beliefs, there is an openness to a new complexity of faith, but this also increases the awareness of conflicts in one's belief.

          Stage 5 – "Conjunctive" faith (mid-life crisis) acknowledges paradox and transcendence relating reality behind the symbols of inherited systems. The individual resolves conflicts from previous stages by a complex understanding of a multidimensional, interdependent "truth" that cannot be explained by any particular statement.

          Stage 6 – "Universalizing" faith, or what some might call "enlightenment". The individual would treat any person with compassion as he or she views people as from a universal community, and should be treated with universal principles of love and justice.

      As an evangelical Christian who happens to be transgender I bump up against Judge-Mental christians (purposeful small c) with regularity. I know a great deal of where my faith comes from and I know the Bible in the Hebrew and Greek that we have. It is far richer than most know but you have to understand the historic, cultural and linguistic context or you will get it wrong. My faith is not based on what any one else says, it is my own.

  •  Interesting screed against religion, (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JDsg, Mortifyd

    but one wonders how you managed to miss so much of what is known about religions, even among the religious...

    Many of the dates in Christianity were actually adopted from pagan holidays to try and eliminate the practice of those beliefs.
    Well, duh. Most people figure this out before they reach puberty, not being 'secret knowledge' or anything. All mere usurpation of fairly universal observances of seasonal passages. Christmas = Festivals of Light based on winter solstice observances. Easter = celebration of the spring rites (fertility rituals and symbology), with a nod to Passover in the timing department. Etc. Always schedule your big parties at a time when everybody's partying. That way nobody thinks it's too weird.
    I learned that Jerusalem was conquered about 70 AD and as a result all original records were destroyed.
    The Temple was destroyed and scrolls were burned, but not everybody lived in Jerusalem then or now. Not all the scrolls were destroyed. Both Judaism and budding Christianity kept right on going, their paperwork survived.
    I learned that in an effort to solidify control, Roman Emperor Constantine adopted Christianity for his people even though he didn’t personally follow it himself until on his death bed.
    This - and the basics of the canonization enclaves - is all basic church history, taught to most acolytes in communicant's class and readily available to all via a number of non-church histories easy enough to find.
    How can we see a God who is perfect and the Bible as his divinely inspired text yet acknowledge it is re-written and edited later during the Protestant Reformation?
    The Old and New Testaments weren't "re-written and edited" during the Reformation, though some of the apocrypha got left out and translations to the vernacular became popular. The source material remained the same then, and is the same now.
    ...Christianity forces people to follow and not think for themselves.  It creates a group structure that eliminates logic and reason. Knowledge and enlightenment is the enemy of religion.
    "Force?" Not since the end of the various holy wars in the old world. Besides, "force" can only make knees bend - it cannot control individuals' beliefs.
    Creationists within the Christian faith are attempting to re-write the history books and eliminate all science that disagrees with their beliefs. Evolution, the age of the planet and even genetics are being corrupted by religion.
    Creationists are a sub-cult of the Protestant version of Christianity (and counts some fundamentalist Jews and Muslims as well). They cannot enforce their anti-science mythology on the general public under the laws of this nation (and many others). The attempt is somewhat pitiful, but will not succeed. Godly timetables and a 6,000 year old earth are not [legally] taught in public school science classrooms.

    People in the modern world choose their spiritual beliefs or non-beliefs from the Smorgasbord of belief systems out there to choose from. In Christianity this can run the gambit from UUs to Pentacostal charismatics. Something for everyone! People who choose to subscribe to authoritarian systems choose those systems because they are authoritarian followers who don't like to think for themselves by nature. Or wannabe authoritarians themselves. Religion did not invent such people, and has no corner on the authoritarian market.

    •  How can someone be so verbose and still wrong. (0+ / 0-)

      I guess you thought if you came out and trashed someone you would just automatically be assumed right.

      First off lets take your "modern view" that denies reality.

      Did you even watch the videos on how Religions use Compliance and Authority to manipulate minds?  

      You probably never heard of "Dominionism" or a group of power brokers called
      "The Family".  

      Here is a video on AOL to update you on the attacks being waged on science in public schools.

      CREATIONISM IS CREEPING INTO SCHOOLS
      (click link to see video and then back button to return to this page)
      http://on.aol.com/...

      Here is one describing Dominionism - The 7 mountains

      Lance Wallnau Explains The Seven Mountains Mandate
      (click link to see video and then back button to return to this page)
      https://www.youtube.com/...

      Here is one about the religious power brokers (WORLDWIDE INFLUENCES)

      Jeff Sharlet on "The Family: The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of American Power"
      (click link to see video and then back button to return to this page)
      http://www.democracynow.org/...

      Your verbose response taken with such painstaking effort seems itself convoluted and devoid of fact.  Apparently you thought just because you said it people would believe it true.  lol    

      Read the books by Kenneth Davis and research the series of programs on PBS about the Bible and religion and you may learn something.

      Don't Know Much About the Bible: Everything You Need to Know About the Good Book but Never Learned
      by Kenneth Davis

      Don't Know Much About Mythology: Everything You Need to Know About the Greatest Stories in Human History but Never Learned
      by Kenneth Davis

      One more...

      The Bible's Buried Secrets
      (click link to see video and then back button to return to this page)
      http://www.youtube.com/...

      PBS goes further than other sources but still holds back to elements of truth as not to offend the religious.  The first introduction of a monotheistic God was from an Egyptian Pharaoh.  I think the program on the Egytians is also on PBS.  The 10 Commandments actually came from the Egyptian Book of the Dead.  

  •  95% (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Jack Ryan

    Of pastors are lyers.When a pastor tells you GOD spoke to him.Ask him what did his voice sound like?Also show me one women pastor in the bible?

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