Skip to main content

Following in the footsteps of their political partners, the Southern Baptist Convention, the Roman Catholic "Archbishop" for the military, Timothy P. Broglio, has issued instructions to Catholic chaplains and military service personnel about how equally they can treat gay and lesbian service members in the post-DADT and post-DOMA worlds. Despite the recent words of the Bishop of Rome, Jorge Mario Bergoglio (aka "Pope Francis") declaring that his Church should not be so vocal about gays and abortion, Mr. Broglio has declared that

No Catholic priest or deacon may be forced by any authority to witness or bless the union of couples of the same gender.
Shockingly, this includes funerals, as Broglio states:
...a priest may not be placed in a situation where his assistance at a funeral for a Catholic would give the impression that the Church approves of same sex “marital” relationships.
So, no consolation for your spouse if you're a dirty, subhuman f*g.  Nice, Mr. Broglio.

Link: Renewed Fidelity in Favor of Evangelization

Follow me below the squiggle for why this is so infuriating.

Mr. Broglio explains his position by stating:

A clear disservice is rendered if the truth of the Gospel is confused by the actions of those ordained to disseminate that truth. The current situation makes it necessary to reiterate with clarity the teaching of the Catholic Church regarding homosexuality.
In order to make sure that this teaching is clear, Mr. Broglio provides the following guidance:
No Catholic priest or deacon can be obliged to assist at a “Strong Bonds” or other “Marriage Retreat”, if that gathering is also open to couples of the same gender. A priest who is asked to counsel non-Catholic parties in a same-gendered relationship will direct them to a chaplain who is able to assist. Catholic parties will, of course, be encouraged by the priest to strive to live by the teaching of the Gospel.

Participation in retirements, changes of command, and promotion ceremonies is possible, as long as the priest is not required to acknowledge or approve of a “spouse” of the same gender.

Because, of course, homosexuality is a sin, according to the Catholics. Guess what else is a sin: 1) being a Protestant, 2) being a non-Christian (including Jews, Mormons, Baptists, Hindus, Muslims and many more), 3) being a divorced and remarried Christian of any kind, and 4) being married in a non-religious ceremony. Yet the Catholic church does not bar its chaplains from marriage retreats that are open to heretics (category 1 above), pagans (category 2), fornicators (category 4) and adulterers (category 3), nor does it direct its chaplains to refuse comfort to non-Catholic widows and widowers of Catholic service members lost in the line of battle.

We should be glad, I suppose, that Mr. Broglio's instructions don't prevent military commanders from implementing benefits for the dirty homos. Although the Church teaches that Catholics cannot engage "in morally illicit cooperation with evil," Mr. Broglio instructs military commanders that they would only be doing so if they engaged in

affirmation of unions contrary to natural law, as well as of the actions that contribute to fatherlessness or motherlessness of children
However, military commanders may still recognize gay and lesbian service members' rights to benefits without such affirmation
...out of obedience to the chain of command not for the sake of promoting immorality, but to maintain the commander’s position/rank/grade...
In other words, covering one's ass and keeping one's pension are totally good reasons to cooperate with evil. I would expect nothing more from the Church the recognized Newt Gingrich's third marriage as valid.

As a recovering Catholic, I get that the Church has certain teachings, and I would not expect a priest to officiate at a same-sex marriage ceremony, but not being able to even acknowledge the existence of a same-sex spouse in any circumstance? That's simply ridiculous. If the Church tried to issue a similar proclamation preventing its chaplains from treating Jews or Mormons equally, the outcry would be immediate - as it would be if the SBC had directed its chaplains to treat Catholics (who worship Satan, according to the SBC) with this level of disrespect. Quite frankly, if Catholic chaplains cannot treat all service members equally, they should not be chaplains.

Originally posted to CPT Doom on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 10:41 AM PDT.

Also republished by Street Prophets .

EMAIL TO A FRIEND X
Your Email has been sent.
You must add at least one tag to this diary before publishing it.

Add keywords that describe this diary. Separate multiple keywords with commas.
Tagging tips - Search For Tags - Browse For Tags

?

More Tagging tips:

A tag is a way to search for this diary. If someone is searching for "Barack Obama," is this a diary they'd be trying to find?

Use a person's full name, without any title. Senator Obama may become President Obama, and Michelle Obama might run for office.

If your diary covers an election or elected official, use election tags, which are generally the state abbreviation followed by the office. CA-01 is the first district House seat. CA-Sen covers both senate races. NY-GOV covers the New York governor's race.

Tags do not compound: that is, "education reform" is a completely different tag from "education". A tag like "reform" alone is probably not meaningful.

Consider if one or more of these tags fits your diary: Civil Rights, Community, Congress, Culture, Economy, Education, Elections, Energy, Environment, Health Care, International, Labor, Law, Media, Meta, National Security, Science, Transportation, or White House. If your diary is specific to a state, consider adding the state (California, Texas, etc). Keep in mind, though, that there are many wonderful and important diaries that don't fit in any of these tags. Don't worry if yours doesn't.

You can add a private note to this diary when hotlisting it:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from your hotlist?
Are you sure you want to remove your recommendation? You can only recommend a diary once, so you will not be able to re-recommend it afterwards.
Rescue this diary, and add a note:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary from Rescue?
Choose where to republish this diary. The diary will be added to the queue for that group. Publish it from the queue to make it appear.

You must be a member of a group to use this feature.

Add a quick update to your diary without changing the diary itself:
Are you sure you want to remove this diary?
(The diary will be removed from the site and returned to your drafts for further editing.)
(The diary will be removed.)
Are you sure you want to save these changes to the published diary?

Comment Preferences

  •  Tip jar for equality (15+ / 0-)

    Boycott Russian vodka, Russian caviar and all things Russian. LGBT oppression cannot be allowed to stand.

    by CPT Doom on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 10:40:58 AM PDT

    •  So, I'm really a Pagan? That makes my day. (4+ / 0-)

      And all this time I thought I was just Jewish.

      "Get in the way. Create chaos. Cause trouble. " "On global warming there is no more time to change the Overton Window. We have to break it."

      by sturunner on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 10:59:13 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  The statement by Broglio in context (0+ / 0-)
      But the new rules also set out conditions that would allow Catholic military commanders to comply, without violating their beliefs, with rules giving same-sex couples under their command federal employee benefits as required by law.

      Broglio cited an interpretation from the National Catholic Bioethics Center explaining that Catholic commanders can morally facilitate benefits for gay couples in their command if there was no other way to avoid it without jeopardizing their career.

      "This is also contingent on the commander making known his/her objection to being required to … participate, as well as on attempting through legal channels to continue to accomplish changes in policy consistent with the historic understanding of marriage and family as based on natural moral law," said the statement from the bioethics center.

      It's not perfect but it is getting better. Lets try to be honest with our diaries.
      •  I made this point (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Yoshimi

        And it's pretty minor - saying that Catholics in the military can actually follow military policy even though it means recognizing non-Catholics have rights is supposed to be a positive? I don't see it.

        Boycott Russian vodka, Russian caviar and all things Russian. LGBT oppression cannot be allowed to stand.

        by CPT Doom on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 02:04:11 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  There is no dishonesty in the diary. The quibble (0+ / 0-)

        you claim to be context is that they can facilitate in giving same sex couples federal employee benefits if ordered to do so under threat of court martial.

        Care to give me some examples other than handing out paychecks of federal employee benefits a chaplain can facilitate? Didn't think so.

        That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

        by enhydra lutris on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 02:08:48 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Benefits are more than a paycheck. (0+ / 0-)

          Ask any gay person for equal treatment and they'll as you say "quibble" that it is much more than being paid the same amount as a heterosexual.

          It's disgusting that you dismiss equal treatment of homosexuals as a quibble. You should be ashamed to you their equal treatment as an excuse to bash the church.

          Good day. I'll let you run off in your lovely little fury.

           

          •  "ashamed to USE their equal treatment" (0+ / 0-)

            Good day.

            •  Good day inxdeed, misrepresent what I said (0+ / 0-)

              and run. Even more disgusting than your original misrepresentation is the running away. Is it becasue you know that your reply was a complete distortion?

              That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

              by enhydra lutris on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 03:49:15 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

          •  I don't treat equal treatment of homosexuals (0+ / 0-)

            as a quibble. What is disgusting is you falsely accusing the diarist of being misleading and then posting this malicious misrepresentation of what I said. Not only slander, but hypocrisy at the same time.

            My language was clear, and since you have no answer, because your position has no merit, you choose to slander me instead.

            Now, try to stick to the subject, the facts, reality and what I actually say instead of fabricating something sleazy to falsely and maliciously attribute to me: can a chaplin grant any Federal EMPLOYEE Benefits? No. Can one adjudicate any Federal EMPLOYEE Benefit status? No. Can one enforce any Fexderal EMPLOYEE Benefit? No. Is there any known Federal Employee Benefit, as that term is used by people who have a clue what they're talking about and are not trying to be completely misleading that a chaplain can perform? Yes, handing out paychecks. Do you know of any others? Put up or shut up.

            Either you are completely ignorant of the meaning of the term   Federal Employee Benefit upon which you try to hang your worthless case that the diary is deceptive, or you are maliciously misrepresenting, what I said or both.

            Which is it?

            That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

            by enhydra lutris on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 03:47:31 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

  •  Thanks for not ending with "But Pope Francis is (4+ / 0-)

    going to change this." He's not. He's all about changing the image and tone only.

    •  He's already changing it. (0+ / 0-)

      Patience! You know how slow moving that organization is:

      http://ncronline.org/...

      And if you were paying attention to the list of readings from last week's liturgy it had a clear Liberation Theology theme. The same is true with this week's theme.

      You must start with the message and build momentum from there. This is a political site - we know this to be a fact.

      •  No change except in rhetoric, lipstick on a pig. (0+ / 0-)

        Shortly after his shocking crapola about not yammering about homosexuality and abortion 24-7, he clarified that they aare still sins, sins are sins, sinners are sinners, evil is evil, no doctor should perform abortions, contraception is also right out, ("every unborn baby that could have been born has Jesus Christ's face on it", no less), etc. The sole actual change is that he doesn't think they should harp on this shit 24-7. Maybe only twice weekly for a few hours? Who knows. But if your sife desperately needs an abortion, don't even think of going to a Catholic hospital, even if they run all of the hospitals in your tri-state area, because n.o.t.h.i.n.g. substantive has changed in the slightest.

        That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

        by enhydra lutris on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 02:15:33 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Rhetoric is a start. (0+ / 0-)

          That's how change happens. That's how change has always happened.

          •  No, that's how change is avoided. (0+ / 0-)

            That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

            by enhydra lutris on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 02:47:19 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Outside of a dictatorship, it is how change is (0+ / 0-)

              ALWAYS instigated.

              I'll leave you to your heaving anger.

              •  Not capable of an honsest response and (0+ / 0-)

                expecting the dishonest ones to generate anger? Bwahahahaha.

                Rhetoric can be about change, rhetoric demanding that things change and trying to instigate and organize the movement to put forces in motion to create such change, yes.

                Rhetoric can also be a tool to avoid or postpone change, such as rhetoric that says nothing has changed, but let's keep it down about that, because the negative PR is hurting our recruitment efforts. The resulting rhetoric, whereby one conceals and obfuscates the reality, does not.

                That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

                by enhydra lutris on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 03:53:48 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

    •  And guess who just did a tour of the USA: (0+ / 0-)

      Rev Gerhard Muller did a tour to speak to US Bishops, Cardinals, and Nuns.

      You know who Muller is. If not, I'm sure you will look him up.

  •  SBC claims it is part of their clergy's right to (7+ / 0-)

    freedom of religion to be able to castigate gays, pagans, atheists and others from the pulpit and they will kick any clergyman who provides services to the LGBT community out of the conference:
    http://www.rawstory.com/...
    http://militaryatheists.org/...

    The Catholics are just keeping pace as I note Donohue of the Catholic League claims that priests who molest their parishioners are homosexuals and not pedophiles
    http://www.rawstory.com/...

    •  What about the not insignificant number that go (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Senor Unoball, Cassandra Waites

      after young girls or both?

      Even if a perp has a gender preference, many apparently go after whomever is available.  

      Assaulting children is mostly about personal power.  Sex is the vehicle.

      "Get in the way. Create chaos. Cause trouble. " "On global warming there is no more time to change the Overton Window. We have to break it."

      by sturunner on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 11:28:15 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Donohue doesn't speak for the church. (0+ / 0-)

      His only authority is his ego and his ability to show his face on Fox News.

      •  I haven't seen anyone from the Vatican (0+ / 0-)

        tried to rein this guy in, have you?  

        •  I don't speak for the church either. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          greenbell

          On that note, I'll let you go troll another religious diary.

          •  Nice try. Shut down conversation by throwing (0+ / 0-)

            out the old troll trick.  Not working. It is stated that Bill Donohue doesn't speak for the church. So who does? Just the pope?  The cardinals? The bishops? Donohue is the head of the Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights.  Has anyone of authority in the church itself tell him to shut down his organization and stop "speaking for the church"?  

            I think my point is a valid response to a comment. Just because you don't like Donohue's views doesn't mean they are not representative of a faction of the church.  And that is the problem, isnt' it?  There are hundreds of off shoot groups associated with that institution.... Opus Dei being another example.  Do they also not "speak" for the church?

            Sorry the questions are so hard to answer, but labeling them troll comments is just a way to slip out without answering them, don't you think?

  •  Overused (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Fishtroller01

    Such hypocrisy.  But that's what you suspect of a political organization.  The spiritual part is limited and far between. And of course no mention of Lev 19:27.

    It is all such a bore. On the other hand, this should help atheists.  All they have to do is say "gay marriage" and these leeches will run away and leave em alone.

  •  So, is Mr. Broglio in the military? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Yoshimi

    Seems to me that the head of military chaplains are the various chairmen of the Joint Chiefs, the Secretary of Defense, and the President of the United States.

    A simple order from above should clarify to the working chaplains as to the US Government, and thus, the US military, position regarding equality.

    If a priest does not like that, or want to follow such orders, he can resign his commission.

    Habit of eating have been found increased in people, they just need a sitting place where they can finish their hunger. -- spammer pauldavis 8/21/13

    by Senor Unoball on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 11:39:36 AM PDT

    •  Do military rules override the Constitution? (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Senor Unoball, greenbell

      Isn't this a clear case of the First Amendement?

      It is great the gays are finally getting equal treatment in the military but can the military force a chaplain to go against his religion?

      I'm for gay marriage but I am not for forcing clergy to perform weddings or funerals if it is against his or her particular religion. The simple solution is to make sure that there is a chaplain of a religion that recognizes gay marriage.

      •  Darn few of them (3+ / 0-)

        The problem with your solution is that the SBC, particularly, and other fundamentalist churches have overwhelmed the chaplains core.

        And my problem is not with any refusal to perform a same-sex marriage; I am sure Catholic chaplains in the military also cannot remarry divorced people. However, the refusal to acknowledge the reality of a same-sex marriage in any context is absolutely ridiculous. You can attend a promotion ceremony but not mention the (female) Colonel has a wife? You can conduct a funeral but not have any prayers for the widower? You cannot even attend a counseling session with a military member (and chaplains are supposed to be there for all members, not just their denominations) who has a same-sex spouse?

        Boycott Russian vodka, Russian caviar and all things Russian. LGBT oppression cannot be allowed to stand.

        by CPT Doom on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 01:18:57 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Then you have to fight for equal representation (0+ / 0-)

          within the armed forces but forcing a SBC to perform a wedding for you and your partner isn't the right solution.

          For the record, in my post above I wrote "the gays" which I find really offensive. I meant to type "It's great that gays."

          I hope I didn't offend.

      •  That's an interesting question (0+ / 0-)

        I think that is probably the way it will be handled.

        Habit of eating have been found increased in people, they just need a sitting place where they can finish their hunger. -- spammer pauldavis 8/21/13

        by Senor Unoball on Thu Sep 26, 2013 at 01:22:31 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Well if all these chaplains don't want to (0+ / 0-)

        perform these ceremonies or other activities for gay and lesbian soldiers, then can just hand in their resignations immediately because they are living on my tax dollars and violating federal rules.

        If any clergy, catholic included, want to preserve their religious freedoms under the Constitution, they can stop taking tax dollars through pay, grants, tax exemptions etc. etc.

        The hypocrisy is amazing!

  •  Give it time n/t (0+ / 0-)

    "There ain't no sanity clause." Chico Marx

    by DJ Rix on Fri Sep 27, 2013 at 10:18:02 AM PDT

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site