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Five police officers restraining Luis Rodriguez
Police in Moore, Oklahoma, were summoned to the Warren Theatre. Nair Rodriguez had slapped her daughter for "lying and making bad decisions," which led to police being called on a domestic disturbance complaint.

When police arrived, they say Luis Rodriguez was uncooperative when asked for identification and five Moore Oklahoma police officers took him down. You can hear Luis groaning and those were, unfortunately, the last sounds he appears to make. His wife captured the entire thing on video (warning: this can be very difficult to watch):

From NewsOK:

What happened?

What started as a quiet family evening at the theater watching “RoboCop” escalated once Nair Rodriguez got in a heated argument with her daughter and slapped the girl in the parking lot, Nair Rodriguez said. The five officers already were at the theater dealing with two patrons who passed out drunk in an auditorium, police said.

A bystander who witnessed the argument alerted an officer, so when the officers approached the family, all they knew was they were checking on a domestic incident, something they are obligated to investigate, Stillings said.
They approached Luis Rodriguez and asked for ID.

Nair Rodriguez describes her husband as a peacekeeper, and he was the one who was trying to calm her and prevent her from driving away angry. He tried to bypass the officers, and they reacted.

Stillings said Luis Rodriguez took a defensive stance and clenched his fists when officers tried to detain him. It took all five officers to take him down, and pepper spray was used at one point.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Jean (6+ / 0-)

    Maybe you could provide a link to a few news stories to provide us some context.

    "If you tell the truth, you'll eventually be found out." Mark Twain

    by Steven D on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 12:17:57 PM PST

  •  "OK, he's dead. We can get off him now." (24+ / 0-)

    "You have the right to remain silent.  Forever.  You have the right to a memorial service.  You have the right to have your effects turned over to your surviving next of kin."

    "Do you understand these rights as I have read them to you?  Sir, do you understand these rights?  Sir?"

    "The fool doth think he is wise: the wise man knows himself to be a fool" - W. Shakespeare

    by Hugh Jim Bissell on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 12:21:02 PM PST

  •  Absolutely horrifying. (17+ / 0-)

    I don't know why they allow police techniques like this, all those officers crushing him.  Maybe he had a heart attack, but these things seem to be avoidable.

  •  WTF? He's on the ground with five guys on top (12+ / 0-)

    of him and they tell him to "calm down"?

    "Onward through the fog!" - Oat Willie

    by rocksout on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 12:31:44 PM PST

  •  Is there any more information? Just the video? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    slowbutsure, Buddykat

    When did this happen?

    "A nation of sheep will beget a government of wolves." Edward R. Murrow

    by temptxan on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 12:37:10 PM PST

  •  Some News Links after a quick search (8+ / 0-)

    Couple of News sites have info on this tragedy.

    Norman Transcritp

  •  Info (9+ / 0-)

    Oklahoma is not a "stop and identify" state where one must give their true name and true address to police when asked.  I.D. Documents are never required except in certain circumstances...driving, etc.  in all states one must truthfully identify themselves if arrested.

    •  MarEng - the police contend that they were (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Simul Iustus et Peccator, Lujane

      investigating the commission of crime that involved family members and that the deceased would not cooperate and tried to leave the scene. When the police tried to restrain him he became violent. All of that precedes the video in the diary. Who knows what the truth is? Certainly not me.

      "let's talk about that"

      by VClib on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 01:09:55 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  The truth is staring you right in the face (15+ / 0-)

        but there is none so blind as those who will not see.

        The police tackled the man (possibly hitting his head against the concrete pavement) and pepper-sprayed the man and sat on him face down with 5 heavy officers on top... an old man who is overweight with blood pressure problems.

        Not one witness came forward to say that the man "became violent." Not one. That is a figment of your imagination.

        What the police said was the man "clenched his fists and "took a defensive stance."

        He wasn't mouthy. Did not lay one hand on the cops. When the cops became violent, the man clenched his fists by his side and spread his legs a millimeter too wide to suit the cops.

        And he was murdered for it.

        One does not become enlightened by imagining figures of light, but by making the darkness conscious. --Carl Jung

        by bronte17 on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 01:57:41 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  The most expansive press report (3+ / 0-)

          including videos of the police press conference are including the Norman Report. The link is in this thread.

          The Norman Report provides more information about the police conduct and their perspective.

          As I noted above I don't have enough information to make a judgement. Part of the issue is that the video does not include what happened before the police took the deceased to the ground and put him in handcuffs. The autopsy will also be illuminating.  

          "let's talk about that"

          by VClib on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 02:16:58 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  That Norman Report didn't say anything conclusive (7+ / 0-)

            It reported a moviegoer as being afraid because the mother argued with the daughter, so that person called the cops.

            And because the argument was labeled a "domestic incident" it supposedly rose to a criminal activity. Supposedly. Arguing with your kid in public is now criminal activity.

            But, this was done by the mother.

            The cops forcibly absconded with her cell phone. And copied the contents. Because they think they can get away with this. Because too many Americans have given up their rights and liberties for some perceived benefit of "police state security."

            One does not become enlightened by imagining figures of light, but by making the darkness conscious. --Carl Jung

            by bronte17 on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 02:40:24 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Slapping your daughter in public is a crime. (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              •  The daughter is 19 and not underage (6+ / 0-)

                and you're telling me that slapping someone is now a criminal activity even if the party getting slapped doesn't go to the police and file a police report themselves?

                Slapping is an open hand.

                The cops supposedly killed the man because he clenched his fingers up.

                Sounds to me like clenched fingers are now criminal, but open fingers are not.

                Americans need to learn this stuff.

                And maybe learn some breathing techniques and meditation in the event that cops show up and you don't want to get shot for holding your fingers and feet the wrong way, but you're tense and forget what the fuck is the proper way to hold your body. So, you need the meditation.

                One does not become enlightened by imagining figures of light, but by making the darkness conscious. --Carl Jung

                by bronte17 on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 03:08:51 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  Yes, and even more so since she was 19 and (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Lujane, BlackSheep1

                  not a minor. You can not put you hands on another adult in public, especially an adult who is within your immediate family because it is then domestic violence and most definitely a crime....regardless if the daughter filed or not.  Why??  Do you know how many wives out there refuse to file against their husband's even with black eyes and broken bones?  Hence the reason it is a crime regardless, if an assault happened, within a family unit.   Even in an argument with no physical contact can be labeled as such if the abuse is considered emotional and most definitely in public.  

                  •  Is this federal? (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Tonedevil, pengiep

                    Is this applicable across all jurisdictions in all states?

                    One does not become enlightened by imagining figures of light, but by making the darkness conscious. --Carl Jung

                    by bronte17 on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 04:30:50 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  Read the VAWA. Federally it can be a spouse (2+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      Lujane, BlackSheep1

                      Child, and/or someone who simply co-habituates in the same residence.  In Oklahoma, a battery must occur for it to be listed as domestic violence and the people involved can be married, boyfriend and girlfriend, child and parent or immediate family (blood or marriage)....but words are not enough.  It has to be a battery but other "batteries" are listed such as spitting and threats of harm that would be physical in nature.  So, spitting or threatening to hit is considered a battery besides the more common physical touch meant to do harm. Slapping is a battery.  Pulling hair is a battery.  Pushing someone down stairs is a battery.  Anything with malice intent and physical contact is a battery.  

                      •  Strange how we have constraints wrapped (5+ / 0-)

                        around families who live in constant close proximity with each other and can be expected to have disagreements.

                        And yet we have given a stranger the power to make the judgment call that an argument is "battery" and the stranger calls in a police force who then engage in such harmful "battery" that they inflict death upon a peaceful old man.

                        What is wrong with these circumstances? Something isn't working properly.

                        One does not become enlightened by imagining figures of light, but by making the darkness conscious. --Carl Jung

                        by bronte17 on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 07:33:55 PM PST

                        [ Parent ]

                  •  yes, true, but a matter of degree (7+ / 0-)

                    It was the MOTHER who hit her daughter. The man who died here was trying to broker the peace between his wife and daughter. It is on the video.

                    That a mother slaps her daughter may be illegal, but I assume  it shouldn't seem so threatening to those five burly police officers. Heck, the "perpertrator"was standing by filming, unscathed.

                    •  Okay, true. But what happened prior to the video? (0+ / 0-)

                      Did the man just stand there when the officers attacked and had done nothing wrong originally?  If so, then you got a point.

                      However, we don't know that part for other words,  Did he refuse to corporate and become combative when they were in the process of investigating a crime?  Was he involved in the original argument in some way? Was he also mad at his daughter and act out in that anger?  

                      What happened first?

                      •  when it comes to the death it doesn' tmatter (8+ / 0-)

                        I was trained in restraint in the mental health setting.
                        We are trained to never restrain people with an obese abdomen or pregnant women face down because they have trouble breathing in that position.

                        We have been trained to be careful how much weigh to put on ANYONE who is restrained face down because after a certain weight it is hard to breathe

                        We are trained to check breathing periodically (1x min?)

                        THESE police put the weight of five burly officers (1000lb?) on this guy's back. We watch him...he is not moving much if at all. They tell him to stop struggling.

                        The obese abdomen is pushed in and up by the wt of the body (and the men on top if it). That leaves no room for the diaphram to extend down to inhale.

                        This man was gradually asphixiating. Any thrashing he was doing was very likely from air hunger, fighting to breathe.

                        It is simple physics and physiology. When you can' t breathe, all other struggles are forgotten.

                        These people smothered this man.

                        And that is what matters. And they should have known better because you aren't supposed to restrain obese people face down NOR put that kind of weight on them

                        You can hear at the start of the video, FYI "I can't breathe!"

                        •  Almost all suspects are restrained face down in a (0+ / 0-)

                          arrest with combative suspects in a police situation, if at all possible.  It has to be that way for safety reasons.

                          They likely hear "Stop...I can't breathe!" or "Stop you are hurting me" or "Stop...I am having an asthma attack" or "Stop...I am having a heart attack" or ' are breaking my arm" 50 times a day during arrests.  People don't like being arrested.

                           However...all of the rest of what you said is true.  There may have been no need for 5 officers after a certain moment in time during the altercation.  What time and moment could be a debatable topic, but likely the moment he stopped moving and was under key....and from the looks of it, they continued past that point.   Could they have known at that very moment they were causing harm or did they feel as if they were following protocol?  Again, likely will become a debatable topic.  Did they do it with malice intent?  or was it done because of whatever happened prior to the video and they truly believed it necessary?  

                          Don't know the answer to that....but I feel there was some mistakes made, definitely,  but likely without malice intent.   Mainly I want to know what happened first?  

                          •  they need to investigate all claims of (2+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            Lujane, Damaged262

                            "I can't breathe" because the position is hard to breathe in.

                            If the person is older they should pay particular attention.

                            If the person has an obese abdomen they MUST be vigilant because almost ALL people with an obese abdomen CANNOT BREATHE if the weight of officers is on their back.

                            THe person continues to struggle and VERY OFTEN it is because they are struggling to breathe rather than being a threat any longer.

                            One officer needs to be monitoring the breathing.

                            I still think they are crazy to put a big beer belly face down. Such people often can't breathe that way with NO ONE on their back.

                            Police need to learn some physiology. Mr Beer belly would be quickly subdued, his thrashing would be to breathe, they should and need to restrain him asap and then get him up right.

                          •  The pigs should be tried for manslaughter. (4+ / 0-)

                            "Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens," -Friedrich Schiller "Against Stupidity, the Gods themselves contend in Vain"

                            by pengiep on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 06:11:17 PM PST

                            [ Parent ]

                          •  I see no malice, I see stupidity (2+ / 0-)
                            Recommended by:
                            DSPS owl, Damaged262

                            officers must be trained that the cries of "I can't breathe" if if they come from someone with an obese abdomen restrained face down with weight on him are very likely true.

                            If someone got a good look at his face during that time while he was still feebly moving, his face and lips would have been blue.

                            They need to take a look. There were plenty of them.

                            What happens is the person is thrashing struggling to breathe and officers feel they can't call someone "subdued" until they are completely motionless

                            But in the fight to breathe...dying (this has happened many times lately in the nws) someone WILL thrash it is involuntary.

                            If someone is weakly thrashing but officers are in control they can spare one to make sure they guy is breathing and not blue.

                            BUT THEY DON"T BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT TRAINED THAT WAY. THey need to be trained to KNOW that if someone has an obese abdomen their claims of not being able to breathe MUST be taken seriously.

                            It is possible to keep officers safe and have one officer or stander by check. Look at his face. I'td been blue in this case.

                      •  Why does this matter!!! (5+ / 0-)

                        The police should be held to a higher standard.

                        I don't care if there was a big ole screaming match between the family in the parking lot.  The police's job is to calm the situation, then find out what happen and make arrests if necessary.

                        Clearly the police went there and failed to calm the situation and dad ended up dead.    Pretty simple.

              •  It's called assault and battery. It's against the (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:

                law in all 50 states. If the daughter's underage, child abuse investigators are needed; if not, cops are needed. You're not supposed to hit people, and if you do it in public so it scares bystanders, you're in trouble.

                LBJ, Van Cliburn, Ike, Wendy Davis, Lady Bird, Ann Richards, Barbara Jordan, Molly Ivins, Sully Sullenburger, Drew Brees: Texas is NO Bush League!

                by BlackSheep1 on Wed Feb 26, 2014 at 09:38:45 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

              •  RE: Slapping your daughter in public is a crime. (0+ / 0-)

                The man that police murdered had not slapped anyone.

          •  Why does it matter? (4+ / 0-)

            I don't care if the man was cursing them at the top of his lungs and swinging around his empty fists, that was no reason to KILL him.

            Police are supposed to be trained on how to deescalate  a situation, these cops obviously missed class that day.

            An unarmed man does not need to be tackled by multiple men and pepper sprayed.  

            The police should have talked to him, got his story and then reported the slapping incident to child services for them to investigate later.  Child services could then visit the home and see if there was abuse happening or whether it was just an isolated incident of a kid mouthing off at the wrong time with mom.

            •  EcC = there is no doubt that the police (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Be Skeptical

              actions resulted in this tragic death. According to the police the deceased wouldn't talk to them and attempted to leave the scene without identifying himself, or giving the police a statement. The police claim that the altercation started when they would not allow the deceased to leave the scene. I have no idea if that is true or not.

              None of us know what happened before the start of the video.

              "let's talk about that"

              by VClib on Wed Feb 26, 2014 at 08:50:21 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

        •  There's no use arguing with VC "Lib" (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          The Dead Man, Tonedevil, OHdog, Damaged262

          He's a die-hard conservative blowhard who will never admit when he is wrong. Which is pretty much all the time.

          If you don't watch the news, you're uninformed. If you watch Fox news, you're mis-informed. (paraphrasing Mark Twain)

          by edg on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 02:59:57 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  their combined wt 1000lbs-with his obese (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        nascent orange, Damaged262, Conium

        abdomen face down made it impossible for him to breathe. They teach that. You can't put a pregnant woman or someone with a belly like his even on their stomach held by one person. They can't breathe.

        They put so much weight on him his diaphram could not move down (belly pushed in by wt in the way).

        THIS is truth we do know. We can see it on the video. At the start of the video I hear him say "I can't breathe!", I am pretty sure.

        They restrained him in a way that predictably would result in his death. THis we do know, it is documented in front of our eyes no matter what happened beforehand.

      •  here's the thing -- (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        nascent orange, kbrown2225

        what happened beforehand doesn't impinge on the officers' behavior after their arrival.

        they claim he "tossed" one of them off of him. That's not shown on the video.

        Two were already there to deal with nonresponsive persons (public intoxication cases) as was EMS (passed-out drunks in the theatre). Three more officers came in to respond to a "domestic violence" call -- and they wouldn't listen to the guy.

        Assumption in cases like that is always that the big threat is the guy. (Statistically, that is a good assumption, btw: in 98.5%+ of cases, a guy is more likely to be the imminent threat.)

        He wants to go to his family. They want to detain him. They don't want to listen to him. He doesn't want to waste a lot of time on their concerns: his wife and daughter are his focus.

        This is not the behavior they need to induce, so they take him into custody -- with force. He's a big guy, they're going to expect to need backup. He goes down on his face, they pile on (football? No. Dogpile! Remember grade-school playgrounds?) and ... whoops. Guy's not moving, not breathing, not responding.

        Uh, boss? We didn' t intend to kill him ...
        Yeah. But you did. Screwed up massively, boys. Now we have to keep the public from finding out.

        Dollars to doughnuts some version of that conversation has already happened.

        LBJ, Van Cliburn, Ike, Wendy Davis, Lady Bird, Ann Richards, Barbara Jordan, Molly Ivins, Sully Sullenburger, Drew Brees: Texas is NO Bush League!

        by BlackSheep1 on Wed Feb 26, 2014 at 09:37:20 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  These cops are pure scum. (5+ / 0-)


  •  Police way over-responded, then keep trying (15+ / 0-)

    to quiet the wife.

    This incident was absolutely disgusting, and a horrible abuse of police power. All the cops involved should be tried and prosecuted. They do not belong on a police force. But I fear there are too many like them that over-react and over-respond as these did.

    Instead of attempting to communicate with the husband, the minute he showed resistance of any sort he was brutally subdued and forced to the ground. This is way over-reacting on the part of the police.

    When you see TV cops beating a suspect, you can see that acceptable police conduct is becoming more and more brutal and violent. Television is reflecting how police in America respond to even moderate confrontation.

    My concern is that this is now a commonplace practice.

    Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed. Everything else is public relations. ~ George Orwell

    by 4Freedom on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 01:05:04 PM PST

  •  Everybody take a breath. (0+ / 0-)

    The video and the news reports here are absolutely not conclusive of police brutality.  It may turn out to be.  But I do not see it yet.

    Government works when you elect those who want it to. --askyron (2013)

    by Simul Iustus et Peccator on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 01:28:20 PM PST

    •  huh... because the batons did not come out (6+ / 0-)

      but the pepper spray and the body slam against concrete and the positional asphyxiation by 5 heavy police officers on an old man with blood pressure problems did come out.

      So, because it was a rather quiet brutality, it doesn't count?

      One does not become enlightened by imagining figures of light, but by making the darkness conscious. --Carl Jung

      by bronte17 on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 02:02:46 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  see, we have enough evidence here (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      OHdog, Damaged262, chrisculpepper

      a man with a big belly is held face down with the combined weight of 5 burly officers (?1000lbs) on his back.

      It is extremely hard for anyone to breathe with that weight on them.

      It is impossible for anyone who is largely pregnant or has an obese belly to breathe. SOme obese people can't breathe face down at all with little wt on them.

      We are taught in learning restraint to not put our body weight on people who are obese and to check every 20 seconds to be sure they are breathing. Some institutions do not allow face down restraint of obese individuals (it's the belly...a giant beer belly counts)

      To breathe, your diaphram moves down. IF your obese stomach or pregnancy is pushed in because the wt on top of you, your diaphram cannot move down and you cannot inhale.

      These men on top of him, feeling him struggle, were thinking he was struggling go get free. STUPID. He's older and out of shape...ONE of them could "take" him.

      HE was struggling to breathe...thrashing in panic to breathe, perhaps.

      This happens all around the country. Poorly trained police. They smothered him to death and mistook his last desparate thrashes and moans as combating instead of the struggle not to die.

      No one was checking there if he was still breathing

      It is dispicable. They need to turn to mental health fascilities to learn how to restrain properly. People die in mental health facilities too but at least they are trained better it would seem.

      Five heavy people would never lean on one person's back. And they'd be checking for breathing


    •  SIeP: does your nick really mean (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      To one who does not work but trusts him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned as righteousness.

      LBJ, Van Cliburn, Ike, Wendy Davis, Lady Bird, Ann Richards, Barbara Jordan, Molly Ivins, Sully Sullenburger, Drew Brees: Texas is NO Bush League!

      by BlackSheep1 on Wed Feb 26, 2014 at 10:02:18 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Well we do have the dead guy... (0+ / 0-)

      that might be evidence that the police were at fault.

  •  Video unfortunately starts late... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    ...after these alleged events have already occurred:

    "He was not involved in the disturbance. However, when police came, they focused their attention on Luis. Taking him face down onto the pavement, pepper-spraying his mouth, nose and eyes and putting the weight of five grown men on top of him, and then handcuffing him as he was unconscious or already dead," said Michael Brooks-Jimenez, attorney for the Rodriguez family.
    Stories seem to indicate there's security camera footage that hopefully shows the whole thing.   Also, this apparently happened in front of a bunch of witnesses.
  •  Fucking pigs trying to block camera when they know (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    he's dead.

  •  The cops in Moore are well-known (5+ / 0-)

    around here to be little more than thugs. For the past 50 years, cops who couldn't get on the force anywhere else have been able to join the Moore PD. I admittedly don't have data, but that is the conventional wisdom in the area.

  •  This is not about a few corrupt cops. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    happymisanthropy, Hastur

    IMO We are up against a corrupt police union.  It's my understanding that this is from where the s**t flows downhill.  For instance, has anyone ever wondered what the drug testing policy for cops is?  There isn't one.  This is because the policy would have to be approved by the union.  That's not going to happen.  I imagine the threat of a countrywide strike is enough to keep any serious corruption investigation from gaining a foothold.  

    What's the difference between the Federal government and organized crime? One's legally sanctioned.

    by FrankenPC on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 01:48:34 PM PST

  •  What happened before the filming??? (0+ / 0-)

    You don't see that. What you see are cops cuffing someone who was alleged to be uncooperative and combative. Had he shown his ID, and cooperated, he would not have been put in that situation. What I saw in that video was text book display of police subduing an uncooperative subject. Tragic, yes, but by failing to comply, he contributed to his demise.
    Nobody likes a cop, until they're coming to your home to save YOUR ass.

    •  That's just it. (10+ / 0-)

      If only he'd have complied with Authority, he'd might still be alive.

      We don't fucking have to COMPLY. These fuckers need to be reminded that they work for us.

      And I guarantee you, they aren't getting called to my house for any reason whatsoever. Save my ass, my ass. They're just as likely to shoot me.

      •  Wrong. (0+ / 0-)

        These police officers were responding to a report of domestic battery. This man was a party in the report. Police not only had the right to ask for his ID, they had legal authority to pat him down.
        There was no taser or night sticks here. He was being cuffed.
        Don't you find it odd that all video prior to him being cuffed was cropped?

        •  wrong (5+ / 0-)

          Oklohama is not a stop and identify state

          if he wasn't driving a vehicle, he is not required to produce his papers.  He isn't even required to identify himself if he chooses not to.

          That being said, the death was obviously not intentional, they were following procedures for non-compliance and were not excessively brutal, just stupidly piling on, figuring he would be ok with 5 people standing on his chest.  

          •  Wrong again. (0+ / 0-)

            There was reasonable suspicion a crime did occur. In a "Terry stop" scenario, as this was, police have authority to request identification, and ensure no one involved in the incident is armed. This includes passengers in a car, and those in the company of those suspected of committing a crime. During their investigation, parties are "seized", as in not free to leave.
            I didn't see anyone "standing on his chest." A man had a knee on his chest. But, nothing that would have been life threatening.
            I get it. It is a tragedy. But, it could have been avoided if the victim had cooperated.

            •  Cooperate, comply, submit to my AUTHORITY. (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              chrisculpepper, Conium

              When Eric Cartman says it is  parody, here not so much.

              Life is just a bowl of Cherries, that stain your hands and clothes and have pits that break your teeth.

              by OHdog on Wed Feb 26, 2014 at 04:35:22 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

            •  Yeah, right (0+ / 0-)

              Blame the victim, the police responded to a domestic disturbance and KILLLED one of the witnessess and YOU want to blame the dead guy?

              •  Not true. (0+ / 0-)

                The victim did die. But, his death was not due to the police using excessive force. He probably died due to an existing medical condition excaserbated by the struggle HE initiated with his non-compliance.
                So yes, I do blame him.

            •  no they don't (0+ / 0-)

              you need to click on the link I provided:

              Police may question a person detained in a Terry stop, but in general, the detainee is not required to answer.[10] However, many states have "stop and identify" laws that explicitly require a person detained under the conditions of Terry to identify himself to police, and in some cases, provide additional information.
              States with "stop and identify" laws

              Alabama Ala. Code §15-5-30
              Arizona Ari. Rev. Stat. Tit. 13, §2412 (enacted 2005)
              Arkansas Ark. Code Ann. §5-71-213(a)(1) (loitering)
              Colorado Colo. Rev. Stat. §16-3-103(1)
              Delaware Del. Code Ann., Tit. 11, §§1902, 1321(6)
              Florida Fla. Stat. §901.151 (Stop and Frisk Law); §856.021
              Georgia Ga. Code Ann. §16-11-36(b) (loitering)
              Illinois Ill. Comp. Stat., ch. 725, §5/107-14
              Indiana Indiana Code §34-28-5-3.5
              Kansas Kan. Stat. Ann. §22-2402(1)
              Louisiana La. Code Crim. Proc. Ann., Art. 215.1(A); La.
              Missouri Mo. Rev. Stat. §84.710(2)
              Montana Mont. Code Ann. §46-5-401
              Nebraska Neb. Rev. Stat. §29-829
              Nevada Nev. Rev. Stat. §171.123
              New Hampshire N.H. Rev. Stat. Ann. §594:2, §644:6
              New Mexico N.M. Stat. Ann. §30-22-3
              New York N.Y. Crim. Proc. Law §140.50
              North Dakota N.D. Cent. Code §29-29-21 (PDF)
              Ohio Ohio Rev. Code §2921.29 (enacted 2006)
              Rhode Island R.I. Gen. Laws §12-7-1
              Utah Utah Code Ann. §77-7-15
              Vermont Vt. Stat. Ann., Tit. 24, §1983
              Wisconsin Wis. Stat. §968.24

        •  "Parties to a report" do not have to ID themselves (9+ / 0-)

          in Oklahoma. The police did not have the right to demand his identity or detain him for anything whatsoever.

          The report was about the mother - a female person, distinguishable from male persons in most cases even by police officers - slapping the daughter.

          They had no legal authority to frisk the guy (or as you say, "pat him down"). On what basis?  A witness!?!?!  Witnesses are cuffed for what reason?  Witnesses are not compelled to speak to the police for any reason. Certainly not by force.

          What I find odd is your:  1) misapplication of the law; and 2) excusing the deadly actions of authority.

          "The law is meant to be my servant and not my master, still less my torturer and my murderer." -- James Baldwin. July 11, 1966.

          by YucatanMan on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 02:47:51 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  Police confiscated the cell phone with the video (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Damaged262, chrisculpepper, Conium

          who knows if they deleted any?

          Life is just a bowl of Cherries, that stain your hands and clothes and have pits that break your teeth.

          by OHdog on Wed Feb 26, 2014 at 04:33:16 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  Exactly (5+ / 0-)

        You do not have to comply.

        Doesn't matter if you are breaking the law or not, you have the right to run, or mouth off, or plop yourself on the ground and not move.  They have no right to kill you.

        The police should be held to a higher standard because their mistakes can mean death or false imprisonment.  I don't know why some people here don't see that.  They are the ones that should be polite.

    •  Sickening how the 4th is now a quaint anachronism (8+ / 0-)

      And why in the hell do we need Stand Your Ground laws and SWAT teams and Militias... if these militarized cops are the bad ass ones to come to YOUR home to save YOUR ASS?

      This occurred outside a movie theatre complex. The mother was arguing with the daughter... the MOTHER... and someone freaked out and called the cops.

      And that is because of the gun-hugging nuts on the prowl and the overreaction by the public seeing scary things in every situation.

      One does not become enlightened by imagining figures of light, but by making the darkness conscious. --Carl Jung

      by bronte17 on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 02:12:09 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Two people had passed out drunk in the theater (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    YucatanMan, Penny GC, pengiep, Hastur

    and five officers responded?  There must not be much going on in Moore, Oklahoma.

  •  Well, there sure is ALOT going on in Moore now! (0+ / 0-)

    Peace and Blessings!

    For those abused, war torn and blood-soaked regions of the world: due to our apathy, our need for cheap shit, and our wars on terror and drugs, we apologize for the inconvenience.

    by Penny GC on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 02:54:08 PM PST

  •  The Texas Rangers (cops, not baseball team) ... (0+ / 0-)

    motto is "One riot, one Ranger". I guess the Moore police motto is "One passed-out drunk, half the damn force".

    If you don't watch the news, you're uninformed. If you watch Fox news, you're mis-informed. (paraphrasing Mark Twain)

    by edg on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 03:04:40 PM PST

  •  The police murdered him. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    pengiep, Hastur, Damaged262

    I'm surprised they didn't take the phone away from her once they realized he was dead. But the horrible thing is that when the police are murdering your husband, there's nowhere to turn for help. We live in a police state and the police are the enemies of the people.

    48forEastAfrica - Donate to Oxfam> "It is better to light a candle than to curse the darkness." Edna St.V. Millay

    by slouching on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 03:19:38 PM PST

  •  Whatever you do, do not call the cops (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    pengiep, Hastur

    Obama: self-described Republican; backed up by right-wing policies

    by The Dead Man on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 03:52:46 PM PST

  •  He said "I can't breathe" near the start (0+ / 0-)

    damn them

  •  "The lethal hazard of Prone Restraint" (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    pengiep, ruscle, Hastur, Conium


    "The continuing panic and desperation to breathe may cause Security Staff to see the person as a continued threat and apply even more force to restrain them. While struggling with these security staff the person expends large amounts of energy trying to breathe. The individual becomes exhausted with low blood oxygen and when they are finally unable to struggle any more, it may be too late."

    I watched the video twice. Seems like that is what was happening here. I don't see any officer monitoring his breathing at all. He died 10 feet from his wife with 5 burly police officers crushing the breath out of him.

    So sad.

  •  Regardless of what transpired prior to video (6+ / 0-)

    Do we really need people who are so ignorant they can't even recognize when they are killing another human being in charge of security?

    They are sitting on him while he is dead to make him calm down.  You can't get any more calm than DEAD.  Yet there they sit, like mighty victors on the body of the non-struggling lifeless body.  

    And this in response to such an insignificant "crime."


  •  How Much Longer (4+ / 0-)

    Are we going to allow these armed thugs to beat and kill us? It has to end, it's completely out of control.

    "We have become a Nazi monster in the eyes of the whole world - bullies and bastards who would rather kill than live peacefully. We are whores for power and oil with hate and fear in our hearts" - Hunter S. Thompson

    by Dave925 on Tue Feb 25, 2014 at 09:01:16 PM PST

  •  You know (4+ / 0-)

    It is amazing to me that we can watch a video of a fellow getting killed on video, and read testimony from his wife, and then read comment after comment from people who caution us that we need to see things from the police side of the matter.

    I'm freaking sorry, but if people with overwhelming force and guns on their hips kill an unarmed fellow, they don't have presumption of innocence or good intent.  They killed a man.  We are not cattle and our deaths cannot be excused as necessary failures of some physical management technique.  And if we've really reached the point where we make apologia for regular violence on this level, things are sad indeed.

    Bring the department of justice to your town and get court oversight.  Fire some cops.  Here in Seattle the police ended up under Justice Department supervision after a young military trained cop blew away an old woodcarver (in a place where he was a fixture) for crossing the street with his pocketknife out.  The cops are still trying to squirm out of stuff, but at least there is a constant and real counterpressure.

    Another reason why federal elections matter.

    ...j'ai découvert que tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos dans une chambre.

    by jessical on Wed Feb 26, 2014 at 02:50:13 AM PST

  •  Article (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    It sounds like there might be a little more to this story. I am aware that the Po-po gets a little carried away' but what is the big deal about showing your ID?

  •  I called Moore, OK police chief and was told (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    chrisculpepper, Conium

    the OSBI is handling it (was told this when I told assistant the Chief needs to get control over his officers).  Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation.  

    Moore OK had that giant tornado episode.  Everyone felt bad for them.  Then their cops kill someone like this.  So sad.  So scary.  So sickening.  The true meaning of thugs.  You know they are when one of them is trying to block video taping, and no one would immediately answer wife's questions.  

  •  Show complete obedience to the Gestapo... (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    chrisculpepper, Conium, dconrad

    or they will kill you to teach you a lesson.  I mean pretty much this man was executed for failing to show his ID and for not kowtowing to the police when ordered to do so.

  •  Police (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    chrisculpepper, Conium, kbrown2225

    So ridiculous. You can see the cops know he is dead and it was their doing. They look guilty as hell.  Hope they get their asses sued and lose their jobs. 5-1 unreal!

    I am glad it was recorded.

  •  Cops out of control (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    chrisculpepper, Conium, kbrown2225

    Here's another example of our militaristic cops being totally out of control.  Instead of taking the time to talk to the individuals, they gang up and attack the victim.  These officers deserve to be brought up on manslaughter charges.   Hope this family gets a huge settlement from the lawsuit that should be filed against these thugs.  Fortunately the wife had the foresight to film this tragedy.  It is obvious that one of the officers was holding his hand against the man's throat.  No wonder he died.

  •  Execution by cop (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    chrisculpepper, Conium

    Typical cops...white cops. How sad for this family. Hope she sues that police department for a shitload of money and wins. The police need to stop murdering people.

  •  Cops murdered an innocent man. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    They really showed their authoritaaay.  These disgusting police officers should be incarcerated for a very long period of time.  No one should ever be treated this way.  Damn, I hate cops!

  •  Seems like cops murder a lot of people. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    chrisculpepper, Conium

    When do we get to start fighting back?

  •  Do the people of Moore condone such as this? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    If they do, I hope another tornado comes and wipes what's left of their town off the map.  

  •  Oklahoma (0+ / 0-)

    The name used to bring memories of a musical, now I will always remember the brutality that comes with the nazification of a whole state. Are the fascists alive and well in Oklahoma? Oh yes and they love to brutalize and murder ordinary citizens in the streets. Just watch the video if you don't believe me. By the way all of these murderers will not be charged. Mark my words, they will be considered to have acted professionally in dispensing capital judgement on the streets of this putrid, backwards little state.

  •  Idiots! (0+ / 0-)

    These cops need to be prosecuted for Manslaughter. ALL of them must be incarcerated and not be allowed to ever be on a Police force again.

    Show me your horse and he will tell me who you really are,,,

    by Bullie on Wed Feb 26, 2014 at 06:00:43 PM PST

  •  So pretty much... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    The police got called to a domestic disturbance call and managed to kill one of the witnesses for being "uncooperative"?

  •  No attempt at resuscitation? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:

    The whole time they were harassing the wife and realizing he was DEAD, not one of these "professionals" even attempted to start his heart again?  I've seen how Boss Hogg (on a related article) stood up for his officers, even though nobody tried to bring him back to life.  What awesome cops.  This is why they should be charged with manslaughter and if the state doesn't move against them, then the feds damn well better.  Meanwhile, the EMS crew should be facing negligence charges as it's lain to see they didn't even bother trying as soon as they got there, I'm sure nobody wanted to get pepper spay on them, even though the standard procedure doesn't even call for artificial respiration any longer, just compressions.  

    I've lived in OK having gone to Tulsa University (a long, long time ago) where I'd been robed at gun point.  They got shitty with me after reporting it as I'd only been robbed of $14 or $15 dollars.  But that wasn't the damn point, I got robbed by a gun toting scumbag.  But, I was just a married college student living off campus, why should they give a shit about me?  That few dollars was to buy food for my pregnant wife, so I got to get the privilege of selling plasma to make up the loss.  Good times, good times.  I don't miss Oklahoma one little bit.

    I'm damaged and I like it, it made me what I am! BTW, my avatar is as stollen as my father's retirement fund.

    by Damaged262 on Wed Feb 26, 2014 at 06:25:53 PM PST


    These Nazi tactics are becoming the normal behavior of many of our law enforcement personnel. It will continue until they are fired, lose their pensions, hauled into court and convicted and then sent to a state prison for the remainder of their lives, which is where they belong.

  •  A woman slapped her daughter and this "frightened" (0+ / 0-)

    another person so much she had to call the police? I can understand calling the police when you witness someone slapping another, but I wonder where the 'Fear' came from?
    Calling and saying you're afraid has the effect of raising the tension and seriousness of an issue much more than a statement like."I just witnessed a woman slap another".
    Some blame should be attached to the initial caller for the extra tension..
    By no means should the initial caller be responsible for 5 officers suffocating a man to death
    Nowhere in that scenario is there mention of the Father, so how he became involved is curious to me.

    "If you tell the truth, you won't have to remember anything", Mark Twain

    by Cruzankenny on Thu Feb 27, 2014 at 04:26:08 AM PST

  •  Why are police murdering people openly? (0+ / 0-)

    This isn't the first video that's kept me up all night and the last one, made me sick. How did "Protect and Serve",..become gang beating cold blooded, victim begging murderers?  Then they're walking PD free without jail? These people have something wrong with them. Maybe PTSD or maybe they have lowered the standards for sanity as they used to have to be an Officer at all.
    While my Dad was a Detective in a southern PD force decades ago, he often spoke of the PD beatings ( especially of black people innocent or not) their cells..
    I see the blue code still applies and it still makes me ill.
    I know for a fact they're all not like this..But for myself, and my dad, we have never understood how the others remain silent and no one stops them. If someone can kill in cold blood, what makes their partner assume, they won't be killed too?
    The Fed's need to end this once and for all, all over this country! Otherwise, no one will ever be able to trust which are the good PD and which ones are psychos in uniform.

  •  Hey! What's the problem (0+ / 0-)

    ; this has been going on in the black communities for decades. Isn't it SOP?

    No country can be both ignorant and free - Thomas Jefferson

    by fjb on Thu Feb 27, 2014 at 12:52:41 PM PST

  •  Reality? (0+ / 0-)

    What I heard at the end was that he was breathing.  Is there something  missing from the footage?

  •  The moral of this story is... (0+ / 0-)

    If you are stopped by the police and are asked to produce ID or follow some other direction, THEN COMPLY. As we've seen so often recently, a lot of cops out there are fascist pigs, and after being given a badge and a gun, they suddenly think they can play God with the citizenry. Thus, it's advisable for a person who's confronted by the police to follow all of their directives, no matter how stupid or ridiculous you think they are. Any occurrence of excessive force or other police misconduct can be addressed later, and then you will live to fight another day. Sadly, in this incident, Luis Rodriguez decided not to listen to the cops, and it cost him his life. Nowadays, police officers are not known for their restraint in dealing with civilians, especially in situations involving minorities.

    •  And Tigger Too sums it up well (0+ / 0-)

      The police are nothing more than Law Enforcement.  They cannot determine good people from bad people. If they are on the scene, you are already marked as a potential bad person.  If you show them any form of hostile action, they will respond with extreme force - and they should.

      There is nothing to be gained by resisting arrest.  Police are not going to be convinced of your innocence by your ignoring them or resisting.  Even if you are in a protest, most peaceful protest organizers advise you not to resist arrest.

      Ultimately this man's pride killed him. If that is hard for someone to understand, I suspect they are also full of pride. What would have happened to Luis had he just complied?  Maybe, been sat on the curb?  Given a fine and sent on his way?  Spent a night in jail?  He probably wouldn't be dead I'll tell you that right now.

      If a man walks up to you with a gun and asks "Who's in charge here?"  If you answer anything other than the man with the gun is in charge, you don't fully understand the gravity of your situation.

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