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Hardly able to mask his glee, National Review editor Rich "Starburst" Lowry penned an op-ed in Thursday's Politico, celebrating the demise of any sort of meaningful gun legislation coming out of Washington.

And in doing so, Lowry serves up one of the standard talking points that the cold, dead hands crowd has been peddling since shortly after the murder of 20 children and six educators in Newtown, Connecticut:

Nothing that happened in Newtown had anything to do with background checks. No background check law will ever prevent someone like Sandy Hook gunman Adam Lanza’s mother from buying guns unless the parents of children with Autism-like symptoms are to be banned from owning firearms.
... and then immediately follows with a "solution":
What we are talking about now is trying to keep guns out of the hands of common criminals. This is obviously a worthy and important goal, although the most direct means of doing it — stop-and-frisk policing in areas where gun crime is most likely to occur — is anathema to the same people who say we have to do everything we can to save even one life.
Well, sure. Areas where crime is more likely ... like in the first grade classrooms of Sandy Hook Elementary School.

Come on, Rich, you and your kind just need to sing it out, loud and proud: The only kind of "gun control" you're interested in involves stripping poor, black men of their Fourth Amendment rights. Which, come to think of it, the founding fathers would be totally down with ...

Originally posted to Barbara Morrill on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 09:55 AM PDT.

Also republished by Shut Down the NRA, Repeal or Amend the Second Amendment (RASA), and Daily Kos.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Stop and Frisk for an assault Weapon? (13+ / 0-)

    Where are they concealing it?

    I want 1 less Tiny Coffin, Why Don't You? Support The President's Gun Violence Plan.

    by JML9999 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 10:09:19 AM PDT

  •  Now if you really want to see something stupid.... (5+ / 0-)

    Redstate has a FP article called "The only gun infographic you'll ever need". Here is a link to where it came from and the numbers this idiot used. You have to scroll down to see the graphic. Mind numbing.

    Explained: Gun Facts You Need To Know

    I especially love the great company the USA is keeping regarding the number of guns owned and the top 25 countries gun murder rates. So yea, maybe he is right. This is the only infographic we need to point out the gun stupidity.

    if a habitat is flooded, the improvement for target fishes increases by an infinite percentage...because a habitat suitability index that is even a tiny fraction of 1 is still infinitely higher than zero, which is the suitability of dry land to fishes.

    by mrsgoo on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 10:27:21 AM PDT

    •  They like the crayon 72 point font with no links. (3+ / 0-)

      guns are fun v. hey buddy, watch what you are doing -- which side are you on?

      by 88kathy on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 10:41:51 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  This infographic is supposed to be authoritative? (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      MPociask

      To whom?  The statistics used by the author (college kid) bear no resemblance to the conclusions he's drawn.  It's as though he cites authoritative sources to prove points he's just made up, and they don't.  Apparently it's perfect for the readers of Redstate.  I doubt any of them even looked at the sources of the data the kid cites, the methodology used to collect it or the differences between flat numbers and ratios.  The report is a mess.

      "In this world of sin and sorrow there is always something to be thankful for; as for me, I rejoice that I am not a Republican." - H. L. Mencken

      by SueDe on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:43:42 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Who are these people? I need to be done (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    NormAl1792, Glen The Plumber

    talking to them.

    Smarts, doesn't it? (0+ / 0-)
    Knowing you're going to lose.  You should worry more about Congress preempting your pitiful gains at the state level than push polling yourself to complete defeat.

    guns are fun v. hey buddy, watch what you are doing -- which side are you on?

    by 88kathy on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 10:38:39 AM PDT

    •  You think the gloating about (0+ / 0-)

      "gun owners are old white dudes and soon enough will die off that we can ignore them" is more attractive?

      Your end of the Constitution is sinking.

      by happymisanthropy on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 12:59:00 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  the old white dudes with dementia fast approaching (0+ / 0-)

        concern me. Unfortunately getting older doesn't make you smarter or happier. There is nothing in place to take away the gun when grandpa starts to slip. True they are going to take his gun.

        So I'm not gloating, I think that is far from what I am doing.

        guns are fun v. hey buddy, watch what you are doing -- which side are you on?

        by 88kathy on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 01:12:42 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  I'm sure I speak for my fellow autistics (21+ / 0-)

    when I say "Fuck you, Rich Lowry".

    Adam Lanza didn't kill 20 children because of autism. He did it because he was a violent psychopath. The two conditions do not correlate and have basically nothing to do with each other. This is just more of the "stigmatize the weird kid" BS that NRA apologists have been trotting out since Columbine.

    Visit Lacking All Conviction, your patch of grey on those too-sunny days.

    by eataTREE on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 10:55:41 AM PDT

    •  Well said. They are not the same thing at all. (5+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      eataTREE, ColoTim, hawkseye, MPociask, Matt Z

      But they always want to stick it to the people who are different than they are. I guess they need to identify somebody they can look down upon.

      I don't know how many times I've heard "it's not a gun problem, it's a mental health problem" lately. When I'm in a position where I am able to respond, I find myself usually saying like "Yes, there is a mental health component to this. Of course, mental health changes with any individual over time -  perhaps it would be a good idea to require annual professional mental health exams of all gun owners." (Personally, I think that is a good idea, but it also shuts up the assholes)

      "labor is superior of capital and deserves much the higher consideration,"... Theodore Roosevelt

      by HugoDog on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:05:13 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  The "mental health" rhetoric also ascribes (6+ / 0-)

        to psychiatry powers that it simply doesn't have -- for instance the power to predict who will or will not become violent, or the power to eradicate destructive impulses in those who suffer from them.

        Yes, if you are mentally ill, your prognosis is better and your chance of harming yourself or others is lower if you are under treatment -- lower, but not zero. This is even assuming treatment will be sought in the first place: for some the onset of psychosis is sudden, and others are able to conceal their symptoms until they have completely broken from reality.

        I entirely agree with the proposition that our mental health care infrastructure is in a dismal state and needs great improvement, but I seriously doubt that doing so would curtail mass shootings by very much given the factors I've mentioned. If you want these events to stop happening, the only way for sure is to restrict access to the kinds of firearms that make them possible.

        Visit Lacking All Conviction, your patch of grey on those too-sunny days.

        by eataTREE on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:16:20 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  I have to agree with you. (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Dogs are fuzzy, eataTREE

          But I also think that having someone who has ready access to a thing or things that were designed primarily to kill "check in" with a shrink once and a while is a good thing. If for no other reason than it might cut down on the number of successful suicide attempts.

          "labor is superior of capital and deserves much the higher consideration,"... Theodore Roosevelt

          by HugoDog on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:59:45 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  What, you're not in favor... (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          snowwoman

          Of mandatory monthly check ups with your local federally paid psychologist, and random bloodtests of all medicated patients to make sure they are taking their meds?  Because that's where the "fix the mental health system" road ends.  

          And of course the people who say that mocked the likes of Dennis Kucinich, who was one of the only Democrats running for universal health care that included mental and dental.  

    •  was he ever even diagnosed (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      eataTREE

      as autistic? I hadn't heard that.

  •  I take issue with using examples (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    RichM, high uintas, andalusi, snowwoman

    like the Newtown or Columbine or Denver theatre murderers as some excuse to take the rights away from anybody. Lowry's dog-whistling just makes this more unpalatable.

    LBJ, Lady Bird, Van Cliburn, Ike, Ann Richards, Barbara Jordan, Molly Ivins, Sully Sullenburger, Drew Brees: Texas is NO Bush League!

    by BlackSheep1 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 10:59:54 AM PDT

  •  Which is more likely to work? (8+ / 0-)

    Stopping gun sales to criminals at the point of sale, with a background check

    OR

    Not having universal background checks, allowing criminals to buy guns (either themselves or through straw purchases), AND THEN having pervasive stop and frisks... what, country wide I guess?  How many police officers is it going to take to keep guns out of the wrong hands?  How much would that cost, as opposed to, you know, an instant electronic check against a federal database?  

  •  So when were they going to stop and (7+ / 0-)

    frisk a white guy walking in a small Connecticut town?

    Stopping and frisking young men of color in urban areas would have prevented Sandy Hook?

    WTF is this guy talking about?

    Perhaps there is difficulty crafting a law to keep a "sane" woman from buying guns that her disturbed son could than steal and use to murder people.

    That doesn't mean you don't enact any laws, laws that keep guns away from insane folks, or people who commit domestic violence, etc.  

    And it doesn't mean you don't enact laws that limit the number of bullets that disturbed son could shoot in one 30-second burst.  Or put limits on the type of gun people can own.

    As others have mentioned, Lanza didn't have that gun hidden in a "suspicious bulge".  He walked in fully armed and all arms in full sight.  

    Stop and frisk is irrelevant in any instance, and jeebus, how many fucking assault rifles have been found as a result of a stop and frisk?  Sheez.

    Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are the change that we seek. Barack Obama

    by delphine on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:06:25 AM PDT

  •  I still say get a bunch of DFHs, Yippies, Panthers (7+ / 0-)

    and La Raza together, and show up at one of these Bagger type events and exercise our second Amendment rights.  And keep doing it.  Let's see what kind of gun control passes.

    "Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." --M. L. King "You can't fix stupid" --Ron White -6.00, -5.18

    by zenbassoon on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:09:46 AM PDT

  •  The gun craziness (7+ / 0-)

    While I can appreciate the need to limit assault weapons and the like, statistice from just about everywhere show that the vast majority of gun crimes (something like 90%+) are done by people with HANDGUNS, and not assault type weapons.  The assault weapons get the headlines because they do so much damage so quickly, but it is the illegal handguns that no one is talking about that do most of the killing.

    Buying a gun should be like buying a car.  You have to register it, licence the operator, and have insurance.  And most of that gets renewed yearly.  Whats the problem with that?

    •  It might prevent someone from getting a gun (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      eataTREE, RichM, MPociask, Matt Z

      and for that reason, a hypothetical, we should allow any/all people to have a right to unfettered gun purchases.  I think that's their logic, but I've not really understood this whole gun fetish.

    •  I see mass shootings as a separate (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Dogs are fuzzy

      problem from gun crime in general. Dealing with the latter will require addressing the issue of handguns, about which I'm inclined to say, one step at a time. The mass shootings really are due to the easy availability of AR-15's, and changing that would lower their incidence without changing the overall gun crime rate all that much.

      Visit Lacking All Conviction, your patch of grey on those too-sunny days.

      by eataTREE on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:35:04 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  It's more than that (5+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      RichM, eataTREE, MPociask, snowwoman, WakeUpNeo

      I am a gun owner. It's crazy to say that you, me or anyone needs rapid fire weapons and high capacity magazines, whether registered or not. You are right that most killings are done with handguns, and probably are unplanned, but quite a few policemen and law enforcement people, like Texas DA McClelland, who had been carrying a gun since the first prosecutor was murdered, have been killed with military weapons. Police are too often outgunned. If our government lets people carry heavy artillery, we hasten the break up of our country.

      Many of the gun nuts anticipate a war between blacks and whites, the more we let them have guns, the more likely that they take actions trying to provoke this war, just as the Confederacy fired on Fort Sumter rather than waiting for the Union to make up its mind in April, 1861.

  •  dog whistle (0+ / 0-)

    woof woof on that one.

  •  Yet another victory (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    eataTREE, Nance

    for conservative, white men unable to deal with male menopause.

    "Work for something because it is good, not just because it stands a chance to succeed." -- Vaclav Havel

    by greendem on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:16:23 AM PDT

  •  It isn't just Rich Lowry and his kind (0+ / 0-)

    of hypocrits that want to strip the 4th Amendment rights of the 99%. It's also the hypocrisy of some far left ideaologues that would like to see this happen.

    Sure there aren't as many hypocrits on the left as there are on the right. But give me a minute to do some research on the Internet and I'll come up with some. We can start with Mayor Michael Bloomberg.

    How about this one, http://www.sfgate.com/...

    Knowledge is Power. Ignorance is not bliss, it is suffering.

    by harris stein on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:17:31 AM PDT

  •  He seems disappointed that the US isn't #1 (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    eataTREE

    in the number of gun murders per capita when he says that the US isn't even in the top 25.

    As is said above, I'd love to see his graphics when he talks about all murders committed with guns, as opposed to focusing just on rifles.  Seems to me he'd be in favor then of restricting hand guns before restricting rifles.

  •  I have a dear sweet loved one in my family (9+ / 0-)

    who has schizophrenia, so I realize I might be overly sensitive about the use of this word. But I just do not understand the reference in the title to this diary.

    Having two opposing ideas in one's head is not what schizophrenia is, if that is what the diarist is referring to.

    "Seneca Falls and Selma and Stonewall" - President Obama, January 20, 2013

    by savano66 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:25:56 AM PDT

    •  I have two schizophrenics in my family (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      savano66, andalusi, WakeUpNeo

      mr.u's brother and my step sister. The former was deadly dangerous when he was in his twenties to early thirties. He almost succeeded in stabbing mr.u with a butcher knife and stalked me. He was finally institutionalized after beating his dad half to death and trying to set the family home on fire with his mom locked in it.

      He broke out and returned here to kill his infant son, he didn't get to because he actually went to the cops and explained that he had to kill his son because the child's soul had be kidnapped. That didn't work out so well for him.

      My step sis is a sweet and loving person who really has only ever been a danger to herself. The voices convinced her to stop her meds every time they started working and she lost everything she had.

      Both of them are much older now, this horrible disease has run it's course and robbed them of any positive and meaningful thing in their lives. It's so sad.

      "The scientific nature of the ordinary man is to go on out and do the best you can." John Prine

      by high uintas on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 12:47:59 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  I'm schizophrenic and I don't get it either (0+ / 0-)

      Not all of us are violent or have voices telling us to kill or maim people.

      And we sail and we sail and we never see land, just the rum in the bottle and a pipe in my hand...

      by Mortifyd on Fri Apr 05, 2013 at 05:14:11 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Because Black youth perpetrated Sandy Hook? (7+ / 0-)
    although the most direct means of doing it — stop-and-frisk policing in areas where gun crime is most likely to occur
    What a festering colostomy bag.

    "Til you're so fucking crazy you can't follow their rules" John Lennon - Working Class Hero

    by Horace Boothroyd III on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:31:33 AM PDT

  •  Um... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    MPociask

    'Stop and Frisk' only works if, you know, carrying a gun is ILLEGAL in that area.  Check me if I'm wrong, but the NRA wants everyone to be able to carry guns anywhere they see fit: schools, courts, capital buildings, etc.  So, how is stopping and frisking going to work unless carrying a gun is illegal?  Is Lowery suggesting people carry papers saying, "I'm not a criminal" now?

    'Where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost' - Ronald Reagan, Communist

    by RichM on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:41:19 AM PDT

  •  How unhelpful. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    eataTREE, MPociask, Nance

    Unnnhhhh guess what? Adam Lanza was not a "common criminal" until AFTER his murder spree.

    Adam Lanza was a law abiding gun owner. Just the type of swell guy we are all supposed to not have to worry about or back ground check.

    Yes, thank you for your heady insight in to how to control gun violence Mr Lowry. You're ok with racial profiling and hassling pedestrians, but known gun owners???...oh my word no - how silly. That's a violation of their rights !

    Dickwad

    -7.5 -7.28, A carrot is as close as a rabbit gets to a diamond.-Don Van Vliet

    by Blueslide on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 11:49:18 AM PDT

  •  Yes (0+ / 0-)

    let's focus on common criminals by making sure they can still buy guns at gun shows and make it as hard as possible for the ATF to determine the origins of guns used in crimes.  That'll teach 'em.  Oh, and none of the recent mass murderers had criminal records.  And since no legislation will prevent all mass shootings, let's not even bother.

  •  During his foray into hypotheticals (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    snowwoman

    Mr. Lowry ignores a glaring fact. Lanza's mother was only legally permitted to own the weapon her son used due to Congress allowing the assault rifle ban to expire back in Dubya's tenure. Had this ban been continued it is highly unlikely that she would have purchased one, being a law abiding gun owner, by all accounts.

  •  The founding fathers WERE down with it... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    jds1978

    That's why we have the 2nd Amendment to begin with. To protect the rights of armed slave-drivers down south.

  •  The NRA is a criminal organization, (0+ / 0-)

    and should be charged with racketeering.

    I traded it in for a whole 'nother world...a pirate flag and an island girl.

    by glb3 on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 12:37:41 PM PDT

  •  Founding fathers would be totally down with that (0+ / 0-)

    Had been no slavery, there would have been no 2nd amendment because the second amendment was ratified to preserve slavery Thom Hartmann, Truthout

    ◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘◘ If you took each and every evangelical and laid them end to end, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised. ~ With apologies to Dorothy Parker 1893 – 1967

    by StrictlyPeter on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 01:03:49 PM PDT

    •  Sadly, Hartmann Is Blatantly Dishonest (0+ / 0-)

      He conveniently ignores that America was involved in what was a French-English world war,

      http://en.wikipedia.org/...

      The French and Indian War (1754–1763) is the American name for the North American theater of the Seven Years' War, and it was an especially intense brutal fight on America's western frontier (NY, OH, VA)

      There’s always free cheddar in a mousetrap, baby

      by bernardpliers on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 03:15:40 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  And He Screws Up His Own Point (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      maracucho

      .....by citing years we were at war with France/Canada

      laws were passed in 1755 and 1757
      instead of referring to the year the Bill of Rights was written, 1789

      There’s always free cheddar in a mousetrap, baby

      by bernardpliers on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 03:35:25 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Obviously (0+ / 0-)

    If a background check would not have prevented Sandy Hook, it follows, logically, that background checks would not prevent any gun related crime.

    "Mr. President, I'm not saying we wouldn't get our hair mussed." General Buck Turgidson

    by muledriver on Thu Apr 04, 2013 at 01:09:33 PM PDT

  •  Barb - I don't think you should (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Mortifyd

    be using the word "schizophrenic" like that. There are people who really get aofended by stuff like that.

  •  Meany government taking my guns! (0+ / 0-)

    Now go and frish those people, government!

    Asshole idiots.

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